Gaelic Gaelic

[welshbairn]

1 minute ago, Tony Ferrino said:

 Kalsarikännit is a word everyone should know.

[nsr]

On 25/05/2018 at 10:05, invergowrie arab said:

The point is to give Gaelic equal respect and to allow Gaels to live their lives as far as as possible in their native language.

If it's as relevant to you in your life as Latin that's fine. It's the daily language of 55,000 people though and a community language still in some areas so to say it's as relevant as Latin is a touch silly.

As you say though, if it's not relevant to you just ignore it. I think most reasonable people, like yourself, find that easy enough to do.

 

Is it? I thought that was just the number of people who had some level of ability. Do they actually use it daily?

[invergowrie arab]

10 hours ago, nsr said:

Is it? I thought that was just the number of people who had some level of ability. Do they actually use it daily?

Some level of ability is 90,000

55,000 is people who use it in one or all of the home ,at school at work etc 

So perhaps you live in Glasgow and work, shop and socialise in English but speak Gaelic in the house with family or you might live in Lochboisdale and do all of the above. Both would be in That 55K

Edited May 29, 2018 by invergowrie arab

[chomp my root]

22 minutes ago, invergowrie arab said:

Some level of ability is 90,000

55,000 is people who use it in one or all of the home ,at school at work etc 

So perhaps you live in Glasgow and work, shop and socialise in English but speak Gaelic in the house with family or you might live in Lochboisdale and do all of the above. Both would be in That 55K

It would be interesting to know whether that figure is shifting up or down over the years and if things like BBC Alba have had an impact. 

No idea and no agenda (other than the previously stated cynicism about places being 'rebranded' with Gaelic names) but curious as to if the language is on the way up or down.

[topcat(The most tip top)]

Some level of ability is 90,000

55,000 is people who use it in one or all of the home ,at school at work etc 

So perhaps you live in Glasgow and work, shop and socialise in English but speak Gaelic in the house with family or you might live in Lochboisdale and do all of the above. Both would be in That 55K

 

4. Gaelic home language use

Nationally, 25,000 people aged 3 and over (0.49 per cent of the population) reported using Gaelic at home.

Of those who reported using Gaelic at home, 63.3 per cent had all skills in Gaelic (understanding, speaking, reading and writing), 10.9 per cent had oracy (understands and speaks) and reading skills, 18.2 per cent had oracy skills only, 3.4 per cent could understand Gaelic only, 0.7 per cent had literacy skills only, and 3.4 per cent had no skills in Gaelic (see Appendix 1, note 5).

Nationally, 40.2 per cent of all Gaelic speakers (including children aged under 3) reported using Gaelic at home. This proportion was 73.7 per cent in Eilean Siar, 41.5 per cent in Highland, 33.4 per cent in Argyll & Bute and 23.6 per cent in the other 29 council areas combined

 

http://www.scotlandscensus.gov.uk/documents/analytical_reports/Report_part_1.pdf

 

So we're actually talking about 16,000 who use Gaelic at home seriously

[invergowrie arab]

15 hours ago, chomp my root said:

It would be interesting to know whether that figure is shifting up or down over the years and if things like BBC Alba have had an impact. 

No idea and no agenda (other than the previously stated cynicism about places being 'rebranded' with Gaelic names) but curious as to if the language is on the way up or down.

The overall shift is down as older speakers die off.

There has been a rise in language acquisition and use in the younger demographics in the last census or perhaps two censuses but at the moment it is not at the rate to match the overall decline.

BBC Alba, GME etc can only ever be part of a holistic approach to language renewal. The huge pressures on the language are lack of housing and economic opportunity in Gaelic heartlands meaning people have to leave.

Bòrd na Gàidhlig have the responsibility to create the national plan. I'm hugely critical of BnG who seem to put all their eggs in the GME basket with very little about what happens after that if you don't want to work in GME or broadcasting.

They have just published their second ever plan so maybe too early to judge what success all these different initiatives will have but I'm not optimistic.

[invergowrie arab]

7 hours ago, topcat(The most tip top) said:

 

4. Gaelic home language use

Nationally, 25,000 people aged 3 and over (0.49 per cent of the population) reported using Gaelic at home.

Of those who reported using Gaelic at home, 63.3 per cent had all skills in Gaelic (understanding, speaking, reading and writing), 10.9 per cent had oracy (understands and speaks) and reading skills, 18.2 per cent had oracy skills only, 3.4 per cent could understand Gaelic only, 0.7 per cent had literacy skills only, and 3.4 per cent had no skills in Gaelic (see Appendix 1, note 5).

Nationally, 40.2 per cent of all Gaelic speakers (including children aged under 3) reported using Gaelic at home. This proportion was 73.7 per cent in Eilean Siar, 41.5 per cent in Highland, 33.4 per cent in Argyll & Bute and 23.6 per cent in the other 29 council areas combined

 

http://www.scotlandscensus.gov.uk/documents/analytical_reports/Report_part_1.pdf

 

So we're actually talking about 16,000 who use Gaelic at home seriously

Oracy v literacy is interesting. I have met Gaels pretty much fluent but who wouldn't know how to write it as they received no formal Gaelic education. 

They are still using the language in the home so I wouldn't discount them.

How are the 3.4% with no skills at all using it in the home? Gaelic dictionary as a doorstop?

[chomp my root]

1 hour ago, invergowrie arab said:

The overall shift is down as older speakers die off.

There has been a rise in language acquisition and use in the younger demographics in the last census or perhaps two censuses but at the moment it is not at the rate to match the overall decline.

BBC Alba, GME etc can only ever be part of a holistic approach to language renewal. The huge pressures on the language are lack of housing and economic opportunity in Gaelic heartlands meaning people have to leave.

Bòrd na Gàidhlig have the responsibility to create the national plan. I'm hugely critical of BnG who seem to put all their eggs in the GME basket with very little about what happens after that if you don't want to work in GME or broadcasting.

They have just published their second ever plan so maybe too early to judge what success all these different initiatives will have but I'm not optimistic.

Thanks, just curious.

The missus's gran was from Lewis and when in her dotage the alzheimers kicked in she reverted to mostly speaking Gaelic. Which confused the feck out of the care home workers. She also took a wee shine to me but you can't blame her for that, I'm a handsome b'stard. 

[topcat(The most tip top)]

16 minutes ago, invergowrie arab said:

Oracy v literacy is interesting. I have met Gaels pretty much fluent but who wouldn't know how to write it as they received no formal Gaelic education. 

They are still using the language in the home so I wouldn't discount them.

How are the 3.4% with no skills at all using it in the home? Gaelic dictionary as a doorstop?

Choosing to discount or count them is fair enough either way

The real problem would be throwing numbers like this about without looking at what the numbers actually mean and where they're from 

 

[Hillonearth]

1 hour ago, invergowrie arab said:

Oracy v literacy is interesting. I have met Gaels pretty much fluent but who wouldn't know how to write it as they received no formal Gaelic education. 

They are still using the language in the home so I wouldn't discount them.

How are the 3.4% with no skills at all using it in the home? Gaelic dictionary as a doorstop?

Aye, that was my first thought - are there 3.4% that misunderstood the question and thought they were answering whether they used garlic at home?

Having no skills with a language makes you unlikely at best to use it either at home or outside of it.

[invergowrie arab]

9 minutes ago, topcat(The most tip top) said:

Choosing to discount or count them is fair enough either way

The real problem would be throwing numbers like this about without looking at what the numbers actually mean and where they're from 

 

Sure but home use is not the the only definition of in use as a community language.

You could work exclusively in Gaelic, you could socialise, go to church, speak to family and friends on the phone and online etc and never use it in the home if you have a monoglot partner.

I would imagine there will be a significant percentage of children in GME who don't use it at home or even have Gaelic speaking parents.

 

[topcat(The most tip top)]

18 hours ago, chomp my root said:

Thanks, just curious.

The missus's gran was from Lewis and when in her dotage the alzheimers kicked in she reverted to mostly speaking Gaelic. Which confused the feck out of the care home workers. She also took a wee shine to me but you can't blame her for that, I'm a handsome b'stard. 

The same thing happened to my great granny who'd escaped the Hebrides for Berwickshire as a teenager.

I was a baby so it didn't make any difference to me

She dropped dead within a week of going back to the Gaelic so it's clearly a dangerous thing to do.

 

 

[nsr]

My initial reaction is that if people aren't using it, does it need preserving? Why not teach kids a more useful life skill, like burglary?

Or combine the two, then on arrest demand your right to have your rights read to you in Gaelic. When none of the cops present are able to do so, saunter away a free man.

Yes, I am bored out of my tits at work today.

[Miguel Sanchez]

On ‎27‎/‎05‎/‎2018 at 22:43, Tony Ferrino said:

 Kalsarikännit is a word everyone should know.

perkele

[Kejan]

BUMP!

Want to piss off the "It was never spoken here" mob by being able to say Poileas Alba? Or be the smart arse next time you're up a Munro and able to show off that it means 'The King's Hill' and can pronounce it.

Then.

Gaelic beta is now available on Duolingo. 

[Bairnardo]

BUMP!
Want to piss off the "It was never spoken here" mob by being able to say Poileas Alba? Or be the smart arse next time you're up a Munro and able to show off that it means 'The King's Hill' and can pronounce it.
Then.
Gaelic beta is now available on Duolingo. 

You're a Gaelic beta

[Ray Patterson]

1 hour ago, Kejan said:

Gaelic beta is now available on Duolingo. 

Rudan is toil leinn fhaicinn

Translate?

 

 

 

 

Spoiler

Things we like to see. - Translate by Google

 

[Nutz_the_Squirrel]

[ForzaDundee]

I've just started Gaelic on Duolingo. Hopefully it annoys unionists a wee bit.

[topcat(The most tip top)]

BUMP!
Want to piss off the "It was never spoken here" mob by being able to say Poileas Alba? Or be the smart arse next time you're up a Munro and able to show off that it means 'The King's Hill' and can pronounce it.
Then.
Gaelic beta is now available on Duolingo. 

Only 20 months after they added Klingon