The Ultimate Super Ayr Thread

[Hawk89]

8 hours ago, Hursty said:

I'd give him the player managers job  tbh!

The thought of going to the rest of these games is depressing. I'm taking American family to the Pars game for their first ever "soccer" game and roped a few folk in that probably last went to Somerset when Ally was in charge.  11 am start on the pints and making a day of it. Pars are clearly shite but they will beat us comfortably. 

 

 

I actually think we'll beat them, ending Peter Grant's spell as manager and Hopkin being hailed as some sort of tactical genius by some sections of our support.

[Roxanne's man]

2 hours ago, Hawk89 said:

Hopkin being hailed as some sort of tactical genius by some sections of our support.

That the support that needs support

[Thumper]

10 hours ago, Hursty said:

I'm taking American family to the Pars game for their first ever "soccer" game

Is this supposed to be some sort of Clockwork Orange-style aversion therapy?

[Guest]

13 hours ago, Thumper said:

Hamilton have already gotten shot of their manager and glorious failure is far more valuable when it doesn't happen before the kids go back to school. But I see WATTOO greenied you, suggesting that his nurse noticed that his drip was empty again.

We were outstanding against Dundee Utd and thoroughly deserved to beat them, we were poor against Kilmarnock and Inverness, shocking in the first half against Arbroath but decent in the second, as such I'm not quite ready for accepting relegation just yet.

Maxwell was excellent in midfield, McAdams made a big difference between the sticks and both McKenzie and Hewitt look like they can play a decent part. There's no guarantees that Hopkin will reproduce the type of performance and tactics that we had against United, but if he does then this current squad will be more than good enough for a mid table finish, of that I'm sure.

The bottom line is that many here have had it in for Hopkin from day one and detest the style of play, I'm not mad on it myself but I do believe that he deserves at least the first full round of games before any rash decisions are made.

Say we did sack him tomorrow, who do we bring in ? how much would it cost ? would everything just become great suddenly with a new style of lovely fast flowing attacking football and instant success ??

I'm not so sure.....

[diegomarahenry]

I expect Dunfermline will do the same as they have the last couple of years, look poor early on and then come good towards the end of the season keeping Grant in a job, they have decent quality all through the team and once they settle on a style they will start to get results.

The difference between them and Ayr are, we have settled on a style that hasn’t looked like working, we don’t have players showing quality and the manager has had a decent chunk of last plus half a dozen games this season without addressing…and in some case adding to the problem areas. 
I am always cautious about us signing loads of players because every penny is a prisoner at this level and it doesn’t guarantee success. However, I’d say we need a centre half to replace any of the preferred back 3, at least two midfielders and another forward. 

we have Chalmers, Murdoch, Hewitt, O’Conner, Maxwell and Miller who can play in central midfield and only 3 fit in to the style of play, meaning the others are either getting paid to sit and do nothing or have to be shoehorned in elsewhere. The ones that have played haven’t dominated a game all season because we get rid of the ball as quick as possible.

Do we get in to another Daziel situation where we keep signing players to paper over cracks or do we try and play a way that suits the players we have. 
with the defence we have, I would suggest defensive football isn’t for us, with 2 wing backs, I would suggest not relying on them being full backs. These seem to be cornerstones of Hopkins approach. 

 

[No_Problemo]

59 minutes ago, WATTOO said:

We were outstanding against Dundee Utd and thoroughly deserved to beat them, we were poor against Kilmarnock and Inverness, shocking in the first half against Arbroath but decent in the second, as such I'm not quite ready for accepting relegation just yet.

Maxwell was excellent in midfield, McAdams made a big difference between the sticks and both McKenzie and Hewitt look like they can play a decent part. There's no guarantees that Hopkin will reproduce the type of performance and tactics that we had against United, but if he does then this current squad will be more than good enough for a mid table finish, of that I'm sure.

The bottom line is that many here have had it in for Hopkin from day one and detest the style of play, I'm not mad on it myself but I do believe that he deserves at least the first full round of games before any rash decisions are made.

Say we did sack him tomorrow, who do we bring in ? how much would it cost ? would everything just become great suddenly with a new style of lovely fast flowing attacking football and instant success ??

I'm not so sure.....

Alternatively, if he reproduces basically every single league game he has been our manager... 

 

McKenzie and Hewitt do look like they can play a decent part this season, but not as regular starters. Hopkin needs to make two good signings before Tuesday, or his recruitment has been shambolic. 

[Guest]

45 minutes ago, No_Problemo said:

Alternatively, if he reproduces basically every single league game he has been our manager... 

 

McKenzie and Hewitt do look like they can play a decent part this season, but not as regular starters. Hopkin needs to make two good signings before Tuesday, or his recruitment has been shambolic. 

Can't argue with this, Adeloye has looked good and I'm thinking Maxwell will be very good, however while O'Connor looks like he could be excellent, I'm not so sure that he will be in our style of play.

As you say, we badly need at least 1 central midfielder as neither Docherty nor Kelly have ever been replaced and as for up top, Afolabi just hasn't resembled a footballer in any way !!

[No_Problemo]

10 minutes ago, WATTOO said:

Can't argue with this, Adeloye has looked good and I'm thinking Maxwell will be very good, however while O'Connor looks like he could be excellent, I'm not so sure that he will be in our style of play.

As you say, we badly need at least 1 central midfielder as neither Docherty nor Kelly have ever been replaced and as for up top, Afolabi just hasn't resembled a footballer in any way !!

Afolabi has genuinely been just unfathomably shite! He must get better, surely. 

[Guest]

12 minutes ago, No_Problemo said:

Afolabi has genuinely been just unfathomably shite! He must get better, surely. 

I remember saying the same about Mark Duthie.

[BukyOHare]

3 hours ago, WATTOO said:

There's no guarantees that Hopkin will reproduce the type of performance and tactics that we had against United,

Talk about poor recruitment, tactics and approach from game to game all you like, all three clearly don't reflect favourably on Hopkin.

But for me the quoted section of your post sum the main problem up well. We can't actually rely on the manager to reproduce performances and that's a huge part of his job at this level. To instil a confidence and consistency to the team that he puts out and the performances they give him in return. 

Its upto him to get a full time squad of players to over achieve and outperform the opposition every week. Its league results that matter most and rightly its where he'll ultimately be judged. 

You keep citing that fans have had it in for him from early in his reign. Take a step back and ask yourself why this actually might be? 

Is it because we're sick of beating teams 4 nil every week with a total football inspired on the front foot demolition and as we struggle to kick off games on time due to thousands queuing to get in? No it isn't. 

I'll say it again, again and again. The support deserves the right to voice their disapproval at what's being served up while also hoping that it turns for the better. In situations like this you can actually be in support of both camps. 

There's little that I can see that offers much in the way of optimism that Hopkin can turn this slide around.

Man management is apparently one of his strengths, the current squad of players don't seem to buying in fully with what he's coaching or asking. This is a huge reason why we're so disjointed and inconsistent from week to week. 

 

 

[Trogdor]

Consistency is the problem. I have no faith we can string two good performances in a row. We haven't in Hopkin's first 19 games. There's currently no evidence to suggest that is going to change. He also needs to win a home league game pronto or the atmosphere is going to get pretty poisonous at Somerset.

I don't think its unreasonable to expect better than 1 win 6 draws & 5 losses in 12 league games. If that happened over the course of a season we'd finish on 27 points. To put that into perspective that's 2 points less than we managed last season with 9 less games. 

The only mitigation is that he's only had 3 league games with his own team. However, my patience is wearing thin.

Edited August 29, 2021 by Trogdor

[North British]

32 minutes ago, BukyOHare said:

You keep citing that fans have had it in for him from early in his reign. Take a step back and ask yourself why this actually might be? 

The above point is the crux of the matter .  There are a pretty sizeable number of Ayr fans who yearn for a return of the McCall years , well the last couple anyway . However despite having the best centre forward in our history (probably) and one or two other players of real quality we couldn’t finish above fourth . Our beautiful passing game died in the winter and teams like Ross County crushed us on their way to the title . All that as well as the fiasco in Auchinleck .

This is the main conundrum even with our improved budget it’s highly un lightly that we’ll be able to pass our way to the Premiership . So we either look at a style that has worked and we can afford like Livingston’s or find another manager who will play a nice style of football but in the Championship .  

For the record I do think we haven’t found the correct balance yet , we are too predictable . A central midfielder is a must , also the bullet needs bitten and two strikers played , at least at home . 

[No_Problemo]

4 minutes ago, North British said:

The above point is the crux of the matter .  There are a pretty sizeable number of Ayr fans who yearn for a return of the McCall years , well the last couple anyway . However despite having the best centre forward in our history (probably) and one or two other players of real quality we couldn’t finish above fourth . Our beautiful passing game died in the winter and teams like Ross County crushed us on their way to the title . All that as well as the fiasco in Auchinleck .

This is the main conundrum even with our improved budget it’s highly un lightly that we’ll be able to pass our way to the Premiership . So we either look at a style that has worked and we can afford like Livingston’s or find another manager who will play a nice style of football but in the Championship .  

For the record I do think we haven’t found the correct balance yet , we are too predictable . A central midfielder is a must , also the bullet needs bitten and two strikers played , at least at home . 

So many of us have said numerous times that we don’t even care about a long ball style game where you play off a focal point and get up close to him. The issue is that we don’t do it remotely well, its far too negative and clueless. No team is ever doing well playing with eight or nine defensive players. 

[Superhursty7]

So many of us have said numerous times that we don’t even care about a long ball style game where you play off a focal point and get up close to him. The issue is that we don’t do it remotely well, its far too negative and clueless. No team is ever doing well playing with eight or nine defensive players. 

100% hate the long ball stuff but will hold my nose if it works, the issue is if you are always set up not to lose how do you ever win.

[Trogdor]

1 hour ago, Superhursy7 said:

100% hate the long ball stuff but will hold my nose if it works, the issue is if you are always set up not to lose how do you ever win.

The vast majority would agree with this. I really dont give a f**k how we play as long as we collect 3 points.

Trouble is, with his negative setup we're playing for 1 point under Hopkin. 

[Thumper]

10 hours ago, WATTOO said:

Say we did sack him tomorrow, who do we bring in ? how much would it cost ? would everything just become great suddenly with a new style of lovely fast flowing attacking football and instant success ??

There's no point in replacing Hopkin unless the team are seriously cut adrift at the bottom as the assembled squad isn't good enough for anything except a relegation scrap anyway. However he absolutely has to be gone the minute the season ends.

6 hours ago, North British said:

There are a pretty sizeable number of Ayr fans who yearn for a return of the McCall years , well the last couple anyway . However despite having the best centre forward in our history (probably) and one or two other players of real quality we couldn’t finish above fourth .

It's been 20 years since Ayr finished higher than that, and only McCall has finished higher than 8th in the second tier since 2003-04. It was only under McCall that mid-table mediocrity at this level was even possible. It's certainly not happening under the current management.

[BukyOHare]

19 hours ago, North British said:

The above point is the crux of the matter .  There are a pretty sizeable number of Ayr fans who yearn for a return of the McCall years , well the last couple anyway . However despite having the best centre forward in our history (probably) and one or two other players of real quality we couldn’t finish above fourth . Our beautiful passing game died in the winter and teams like Ross County crushed us on their way to the title . All that as well as the fiasco in Auchinleck .

This is the main conundrum even with our improved budget it’s highly un lightly that we’ll be able to pass our way to the Premiership . So we either look at a style that has worked and we can afford like Livingston’s or find another manager who will play a nice style of football but in the Championship .  

For the record I do think we haven’t found the correct balance yet , we are too predictable . A central midfielder is a must , also the bullet needs bitten and two strikers played , at least at home . 

You surely can't be surprised or shocked that fans would want a return to a period that largely brought positivity, results and for us an element of "success". Anyone remember Dundee Utd away? It seems an ever distant memory to what we're getting served currently. 

Its not about the style of play for most people, it's about the performances and ultimately results. 

You can surely see that? 

People get too hung up about formations and tactics. Managers overthink things and the result is that players become robotic in their actions, unable to react to situations on the field, end up playing within themselves and lose confidence rapidly as their performances and team results dip. 

That for me is what we're seeing happening before our very eyes under Hopkin.

Football is not a difficult game, it's complicated by managers who are indecisive, unable to communicate their ideas well enough or fail to get their squad to overachieve or to play with an expression and fluidity to their play. The result is that their teams become predictable and the opposition quickly catch on how to beat them. 

Even Hopkin's biggest supporter would concede he's well off getting things turned around. 

One league win under him is truly horrendous. Just think about that and suggest how it gets improved upon under him. 

You can keep adding players to the squad but if there's a lack of quality in both the individuals we're recruiting, the squad collectively and the abilities of the manager its a toxic mix that usually has a predictable, hoop strip wearing outcome. 

 

Edited August 30, 2021 by BukyOHare

[HMIP]

16 hours ago, North British said:

However despite having the best centre forward in our history (probably) and one or two other players of real quality we couldn’t finish above fourth

Finishing 4th in the Championship is soooo passé.  

[North Terrace Gazza]

I was a massive fan of McCall and was gutted when he left. However, it has to be remembered that he got very, very lucky with Shankland. Without his goals we would not have been anywhere near promotion play offs.

[THEHonestman1910]

34 minutes ago, North Terrace Gazza said:

I was a massive fan of McCall and was gutted when he left. However, it has to be remembered that he got very, very lucky with Shankland. Without his goals we would not have been anywhere near promotion play offs.

I think it was down to McCalls man management more than anything, him being a good motivator and knowing that he could partner him with Moffat. You can see McCall doing the same thing with Scott Tiffoney right now. 

Edited August 30, 2021 by THEHonestman1910