Stenhousemuir -vs- Dumbarton

[Frank Quitely]

22 minutes ago, DumbartonTheSons said:

 

I get that injuries have played a part in the selection issue for Aitken, but still, Forbes should be one of the ones that should be starting pretty much every week, and he could have been, if Aitken realised his value and was able to identify a system which benefits his players' talents.

 

Sadly, or perhaps shockingly, Ross Forbes is looking like one of the most unfit players I've ever seen start a season with Dumbarton.  There is no doubt that the guy has a very decent pedigree but the current reality is that the ball stops dead every time he is in possession and even in the time he's been involved so far he must have fallen over his own feet about half a dozen times.

Football talent isn't enough without at least a reasonable level of fitness.

[DumbartonTheSons]

Sadly, or perhaps shockingly, Ross Forbes is looking like one of the most unfit players I've ever seen start a season with Dumbarton.  There is no doubt that the guy has a very decent pedigree but the current reality is that the ball stops dead every time he is in possession and even in the time he's been involved so far he must have fallen over his own feet about half a dozen times.
Football talent isn't enough without at least a reasonable level of fitness.

I have to disagree. He's not athletic but unfit is inaccurate in my opinion.

He's never been a grafter or a box-to-box player or one who's going to chase. He wasn't in his first spell with us so I see no reason to see why he would be now.

He should be a starter every week as far as I'm concerned and I don't have an issue with his fitness, as some see it. The issue I have is that Aitken has signed him, and not for a pittance it must be said, and he's not picking him. That's my main concern with Forbes.

[Francesc Fabregas]

Sorry lads but at the end of Saturday's match you had a midfield of Ross Forbes and Kyle Hutton, arguably the two least mobile players in the division. I appreciate he wasn't 100 per cent fit but Forbes had been on the field for about 10 minutes and Seb Ross and Kieron Gibbons were gliding past him like he wasn't there.

[albundy]

On paper, Forbes should be a stand out in this league. From my position of ignorance, none of the scenarios regarding Forbes reflect great on the management:
They signed a key player who cannot get 100% fit
They signed a key player who has been allowed to get out of shape
They signed a key player who has managed to pick up an injury

The last one is not a management issue until you factor in aiming for a small squad and then picking up 6/7 injuries in the first few weeks of the season (training/conditioning?) Which is either extremely unlucky or not a coincidence.

[squeezeboxson]

20 hours ago, DumbartonTheSons said:

 

I get that injuries have played a part in the selection issue for Aitken, but still, Forbes should be one of the ones that should be starting pretty much every week, and he could have been, if Aitken realised his value and was able to identify a system which benefits his players' talents.

 

That's your opinion. You're entitled to your opinion. My opinion is that Forbes has been extremely disappointing so far and I'm happy for him to be on the bench. It would appear that Stevie has the same view as I do.

[squeezeboxson]

1 hour ago, albundy said:

On paper, Forbes should be a stand out in this league. From my position of ignorance, none of the scenarios regarding Forbes reflect great on the management:
They signed a key player who cannot get 100% fit
They signed a key player who has been allowed to get out of shape
They signed a key player who has managed to pick up an injury

The last one is not a management issue until you factor in aiming for a small squad and then picking up 6/7 injuries in the first few weeks of the season (training/conditioning?) Which is either extremely unlucky or not a coincidence.

It isn't solely the managers responsibility  to get players fit/sharp. What do you mean by "cannot get 100% fit"?? He signed him and expected him to do some work on his own to get back to full fitness. We train 2/3- days a week and as part time players the guys we have signed need to put in some training outside of the Dumbarton fc training.

[O'Kelly Isley III]

Sorry lads but at the end of Saturday's match you had a midfield of Ross Forbes and Kyle Hutton, arguably the two least mobile players in the division. I appreciate he wasn't 100 per cent fit but Forbes had been on the field for about 10 minutes and Seb Ross and Kieron Gibbons were gliding past him like he wasn't there.

You know, the comments about Dumbarton's performance from Stenny fans here have been respectful, honest and above all bang-on.

I think it's illuminating to hear the view from the other side, but the reality for Sons fans is probably that we'll now have a few weeks of the next game being vital, followed by a series of mediocre performances and results before something or someone finally gives.

[albundy]

It isn't solely the managers responsibility  to get players fit/sharp. What do you mean by "cannot get 100% fit"?? He signed him and expected him to do some work on his own to get back to full fitness. We train 2/3- days a week and as part time players the guys we have signed need to put in some training outside of the Dumbarton fc training.

Exactly what it states, is Forbes carrying a knock or underlying injury which prevents him from training to the max. Was this known about when he signed?

If yes to both, then Aitken has taken a gamble which IMO has already backfired.
If the answer is no, then the question has to be asked why isn't he fit enough?

Most teams in this league get limited time with their players, which btw.. hasn't stopped the likes of forfar, stenny, etc looking much fitter than us.

[squeezeboxson]

30 minutes ago, albundy said:

Exactly what it states, is Forbes carrying a knock or underlying injury which prevents him from training to the max. Was this known about when he signed?

If yes to both, then Aitken has taken a gamble which IMO has already backfired.
If the answer is no, then the question has to be asked why isn't he fit enough?

Most teams in this league get limited time with their players, which btw.. hasn't stopped the likes of forfar, stenny, etc looking much fitter than us.


 

Still don't understand the statement "cannot get fit". What is stopping someone getting fit? I would hazard a guess that he wasn't carrying a knock when signed but the main issue is that to carry out a medical costs money.  I'm not sure how many teams at this level carry out a full medical on every player they sign  but I'd say not many...

Again, why isn't he fit enough? Probably because he isn't putting in the work off the training field. Whilst at training he will be doing the same exercises as everyone else in the squad but when players are part time they have a lot of responsibility themselves to spend some time in the gym or however else they work out.

[albundy]

Still don't understand the statement "cannot get fit". What is stopping someone getting fit? I would hazard a guess that he wasn't carrying a knock when signed but the main issue is that to carry out a medical costs money.  I'm not sure how many teams at this level carry out a full medical on every player they sign  but I'd say not many...
Again, why isn't he fit enough? Probably because he isn't putting in the work off the training field. Whilst at training he will be doing the same exercises as everyone else in the squad but when players are part time they have a lot of responsibility themselves to spend some time in the gym or however else they work out.

Agreed on the players responsibility part, however like it or not, it's the management team that are held accountable for the results.

If a key player is downing tools, again you have to ask why? And how the manager deals with that could well be defining for their tenure.

[squeezeboxson]

21 minutes ago, albundy said:

Agreed on the players responsibility part, however like it or not, it's the management team that are held accountable for the results.

If a key player is downing tools, again you have to ask why? And how the manager deals with that could well be defining for their tenure.
 

If he feels that Forbes isn't in a fit enough or sharp enough condition and he also feels he has given him the chance to prove himself - I'd say the best option is to drop him. 

[Jumbo Muir]

Sadly, or perhaps shockingly, Ross Forbes is looking like one of the most unfit players I've ever seen start a season with Dumbarton.  There is no doubt that the guy has a very decent pedigree but the current reality is that the ball stops dead every time he is in possession and even in the time he's been involved so far he must have fallen over his own feet about half a dozen times.
Football talent isn't enough without at least a reasonable level of fitness.

Jocky Whiteford ?

[The Moonster]

On 05/09/2018 at 12:26, Francesc Fabregas said:

Sorry lads but at the end of Saturday's match you had a midfield of Ross Forbes and Kyle Hutton, arguably the two least mobile players in the division. I appreciate he wasn't 100 per cent fit but Forbes had been on the field for about 10 minutes and Seb Ross and Kieron Gibbons were gliding past him like he wasn't there.

You're better than this sort of judgement, Cesc.