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The Ultimate Super Ayr Thread


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Going back to basic expectations, so long as Bullen does not immediately go on fucking holiday for the next two complete months this pre-season will be better than the last one.

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As much as the last two seasons have been dug meat as uncle Ian likes to say, progress has been made by both Cameron and Smith the short to medium aim was to be an established champinship team this will be our 5th consecutive year in the championship now after years of yo yoing, maybe we have been spoiled with two 4th place finishes in the first two years back up.

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22 minutes ago, Superhursy7 said:

As much as the last two seasons have been dug meat as uncle Ian likes to say, progress has been made by both Cameron and Smith the short to medium aim was to be an established champinship team this will be our 5th consecutive year in the championship now after years of yo yoing, maybe we have been spoiled with two 4th place finishes in the first two years back up.

If we were spoiled in the first two years we've been neglected in the last two years.

There is some element of truth in what you say, had we had four 6th place finishes I think its an easier sell that we are an established Championship club. I also think the continuity narrative is an easier one to make.

I find it hard to swallow that last seasons squad is our most expensive assembled (even before January) since Barr and it was so bereft of quality. That's another reason I want them emptied, we're paying them too much. We really need to undo the damage that Hopkin did to the club.

We obviously made the switch from part time to full time which has made a significant difference in our ability to survive in this division. As a part time team we were relegated every time.

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51 minutes ago, Trogdor said:

If we were spoiled in the first two years we've been neglected in the last two years.

There is some element of truth in what you say, had we had four 6th place finishes I think its an easier sell that we are an established Championship club. I also think the continuity narrative is an easier one to make.

I find it hard to swallow that last seasons squad is our most expensive assembled (even before January) since Barr and it was so bereft of quality. That's another reason I want them emptied, we're paying them too much. We really need to undo the damage that Hopkin did to the club.

We obviously made the switch from part time to full time which has made a significant difference in our ability to survive in this division. As a part time team we were relegated every time.

At this point and time I'd be delighted next season with challenging for 4th, will get a better feel for where we are once bodies start arriving and we know who we'll be playing against. Initial thoughts from me are that Morton will be stronger next season, they've looked better under Imrie. I wouldn't be shocked if they are also looking at the playoffs as a target. No idea what to expect from Cove, losing Milne to Partick will hurt them for sure. Raith are a bit of a mystery, they've been rancid since we beat them at Christmas and McGlynn is out of contract now. Hamilton will probably just job about the middle. 

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10 minutes ago, Hawk89 said:

At this point and time I'd be delighted next season with challenging for 4th, will get a better feel for where we are once bodies start arriving and we know who we'll be playing against. Initial thoughts from me are that Morton will be stronger next season, they've looked better under Imrie. I wouldn't be shocked if they are also looking at the playoffs as a target. No idea what to expect from Cove, losing Milne to Partick will hurt them for sure. Raith are a bit of a mystery, they've been rancid since we beat them at Christmas and McGlynn is out of contract now. Hamilton will probably just job about the middle. 

You would have thought however comes down, ICT and Partick would be the initial favourites, Morton & Dunfermline probably cant be as bad as last year, Arbroath and Hamilton will be decent, Raith and Cove will be the unknowns, Raith as the have been terrible for months and the could be looking at a new manager, and Cove are an unknown. Are they still part time?

Edited by honestly united
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4 minutes ago, honestly united said:

You would have thought however comes down, ICT and Partick would be the initial favourites, Morton & Dunfermline probably cant be as bad as last year, Arbroath and Hamilton will be decent, Raith and Cove will be the unknowns, Raith as the have been terrible for months and the could be looking at a new manager, and Cove are an unknown. Are they still part time?

Pretty certain they are part time but pay very well to attract the best of the part timers. Arbroath have proven that model works in this league so far, so not sure if they'd consider trying to go full time even with the higher prize money on offer. 

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With Mathie and Glendinning behind the scenes, this is the most confident I've been in a long time with regards to summer signings. Those two, along with Smith will be selling the Premiership plan to potential signings, we're a club (off field at the moment) on the up etc. Also, the squad seemed to have a great relationship with each other this year and enjoyed being at Ayr, that will surely help entice players too, knowing that they should enjoy their time at Ayr. We'll hopefully get news this week about players moving on and who's been offered something. Some contract renewals and season tickets going on sale next week could be a big boost for the club.

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1 hour ago, Thumper said:

Going back to basic expectations, so long as Bullen does not immediately go on fucking holiday for the next two complete months this pre-season will be better than the last one.

Bullen has the luxury of Mathie doing the contract stuff so he can give him a list of players he wants kept and bugger off for a couple of weeks while offers are made. 
Same with potential targets, it would be weird if a manager wasn’t there for signing talks but the identification has been done apparently so once he knows who’s is staying then they can start making offers on that. So there is scope for him having 2-3 weeks off over the summer.

Hopkin didn’t have that option but felt it ok to take the time anyway. You’d think someone with his complexion would want to avoid a month on a beach. 

 

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9 minutes ago, RedEd said:

I think the talk about Cove is they could have a hybrid set-up next season.

It didn’t help us in the short term and took until we were fully full time to push on. It hasn’t harmed Arbroath though not being full time.

Hartley has struggled at this level before.
I am assuming they are training in the north east rather than Glasgow which means attracting players largely based in the local area. if they are going to be a hybrid then that may be down to cost which means they aren’t likely to be planning paying folk £1000 a week. 
It will be interesting to see how they do and who they sign.

 

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10 minutes ago, diegomarahenry said:

Bullen has the luxury of Mathie doing the contract stuff so he can give him a list of players he wants kept and bugger off for a couple of weeks while offers are made. 
Same with potential targets, it would be weird if a manager wasn’t there for signing talks but the identification has been done apparently so once he knows who’s is staying then they can start making offers on that. So there is scope for him having 2-3 weeks off over the summer.

Hopkin didn’t have that option but felt it ok to take the time anyway. You’d think someone with his complexion would want to avoid a month on a beach. 

 

All players spoken to over the weekend were  in the presence of both Graeme Mathie and Lee Bullen , I believe Bullen will have identified players along with recommendations from Glendinning and will have the say on who comes in with Mathie doing all the negotiations on contracts etc 

Edited by Finlay21
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5 minutes ago, diegomarahenry said:

It didn’t help us in the short term and took until we were fully full time to push on. It hasn’t harmed Arbroath though not being full time.

Hartley has struggled at this level before.
I am assuming they are training in the north east rather than Glasgow which means attracting players largely based in the local area. if they are going to be a hybrid then that may be down to cost which means they aren’t likely to be planning paying folk £1000 a week. 
It will be interesting to see how they do and who they sign.

 

I wouldn't be surprised if it was the usual Aberdeen / Dundee Utd cast-offs clubs that way normally sign.

Hybrid hasn't done Airdrie any harm, but when we did it in the early(ish) 2000s it split the dressing room.

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18 minutes ago, diegomarahenry said:

It didn’t help us in the short term and took until we were fully full time to push on. It hasn’t harmed Arbroath though not being full time.

Hartley has struggled at this level before.
I am assuming they are training in the north east rather than Glasgow which means attracting players largely based in the local area. if they are going to be a hybrid then that may be down to cost which means they aren’t likely to be planning paying folk £1000 a week. 
It will be interesting to see how they do and who they sign.

I think there are mitigating circumstances for Hartley's last spell (Lolkirk adopting a truly insane Champ Man Walter Mitty-esque scout and using him for their complete recruitment list) and tbh I can easily see Cove paying a grand a week. Bear in mind that there is very much a model for the type of part-time player whose reason for only being part-time is because he's a pipe fitter or a contractor who could be making more money doing his other job full-time and that's the ones your Coves are targeting.

Also note that a lot of people, self included, totally underestimate how far players (even part time) are willing to travel for work. Arbroath have got central belt players. Steve Bowie used to drive up from Carlisle after a full shift to play for Ayr in the fucking division below, and he certainly wasn't getting a grand a week for the effort.

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I honestly can't understand people being "worried" about us potentially handing out 3 year contracts, ok, if it was YOUR money then maybe, however it's David Smith who's bankrolling the club and taking the risks, so if he's happy to do it then we should be overjoyed as fans, as there's really nothing negative can come of it from our own personal perspective.

As for who'll do what next season, it's basically pointless trying to guess, as a quick glance at the budgets relative to the performances of full time financially big hitting Dunfermline, verses the part time, small squad and loan reliant Arbroath shows the lunacy of it all.

For what it's worth, I believe we already have the makings of a squad capable of a mid table finish (assuming we keep them all), however a new RB is a must, a proven goalscorer is another must and at least 2 older and experienced heads need to be coming in (CB Captain type and CM/ Playmaker) as people forget how very young and inexperienced much of our current squad currently is. I also wouldn't be against us signing some sort of foreign maverick type with good ball skills and crossing ability as this is something we're currently missing big style. I had hoped O'Connor would be that guy but he really doesn't do enough for me, although I wouldn't be against him staying as cover.

We also need to trim the deadwood at the club and only have guys on the books capable of coming in and doing a job as at the moment we seem to have an awful lot of guys just hanging around who're realistically NEVER going to be first choice but are also picking up a decent wage just for a kick about at half time or being named in a squad.

 

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54 minutes ago, WATTOO said:

I honestly can't understand people being "worried" about us potentially handing out 3 year contracts, ok, if it was YOUR money then maybe, however it's David Smith who's bankrolling the club and taking the risks, so if he's happy to do it then we should be overjoyed as fans, as there's really nothing negative can come of it from our own personal perspective.

I think its fair to expect the club to be run sustainably. In fact, is the aim under Smith not for the club to sustain itself eventually? We're not there yet but with the hub and new hospitality (eventually) increasing revenue plus additional attendances we could be.

None of us want another situation like we had post Barr.

Three year deals in principle are fine for young players on lower wages who you can develop and maybe get a fee for. Doing the same for experienced pros when we've been dicing with relegation is another. It's one of the reasons I'm keen to hear the plan from Mathie, Bullen and Smith.

Being financially sustainable is important being totally reliant on a single person is inherently risky for the club. It worries me, what would happen if Smith was hit by a bus?

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6 minutes ago, Trogdor said:

I think its fair to expect the club to be run sustainably. In fact, is the aim under Smith not for the club to sustain itself eventually? We're not there yet but with the hub and new hospitality (eventually) increasing revenue plus additional attendances we could be.

None of us want another situation like we had post Barr.

Three year deals in principle are fine for young players on lower wages who you can develop and maybe get a fee for. Doing the same for experienced pros when we've been dicing with relegation is another. It's one of the reasons I'm keen to hear the plan from Mathie, Bullen and Smith.

Being financially sustainable is important being totally reliant on a single person is inherently risky for the club. It worries me, what would happen if Smith was hit by a bus?

I'd be more worried about a load of bricks falling on him tbh.

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There Is lot say about what a close nit group these are even when the chips were down you can't deny they fought for each other that does not come easy, we all agree that we need to get rid of players that are not up to it but you don't get that togetherness by gutting the squad completely

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19 minutes ago, Trogdor said:

I think its fair to expect the club to be run sustainably. In fact, is the aim under Smith not for the club to sustain itself eventually? We're not there yet but with the hub and new hospitality (eventually) increasing revenue plus additional attendances we could be.

None of us want another situation like we had post Barr.

Three year deals in principle are fine for young players on lower wages who you can develop and maybe get a fee for. Doing the same for experienced pros when we've been dicing with relegation is another. It's one of the reasons I'm keen to hear the plan from Mathie, Bullen and Smith.

Being financially sustainable is important being totally reliant on a single person is inherently risky for the club. It worries me, what would happen if Smith was hit by a bus?

From what I've read, I don't believe that there's any suggestion of handing the likes of Muirhead a 3 year deal but more the young guys who have the potential to kick on and as such command a decent transfer fee for us.

As others have said, it's all swings and roundabouts, for some a 3 year deal will offer a bit of security and they know that if they excel then the club will not stand in their way should we be fairly recompensed, on the other hand some may feel they can do better as a free agent after 12 months, however for every success story there's another dozen who end up in the lower leagues or going junior so it seems a reasonable deal for all parties involved.

Edited by WATTOO
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