What is the point of Labour ?

[Granny Danger]

Just now, oaksoft said:

It's a bit difficult to justify calling people racists when you then start throwing phrases around like "thick English c***s".

The people in question were thick c***s who happened to be English which was relevant in the context of the discussion.

It doesn’t mean all English people are thick c***s or that all thick c***s are English.

The fact that you’re a thick Scottish c**t proves this point.

 

[DrewDon]

[DukDukGoose]

7 minutes ago, DrewDon said:

Nah, not having that. No way you can say "I don't like the man who's leading the party. Would rather have Boris".

[Fullerene]

1 hour ago, DeeTillEhDeh said:

40 years of lying bullshit in the MSM has a lot to explain for the ingrained attitudes.

There is also the sad reality that when scratch the surface of the working class, particularly in those Northern cities with larger ethnic minority populations, that there is a large number of racists - prepared to swallow the blame johnny foreigner narrative.

Racist might be a bit much.  These are people who think the whole character of place will change if they have too many incomers from other places and by too many I mean one.

I met somebody from the North of England who really resented the idea the people in Britain like a good curry.  

By comparison everybody in Scotland talks about how hot they like it.

[Detournement]

2 minutes ago, Merkland Red said:

Nah, not having that. No way you can say "I don't like the man who's leading the party. Would rather have Boris".

They are treated completely differently in the media.

And it also seems to be the case that a huge number of people in England have a weird kink where they get off on having Old Etonians financially dominate them. It seems strange to us but the idea of having a leader who isn't an arsehole seems to upset some people. They want to be dom'd.

 

[Fullerene]

54 minutes ago, oaksoft said:

People were talking about Brexit and Scottish Independence.

Those were the two massive talking points.

Corbyn made a conscious decision to avoid all of that, because he knew his party and Labour voters were completely split on those two things, and instead talk about the NHS and the re-nationalisation of the things like Royal Mail. The result was that he wasn't talking or apparently listening to working class concerns regarding Brexit.

Corbyn's manifesto could have been written 40 years ago apart from the free broadband offer - hence the reason it was there.

Brexit is a red herring.  An absolutely massive red herring.

[Fullerene]

55 minutes ago, Londonwell said:

Got some real bad news for you if you think Brexit will be over and forgotten about by February...

Are you suggesting Boris Johnson might be telling a fib?

[jamamafegan]

Brilliant summary from Another Angry Voice, worth a read.

[welshbairn]

3 hours ago, NotThePars said:

Stuck the money I got backing SNP to take Dunbartonshire East last night on Rebecca Long-Bailey to be the next leader. Jess Phillips is third favourite which is mental given her popularity is purely media hype.

P.S. Lisa Nandy has come in from 20/1 to 8/1 on some bookies. Skybet still has 16/1.

[doulikefish]

Kier Stamer surely.......but its Labour so it could be anybody [emoji23]

[welshbairn]

12 minutes ago, doulikefish said:

Kier Stamer surely.......but its Labour so it could be anybody

He's no doubt a great lawyer and a decent debater, but he's an awful public speaker. Sounds like a pedantic ticket inspector. Mind you Clement Attlee probably sounded similar. Bookie's favourite. Not sure if being a solid remainer is an advantage anymore.

[doulikefish]

Ive always thought he speaks well in public

He's no doubt a great lawyer and a decent debater, but he's an awful public speaker. Sounds like a pedantic ticket inspector. Mind you Clement Attlee probably sounded similar. Bookie's favourite. Not sure if being a solid remainer is an advantage anymore.

[D Angelo Barksdale]

The reality is that the next leader will have to have a bit of distance from Corbyn.

[Detournement]

When members start highlighting Starmer's record as DPP he will be fucked. Joint Enterprise, Jean Charles De Menzes and Ian Tomlinson means he can't win. You can have a pig as Brexit secretary but not leader.

 

 

[NotThePars]

8 minutes ago, Henderson to deliver ..... said:

The reality is that the next leader will have to have a bit of distance from Corbyn.

 

If the membership holds up then it'll still be someone from the left but if it's Rayner or Long-Bailey then you've got a good socialist candidate who hits all of the pleasure centres in ID pol obsessed liberal's heads.

[D Angelo Barksdale]

5 minutes ago, NotThePars said:

 

If the membership holds up then it'll still be someone from the left but if it's Rayner or Long-Bailey then you've got a good socialist candidate who hits all of the pleasure centres in ID pol obsessed liberal's heads.

I think the membership should hold up tbh and I like Rayner and Long-Bailey well enough. The issue is with optics of Corbyn 'anointing' his successor.

The Labour leader is going to get the shit kicked out of them by the media, regardless of who it is. Less ammo the better imo.

The melts will be smelling blood atm. Is there a path somewhere that sees the key manifesto points and ideals continue with a leader that's perhaps more appealing to the media and the anti Corbyn wing of the party ?

[Detournement]

I don't think he will anoint anyone.

He will eat the shit for the election and stand across from Johnson as he crows about leaving the European Union then the new leader can take over with less pressure.

[NotThePars]

The Opinium research seems to suggest that Corbynism without Corbyn is viable but it has to be fought for. The optics of having Rayner or Long-Bailey as leader would be much better than having, say, Emily Thornberry. I say we give it to Phillips though, I want to know what she believes in apart from herself.

[Guest Bob Mahelp]

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/dec/13/corbynism-labour-left-party

I detest Labour, but it's truly astounding the steps they've taken to commit political suicide over the last 4 years. 

What is almost as astounding is that some Labour supporters are demanding more of the same......a commitment to some kind of left-wing utopia that as been utterly and completely rejected by the UK electorate. 

There are many reasons why the UK now has the most extreme, right-wing government in history, but the main one is surely the vacuum created by the incompetence of Labour which allowed the Tory khunts to step right in. 

Edited December 13, 2019 by Bob Mahelp

[Granny Danger]

31 minutes ago, Bob Mahelp said:

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/dec/13/corbynism-labour-left-party

I detest Labour, but it's truly astounding the steps they've taken to commit political suicide over the last 4 years. 

What is almost as astounding is that some Labour supporters are demanding more of the same......a commitment to some kind of left-wing utopia that as been utterly and completely rejected by the UK electorate. 

There are many reasons why the UK now has the most extreme, right-wing government in history, but the main one is surely the vacuum created by the incompetence of Labour which allowed the Tory khunts to step right in. 

There’s a massive gulf between general incompetence, terrible electoral strategy and poor leadership on the one hand and radical policies on the other.

All the fruitcakes I’ve seen on TV or heard on the radio saying they didn’t like Corbyn said nothing about Labour’s policies on, for example, nationalisation of key strategic industries.

Of course the reason for that might be that, at least in part, they are brain dead c***s who have been absorbing the MSM’s message about Corbyn and are simply regurgitating it and couldn’t tell you what Labour’s policy on anything was.