Jump to content
Pyramidic

WoSFL Pyramid Deadline - SJFA or Club led?

Recommended Posts

And that could be difficult, given that historically they haven't even managed to produce a fixture list.

That plus one of the contenders for the job appears quite anti-pyramid from their twitter feed at least.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17 minutes ago, Jason King said:

The PWG "minutes" that have been posted on here essentially said that the Juniors wouldn't be joining the pyramid unless the fixtures issue was resolved.

Fixtures, registrations, disciplinary matters etc are in my view ancillaries that the SFA should take a strong role in sorting out - no messing about.

Strong leadership from the major player - the SFA - is so important in achieving a well-structured and long-lasting Pyramid.

The WRJFA have obviously been struggling admin wise for various reasons previously reported.  Surely the SFA could provide us with support/requirements for leagues that struggle to provide a basic fixture list and to help overcome issues such as national cup fixture clashes?

Edited by Pyramidic

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Fixtures, registrations, disciplinary matters etc are in my view ancillaries that the SFA should take a strong role in sorting out - no messing about.
Strong leadership from the major player - the SFA - is so important in achieving a well-structured and long-lasting Pyramid.
The WRJFA have obviously been struggling admin wise for various reasons previously reported.  Surely the SFA could provide us with support/requirements for leagues that struggle to provide a basic fixture list and to help overcome issues such as national cup fixture clashes?

But the counter argument we’ve seen on here is protectionism of the junior ‘culture’ so with that mentality from many of the most hostile towards the pyramid how do we overcome it, move wholesale (whilst fitting in new applicants who may leapfrog some junior clubs) into a new association?
Surely the best outcome is a split, that way the WRJFA remains at a manageable size and a new association can move forward with those who wish to join the pyramid, keeping the door open for any future clubs to come over also?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 minutes ago, Pyramidic said:

Fixtures, registrations, disciplinary matters etc are in my view ancillaries that the SFA should take a strong role in sorting out - no messing about.

Strong leadership from the major player - the SFA - is so important in achieving a well-structured and long-lasting Pyramid.

The WRJFA have obviously been struggling admin wise for various reasons previously reported.  Surely the SFA could provide us with support/requirements for leagues that struggle to provide a basic fixture list and to help overcome national cup fixture clashes?

I would assume the EoSFL would provide support to a new WoSFL until it gets established.

For the WRJFA to enter the Pyramid wholesale instead and become the WoSFL, they would need to break away from the SJFA anyway as they would need to align their rules and procedures to that of the EoSFL and SoSFL, eg the SFA will deal with their disciplinary matters along with already dealing with registrations and referee appointments. They would also need to commit to providing a Champion by end of April for play-off purposes, and that would require a fixture list and overhaul of cups.  Is that really going to happen, particularly as has been mentioned that those who are up for election for the Secretary position appear to not be very pro-Pyramid?

As has been mentioned already, there are plenty of clubs who want to remain “loyal” to the SJFA, but that is incompatible to entering the Pyramid.

Edited by Burnie_man

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
31 minutes ago, Burnie_man said:

I would assume the EoSFL would provide support to a new WoSFL until it gets established.

For the WRJFA to enter the Pyramid wholesale instead and become the WoSFL, they would need to break away from the SJFA anyway as they would need to align their rules and procedures to that of the EoSFL and SoSFL, eg the SFA will deal with their disciplinary matters along with already dealing with registrations and referee appointments. They would also need to commit to providing a Champion by end of April for play-off purposes, and that would require a fixture list and overhaul of cups.  Is that really going to happen, particularly as has been mentioned that those who are up for election for the Secretary position appear to not be very pro-Pyramid?

As has been mentioned already, there are plenty of clubs who want to remain “loyal” to the SJFA, but that is incompatible to entering the Pyramid.

I have a lot of time for the comments of Burnie_man and others above. I feel that no stone should be left unturned by the SFA to formally move all the West Region clubs (and their league structure) as a package into the new WoSL for 2019/20.  Now is the time to engage and move forward. The alternative is acrimony and divorce which will involve dissolving a superb new four tier pyramid. For me "a harmonious approach" is common sense and fresh deadlines for the completion of fixture lists / promotion/relegation to the LL will need to be introduced as a matter of course.

There will be issues of new applicants and the SoSL for the SFA to sort out in due course and perhaps in time integration/links between the WoSL and SoSL.

The starting point in my view should be a firm deadline set by the SFA for the formation of the new  WoSL.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
55 minutes ago, Pyramidic said:

 

The WRJFA have obviously been struggling admin wise for various reasons previously reported.  Surely the SFA could provide us with support/requirements for leagues that struggle to provide a basic fixture list and to help overcome issues such as national cup fixture clashes?

What sort of support do you have in mind? All you need is a sensible, organised individual with a pad, a pencil and a diary.

The only potential national cup clashes will be with the Scottish Cup. Those will be few, and the dates known in advance.

Edited by Stag Nation

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, Pyramidic said:

I have a lot of time for the comments of Burnie_man and others above. I feel that no stone should be left unturned by the SFA to formally move all the West Region clubs (and their league structure) as a package into the new WoSL for 2019/20.  Now is the time to engage and move forward. The alternative is acrimony and divorce which will involve dissolving a superb new four tier pyramid. For me "a harmonious approach" is common sense and fresh deadlines for the completion of fixture lists / promotion/relegation to the LL will need to be introduced as a matter of course.

There will be issues of new applicants and the SoSL for the SFA to sort out in due course and perhaps in time integration/links between the WoSL and SoSL.

The starting point in my view should be a firm deadline set by the SFA for the formation of the new  WoSL.

The support from the SFA, along with the EoSFL, is to set-up a new WoSFL for ALL clubs in that region wanting to join the Pyramid.  That is what was discussed at the last PWG.  Those who don't remain with the SJFA.

Nobody will be setting deadlines, and it's upto the WRJFA/SJFA to come to the table willing to compromise if they want to move en-masse and therein lies the problem.  IMO there are far too many entrenched opinions for that to happen and let's remember, not all clubs would want to join the Pyramid unless it is under the auspices of the SJFA, and that's not going to happen.

Edited by Burnie_man

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Pyramidic said:

I would be interested to know how Khufu2 sees the next 12 months evolving in the West Region?

Can the SJFA Management (TJ) be trusted to broker a good deal for the West Region with the Pyramid Working Group / SFA within an agreed timescale?

What is going to happen Khufu2 if TJ fails - as seems likely?  Are we going to see a migration of clubs to an EoSL run WoSL by the end of January 2019?

What is your solution Khufu2 to avoid this debacle when we already have an exciting WRJFA pyramid structure for the 2018/19 season?

What is the cut-off date for the formation of a SFA backed WoSL Pyramid?  I have suggested that the point of no return will be reached on 31st January 2019.

I’ve already posted what I think.

I see no role for the SJFA at national level in the future of the West juniors. The West Region clubs need to make an orderly transfer to a new WOSL. There is little reason why management should be very different from current management other than finding someone who can draw up a season’s fixture list.

Yes, I think your date is a reasonable cut-off for saying enough is enough. I’m not sure how accurate is the report on here that the SJFA favours an East/West Superleague - if they are then they are on to a non-starter and will be wasting their energies on this rather than fitting the West juniors into the Pyramid with the top clubs at at least tier 6.

To my mind it’s the west clubs who need to set the ball rolling.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 minutes ago, Stag Nation said:

What sort of support do you have in mind? All you need is a sensible, organised individual with a pad, a pencil and a diary.

The only potential national cup clashes will be with the Scottish Cup. Those will be few, and the dates known in advance.

Given past problems, a Liaison Officer provided by the SFA would perhaps be in the best position to help sort out basic requirements/misunderstandings by developing a strong working relationship with the West Region clubs.

My reference to national cup fixtures includes both Scottish Cup and Junior Cup fixtures. I would hope that the remit of the JC (or its successor) can eventually be widened to include other non-league clubs.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 minutes ago, Pyramidic said:

Given past problems, a Liaison Officer provided by the SFA would perhaps be in the best position to help sort out basic requirements/misunderstandings by developing a strong working relationship with the West Region clubs.

My reference to national cup fixtures includes both Scottish Cup and Junior Cup fixtures. I would hope that the remit of the JC (or its successor) can eventually be widened to include other non-league clubs.

I think "eventually" is the operative word.

On current formq, the SJFA will bury their heads in the sand and allow the JC to diminish in size and importance long before they admit senior clubs. And if/when they do, no-one in the senior game is ever likely to agree to its having priority over senior fixtures.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The winds of change have been blowing in this direction from the day the LL was conceived. The WR needs leadership that can steer it away from the rocks / pull its head from the sand (choose your cliched metaphor). I am far convinced that will happen, even after the AGM.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, cmontheloknow said:

The winds of change have been blowing in this direction from the day the LL was conceived. The WR needs leadership that can steer it away from the rocks / pull its head from the sand (choose your cliched metaphor). I am far convinced that will happen, even after the AGM.

AGMs seldom make decisions: they formalise what has been agreed in the proverbial smoke-filled rooms. Don't Junior club committee men speak to their opposite numbers? Have mobile phones reached Ayrshire?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 minutes ago, Stag Nation said:

AGMs seldom make decisions: they formalise what has been agreed in the proverbial smoke-filled rooms. Don't Junior club committee men speak to their opposite numbers? Have mobile phones reached Ayrshire?

I am referring to the prospective changes at top table level.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Tutankhamen said:

125-4 for change.

Heard the 4 remainers are not in the West

 

Nobody counted the 'fors' or noted any abstentions. It was simply noted as an overwhelming majority.

And yes, I know I'm being pedantic, but also like to get things right.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
AGMs seldom make decisions: they formalise what has been agreed in the proverbial smoke-filled rooms. Don't Junior club committee men speak to their opposite numbers? Have mobile phones reached Ayrshire?

Considering 40 of the west clubs are out with ayrshire bit perochial to mention Ayrshire and not the west as a whole

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The west situation is similar to the east situation from 18 months ago - a lot of Junior clubs and a small number of senior clubs needing to be integrated together. The difference being that there isn't yet a senior west league allowing clubs to take matters into their own hands.

If the WRJFA are going to join en masse then they'll have to accept all the SFA pyramid-related rules, plus travelling down to the Dumfries area if e.g. Dalbeattie are relegated or Threave join their Premiership. Will all the top Junior clubs accept that or will there end up being a breakaway senior league?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, Ginaro said:

 

If the WRJFA are going to join en masse then they'll have to accept all the SFA pyramid-related rules, plus travelling down to the Dumfries area if e.g. Dalbeattie are relegated or Threave join their Premiership. 

Why, has it been confirmed the SoS league is being abolished?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The west situation is similar to the east situation from 18 months ago - a lot of Junior clubs and a small number of senior clubs needing to be integrated together. The difference being that there isn't yet a senior west league allowing clubs to take matters into their own hands.
If the WRJFA are going to join en masse then they'll have to accept all the SFA pyramid-related rules, plus travelling down to the Dumfries area if e.g. Dalbeattie are relegated or Threave join their Premiership. Will all the top Junior clubs accept that or will there end up being a breakaway senior league?
If that was the scenario and they didn't drop into the SoSL, surely it would only be a problem for Dalbeatie or Threave as they would be the ones facing long away trips on 15 occasions whilst the rest would only have 1 to worry about.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We are now only one week away from the SJFA West Region Annual General Meeting which will be held on Wednesday, 27 June 2018.

Does anyone know how SFA Pyramid Restructuring will be covered at the AGM?

Is it being included as an Agenda Item?

I suppose various approaches might be followed:

  • A Paper presented on SFA Pyramid Restructuring with recommendation;
  • A resolution that a Pyramid Restructuring Working Group be established by the WRJFA to explore a positive way forward; or
  • Some verbal waffle that the SJFA / WRJFA will look into the matter in due course.

Any ideas which way we are going and whether any deadlines will be set?

Edited by Pyramidic

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now


×