Cowden Cowboy Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 I've looked at what you've been saying and I do think you're sticking up for it, some of your responses to the points made earlier on seemed bizarre to me tbh. The bit about players being inconvenienced with travelling or whatever to play for loan clubs, come on now. We had a player on loan from Dumbarton a few year ago and I remembered being told by someone at the club he had commuted from Lochgilphead one day to sit on the bench for a midweek game. Commuting/travelling etc can't be a reason these are supposed to be professional players it's part of the job. Surely putting them through that travelling is part of their learning curve and what makes them as people too. Getting driven about in big coaches with their pals etc boys day out is hardly going to bring out any character or drive in themselves. That was just one wee thing I noticed amongst many more that really annoyed me because there are so many players at PT level who do real travelling and real journeys for their love of playing. We have had Ricky Little for 6 years now and he commutes from Stevenson. We have a young guy who lives and works in Montrose he's been on loan to Albion Rovers commuting down there twice a week for training. Surely the best way to develop young players is to put them under that pressure. You hear it all the time, young guys going into dressing rooms with PT players playing contract to contract where it really means something for them. This whole cooshty roll up together and turn up to lower league grounds in your big coach to play PT guys as part of your development when there's absolutely no pressure on the outcome at all who is that helping??? What is there to gain from it?This is way OTT - those downsides I quoted should be considered primarily as being cumulative not in isolation. Developing young players by making them experience more travelling that is a novel coaching idea - I can just see Dick at Arbroath taking a session on rural bus timetables and the young footballer 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowden Cowboy Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 Yes, I am sticking up for something - thoughtful analysis and debate. Bless your hackneyed view 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jan Vojáček Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 1 hour ago, 1320Lichtie said: The bit about players being inconvenienced with travelling or whatever to play for loan clubs, come on now. We had a player on loan from Dumbarton a few year ago and I remembered being told by someone at the club he had commuted from Lochgilphead one day to sit on the bench for a midweek game. I've no idea if he lived in Lochgilphead at the time, but Donald McCallum is from (and lived in) Campbeltown - which is an absolutely ridiculous distance away from pretty much anywhere, never mind Arbroath (just over four and a half hours according to Google)! He's not playing at all now at the moment, which is a shame. I had really high hopes when he was scoring for fun for our youth teams, and then looked the part in a few sub appearances. Just seemed to drift out the team, and then make no impact at all with you guys. Anyway, back to the matter in hand, Colt teams can get in the sea and I totally agree with the rest of your post. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Moonster Posted December 14, 2018 Share Posted December 14, 2018 13 hours ago, Cowden Cowboy said: Yes, I am sticking up for something - thoughtful analysis and debate. Bless your hackneyed view tHoUgHtfUl AnAlYsIs AnD dEbAte... 16 hours ago, Cowden Cowboy said: Well I am not sticking up for this - so I have no idea why you are banging your head unless to knock some sense into it. Spot on, CC. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1320Lichtie Posted December 14, 2018 Share Posted December 14, 2018 I've no idea if he lived in Lochgilphead at the time, but Donald McCallum is from (and lived in) Campbeltown - which is an absolutely ridiculous distance away from pretty much anywhere, never mind Arbroath (just over four and a half hours according to Google)! He's not playing at all now at the moment, which is a shame. I had really high hopes when he was scoring for fun for our youth teams, and then looked the part in a few sub appearances. Just seemed to drift out the team, and then make no impact at all with you guys. Anyway, back to the matter in hand, Colt teams can get in the sea and I totally agree with the rest of your post.I may have been getting confused with the location but it was him I was referring to, all to come on for 20 minutes in a 2-1 home defeat from Annan in January. That's some trek that, wow 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1320Lichtie Posted December 14, 2018 Share Posted December 14, 2018 This is way OTT - those downsides I quoted should be considered primarily as being cumulative not in isolation. Developing young players by making them experience more travelling that is a novel coaching idea - I can just see Dick at Arbroath taking a session on rural bus timetables and the young footballerYou've completely missed my point. That kind of stuff toughens them up and gives them experience of what PT football is like and that extra drive to make it at full time. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowden Cowboy Posted December 14, 2018 Share Posted December 14, 2018 1 hour ago, 1320Lichtie said: You've completely missed my point. That kind of stuff toughens them up and gives them experience of what PT football is like and that extra drive to make it at full time. No I haven't - but you completely missed my original point which was when I was asked to specifically list downsides and that these downsides should not be viewed in isolation but collectively. You can learn important lessons from many 'downside' experiences but clubs loaning players out don't really think extra travelling is a key aim in player development - more its an inconvenience so a minor downside. Again you highlight the part time players who are dedicated and accept the downsides of part time because they love playing. They would be good examples but on the other hand there are part time players who are on the way down and just looking for a last payday who might not set such a positive personal example. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1320Lichtie Posted December 14, 2018 Share Posted December 14, 2018 No I haven't - but you completely missed my original point which was when I was asked to specifically list downsides and that these downsides should not be viewed in isolation but collectively. You can learn important lessons from many 'downside' experiences but clubs loaning players out don't really think extra travelling is a key aim in player development - more its an inconvenience so a minor downside. Again you highlight the part time players who are dedicated and accept the downsides of part time because they love playing. They would be good examples but on the other hand there are part time players who are on the way down and just looking for a last payday who might not set such a positive personal example. I never said it was a key aim!!! What are you on about, and my point is that exactly, travelling is a massive inconvenience for so many PT players, they don't get fancy coaches and hotels. That kind of experience can give someone that extra drive and determination. And no matter what you think every part time player is dedicated, especially the older ones who have more responsibilities in other areas of their lives. You can't stay at that level unless you put the work in, you wouldn't travel up to Elgin or down to Stranraer on your Saturdays and make 50/100/150 mile round trips to training twice a week. You wouldn't win a contract at this level if you weren't dedicated you'd be found out straight away. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowden Cowboy Posted December 14, 2018 Share Posted December 14, 2018 I never said it was a key aim!!! What are you on about, and my point is that exactly, travelling is a massive inconvenience for so many PT players, they don't get fancy coaches and hotels. That kind of experience can give someone that extra drive and determination. And no matter what you think every part time player is dedicated, especially the older ones who have more responsibilities in other areas of their lives. You can't stay at that level unless you put the work in, you wouldn't travel up to Elgin or down to Stranraer on your Saturdays and make 50/100/150 mile round trips to training twice a week. You wouldn't win a contract at this level if you weren't dedicated you'd be found out straight away.It isn't a key aim you say but you wasted a sizeable post on the subject! Most part time players are very dedicated but you are talking mince when you make a claim they all are. Sign a contract for a season and pick up a last pay cheque isn't unusual, or there is the old pals act where a contract is given to someone who it turns out can't cut the mustard any more or is 'plagued by injuries'. Some are Jack the lads with no responsibilities whatever. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bold Rover Posted December 14, 2018 Share Posted December 14, 2018 Thread ruined. Unfollows. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UsedToGoToCentralPark Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 None of this pish is relevant to trapdoor watch 2018/19 is it? 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowden Cowboy Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 Yes if introduced for next season would be very relevant 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowden Cowboy Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 Couldn’t care less about your home made views as to the parameters of this thread. If this came in for next season it obviously impacts on the trapdoor position -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UsedToGoToCentralPark Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 Couldn’t care less about your home made views as to the parameters of this thread. If this came in for next season it obviously impacts on the trapdoor position The thread title is 2018/19 this means season not years. The teams who could be part of any trapdoor are already established as the season is underway.Maybe trapdoor watch 2019/20 can have your thoughts instead. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowden Cowboy Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 18 minutes ago, UsedToGoToCentralPark said: The thread title is 2018/19 this means season not years. The teams who could be part of any trapdoor are already established as the season is underway. Maybe trapdoor watch 2019/20 can have your thoughts instead. And what do they fall through this 2018/19 trapdoor into? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UsedToGoToCentralPark Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 And what do they fall through this 2018/19 trapdoor into? That would depend on their location would it not? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowden Cowboy Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 27 minutes ago, UsedToGoToCentralPark said: 37 minutes ago, Cowden Cowboy said: And what do they fall through this 2018/19 trapdoor into? That would depend on their location would it not? No not if this change is agreed 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UsedToGoToCentralPark Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 No not if this change is agreedThanks just refreshed my memory by going back on this thread.League 3 looks like a stupid idea. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Minertaur Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 Thoroughly enjoying how much CC can antagonise people on here To get it back on topic the Lowland League: East Kilbride 35 (played 14) BSC Glagsow 31 (15) Kelty 30 (14) Spartans 26 (14) No surprise that there were numerous postponed games at the weekend but wins for East Kilbride (3-1 over Whitehill) and BSC (6-1 over Uni of Stirling) sees Kelty fall to 3rd and 5 points behind top. Highland League: Cove 48 (played 17) Fraserburgh 46 (19) Inverurie 43 (21) Brora 42 (17) Cove have won it basically 2 points ahead with 2 games in hand but did lose 1-0 to Fraserburgh just a couple of weeks ago. You'll all be SHOCKED to hear that it was an unjust loss.... http://www.coverangersfc.com/cove-drop-first-points-of-campaign-in-an-afternoon-full-of-confusion-and-frustration-in-fraserburgh/ Quote COVE Rangers saw their unbeaten run in the Breedon Highland League ended in a highly controversial battle with Broch at Bellslea. They fell behind after just 29 seconds, to a strike from Scott Barbour, but battled back to dominate a second half that was packed with debatable decisions made by the match officials that caused frustration and confusion in both camps. Cove midfielder Blair Yule was sent off with 23 minutes to go after getting a second caution .... but that only came after Broch striker Paul Campbell should have picked up his second booking. It would have been interesting to see what the outcome was had it been the home side and not Cove, who were seeking a 17th successive league win, who had to see out the game with 10 men. Cove were also upset when referee Dan McFarlane changed his mind after awarding them a penalty on a crazy afternoon that also included Stuart McKenzie making his fourth spot kick save of the campaign and Cove manager John Sheran being banished to the stand. Credit to them though for using the word 'pumped' in a match report though. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onecowden Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 Thoroughly enjoying how much CC can antagonise people on here To get it back on topic the Lowland League: East Kilbride 35 (played 14) BSC Glagsow 31 (15) Kelty 30 (14) Spartans 26 (14) No surprise that there were numerous postponed games at the weekend but wins for East Kilbride (3-1 over Whitehill) and BSC (6-1 over Uni of Stirling) sees Kelty fall to 3rd and 5 points behind top. Highland League: Cove 48 (played 17) Fraserburgh 46 (19) Inverurie 43 (21) Brora 42 (17) Cove have won it basically 2 points ahead with 2 games in hand but did lose 1-0 to Fraserburgh just a couple of weeks ago. You'll all be SHOCKED to hear that it was an unjust loss....http://www.coverangersfc.com/cove-drop-first-points-of-campaign-in-an-afternoon-full-of-confusion-and-frustration-in-fraserburgh/ COVE Rangers saw their unbeaten run in the Breedon Highland League ended in a highly controversial battle with Broch at Bellslea. They fell behind after just 29 seconds, to a strike from Scott Barbour, but battled back to dominate a second half that was packed with debatable decisions made by the match officials that caused frustration and confusion in both camps. Cove midfielder Blair Yule was sent off with 23 minutes to go after getting a second caution .... but that only came after Broch striker Paul Campbell should have picked up his second booking. It would have been interesting to see what the outcome was had it been the home side and not Cove, who were seeking a 17th successive league win, who had to see out the game with 10 men. Cove were also upset when referee Dan McFarlane changed his mind after awarding them a penalty on a crazy afternoon that also included Stuart McKenzie making his fourth spot kick save of the campaign and Cove manager John Sheran being banished to the stand. Credit to them though for using the word 'pumped' in a match report though.It really is bizarre. Every time they lose (I do concede it’s not often) they blame officialdom with great enthusiasm. Awful people. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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