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The Clyde FC 2018-19 Thread


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30 minutes ago, SimonLichtie said:

As all good hard-on mates do, let me just wade in here.....

It's very simple. We accept that we are one of 20 odd part time teams in Scotland who will all have our ups and downs. I recently made a post on the Arbroath thread about how if Dumbarton, Alloa, Brechin etc. can have forays into the 2nd top tier and be competitive in the last 15 years then we certainly can also. So can Clyde.

I didn't go around sneering at Dumbarton etc. and saying how we were a bigger club. We're not a bigger club than Dumbarton. We're not a bigger club than Clyde. We don't have ideas above our station and think we're some sort of super part time team who are just here momentarily among the other diddies until we become the force we 'should' be. 

We accept what we are as a football club. It would make your life easier if you accepted what Clyde are as a football club. You are no bigger than the rest of us diddies, and you need to accept that.

But Simon, what exactly then IS your station? What do you believe your ceiling to be, and why should your club (in your opinion) only ascend to a certain level? You're about to enter tier 2. With that attitude, you'll bounce back out of it in 2 years or less. Peaks and troughs are generally natural phenomena in football, but no one endures the latter deliberately to maintain a balance. What's the fucking point in that, for anyone? 

 

I only picked on the clubs i did because they're the most recent, and logically for my club to succeed, yours and the others would need to be defeated for that to happen. The idea of false bonhomie among the 20-odd diddy clubs is exactly why every time there's a reconstruction, its those clubs who are targeted, and its nearly as bad an attitude held in the Premier for clubs salivating at visits from the not-so-old firm. It all sounds very backward to me, as I certainly have no kinship with any other club based on any shared trajectory or whatever, i'm also aware that Clyde could yet fall arse over tit this year and disappear back to the bottom half, and stay there, despite the genuinely best efforts of the club to succeed. How that is responded to - i believe Arbroath sacked two managers in relatively quick time to stop the rot of 'inevitable' "ups and downs", correctly - is the key to whether you're a diddy club or not. Not just your current abode or league position, as that can change almost overnight. 

Edited by Officer Barbrady
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2 hours ago, 1320Lichtie said:

Aggro.... In recent history, better crowds, better teams and won 2 possibly 3 titles compared to 0.

Clyde did used to be a pretty big club but a lot has changed and you've went backwards whilst we've improved and went forwards on and off the park. Average crowds up to 750-800, not too many better part time wise. Changes in the boardroom, massive changes to what we do in the community and to attract investment, loads of improvement to our own ground both for footballing and commercial reasons.

Meanwhile Clyde have seen attendances drop, have spent years in the bottom league, in a stadium they don't own not even sure where they'll be playing going forward for a period of time too and won precisely zilch.

League 1 is also a lot better than League 2. I realise it's been a while and to be fair the top end of League 2 isn't far off but there's no shite kicking about the bottom end like there is in League 2. The team we won the league with in L2 would've been battling relegation in L1.

I fail to see how you would offer any more than ourselves, Dumbarton or Alloa. To say it's extremely biased and deluded is an understatement.

 

As a neutral (Hibs fan who admittedly is a bit of a Clyde fan too) Clyde are clearly bigger than Arbroath. That is not to demean your team who are clearly doing very well. All you say about good gates, boardroom, and ground ownership may be true and genuine congratulations on your current form, but ultimately it is about potential. So today Arbroath are doing better than Clyde on a number of measures but, there is a natural ceiling to Arbroath, and I would say you are probably close to it- I hope you prove me wrong! 

Clyde have probably underperformed more than any club in Scotland over since the 1970's, outside perhaps Dundee. Sure that has had a big negative impact on Clyde but it doesn't detract from a genuinely outstanding history and contribution to the Scottish game and I would still say potential.  It is hard to judge what sort of support Clyde would get if genuienly successful but I would wager it would be a good deal more than the 750-800 Arbroath get (which for the size of town is outstanding BTW). Clyde probably still are a more natural championship side than almost any current member of League 1 or 2 outside Raith. Let's hope the theory becomes practice.

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It is hard to judge what sort of support Clyde would get if genuienly successful but I would wager it would be a good deal more than the 750-800 Arbroath get (which for the size of town is outstanding BTW). Clyde probably still are a more natural championship side than almost any current member of League 1 or 2 outside Raith. Let's hope the theory becomes practice.


I can give you an idea. Season 03-04 where ICT pipped Clyde to the title. The biggest game of that season and whoever won this was surely going to lift the title and make their way up to the Premiership, which ICT did.

I was a season ticket holder then and as I went to sit in my regular seat I had to give way to the influx of new faces that came to broadwood that day.

Was great to see and showed the crowds we could potentially get if decent opposition came to broadwood. 5000 people were in attendance that day and for a 2nd tier game that’s pretty decent.

Cumbernauld and Kilsyth region has the potential to fill broadwood or at least a 2 out of the 3 stands.

Hoping those days aren’t far off.
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I can give you an idea. Season 03-04 where ICT pipped Clyde to the title. The biggest game of that season and whoever won this was surely going to lift the title and make their way up to the Premiership, which ICT did.

I was a season ticket holder then and as I went to sit in my regular seat I had to give way to the influx of new faces that came to broadwood that day.

Was great to see and showed the crowds we could potentially get if decent opposition came to broadwood. 5000 people were in attendance that day and for a 2nd tier game that’s pretty decent.

Cumbernauld and Kilsyth region has the potential to fill broadwood or at least a 2 out of the 3 stands.

Hoping those days aren’t far off.


We finished consistently in the top half of tier 2 for the best part of a decade and challenged for the title a couple of times in that spell. Our crowds were nowhere near that figure. It’s a complete fantasy to suggest we would get anything like 5000 other than special occasions.

We would be lucky to average 1000-1200, which factors in sizeable travelling supports. Even in our early 2000’s purple patch the home element of the crowd was rarely over 1000.
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17 hours ago, 1320Lichtie said:

Clyde did used to be a pretty big club but a lot has changed and you've went backwards whilst we've improved and went forwards on and off the park. Average crowds up to 750-800, not too many better part time wise. Changes in the boardroom, massive changes to what we do in the community and to attract investment, loads of improvement to our own ground both for footballing and commercial reasons

I'm terribly sorry but i genuinely only properly read this part. Quite rude of me, actually. Apologies. 

 

I had no idea what had driven Arbroath's success, but if you attribute it to these reasons, then maybe i ought to point out that a great deal of the same are now applicable to Clyde, providing us with similar paths to resources eventually leading to proving me correct. 

 

All being well, of course.

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5 hours ago, Abshok said:

 


I can give you an idea. Season 03-04 where ICT pipped Clyde to the title. The biggest game of that season and whoever won this was surely going to lift the title and make their way up to the Premiership, which ICT did.

I was a season ticket holder then and as I went to sit in my regular seat I had to give way to the influx of new faces that came to broadwood that day.

Was great to see and showed the crowds we could potentially get if decent opposition came to broadwood. 5000 people were in attendance that day and for a 2nd tier game that’s pretty decent.

Cumbernauld and Kilsyth region has the potential to fill broadwood or at least a 2 out of the 3 stands.

Hoping those days aren’t far off.

 

You'll have us greetin', Abs. 

 

I'm certain that it's all in hand. 

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We finished consistently in the top half of tier 2 for the best part of a decade and challenged for the title a couple of times in that spell. Our crowds were nowhere near that figure. It’s a complete fantasy to suggest we would get anything like 5000 other than special occasions.

We would be lucky to average 1000-1200, which factors in sizeable travelling supports. Even in our early 2000’s purple patch the home element of the crowd was rarely over 1000.


That’s exactly what’s wrong with our mentality, they figures shouldn’t be unthinkable. I did state that that particular game was a very special occasion. The product of football back then was of higher standards also but for that game we hit serious numbers.

Population in the Nauld 52k, Kilsyth 12k according to wiki. You telling me that it would be crazy to think we could get an average of 2000-3000 Clyde fans to fill up the home stand? That’s just less than 5% of the population for only those two areas.

That’s not including surrounding areas like Kirky (20k), Stepps (7k) & Glasgow areas where the foundation of this club was built. 18 home games a season, only 18 times in 10 months. You set a target for 9 games in a season (as big teams may take some of the potential fans away) and build on it from there but I do strongly feel that we don’t promote or market Clyde well imo.

Perhaps I just try to see the positive side but I really don’t think getting 2-3k in our home stand is outrageous when the product is there and we have a location like we have.

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3 hours ago, Clyde01 said:

 


We finished consistently in the top half of tier 2 for the best part of a decade and challenged for the title a couple of times in that spell. Our crowds were nowhere near that figure. It’s a complete fantasy to suggest we would get anything like 5000 other than special occasions.

We would be lucky to average 1000-1200, which factors in sizeable travelling supports. Even in our early 2000’s purple patch the home element of the crowd was rarely over 1000.

 

I understand what both of you and Abshok are saying, and you're both correct about some aspects.  The situation is very simple.

When we went there in '94, we had the attitude of '54.  Build it and they will come, nobody's got anything else to do on a Saturday.  Wrong.  Also going so late into a season when they should have built it up over a summer, compounded by that particular season 3 teams would be relegated etc etc.  It was an archaic way of thinking, and first impressions count.  Then of course 4 years of pretty much nothing on the field compounded it all even further.

The only time there was any real engagement in the area came from McDonald's time there.  All the young kids that started to appear around the time of our promotion in 2000 - many of whom are now the young lads following the team to most of the away games - it was the early stages of righting a wrong and gradual progress.  By the time we were pushing for promotion into the Premier, he was gone, and the attitude reverted back to "it's up to the local community to just come along".   

That was bad enough, but then you get at least a decade of complete breakdown with NLC / NLL and an alienation from the local community with statements making it clear that we want to leave and that "Cumbernauld is just not interested in us"   No wonder !  You're supposed to learn from history.

The area does have significant potential, relationships have improved because organizations are just made up of people who come and go - new people have no baggage with each other.   New generations of potential support are born all the time, new people move into the area - the immediate area has a lot of new build - there is a lot where what's happened in the past is irrelevant, it's what happens in the future.

But that's down to real engagement across the board, not superficial gestures which if the local community are unaware of anyway achieve nothing.  This is where the club has to show its mettle, tie up with as many local organizations as possible of all descriptions to get their presence felt over time.  It's too fundamental a process to throw it back to the existing support to try and get a few more bodies along, that's small beer, it's way beyond that level.  The talk about this from the club recently has been positive, but it's time for the talk to stop and action to start. 

 

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That’s exactly what’s wrong with our mentality, they figures shouldn’t be unthinkable. I did state that that particular game was a very special occasion. The product of football back then was of higher standards also but for that game we hit serious numbers.

Population in the Nauld 52k, Kilsyth 12k according to wiki. You telling me that it would be crazy to think we could get an average of 2000-3000 Clyde fans to fill up the home stand? That’s just less than 5% of the population for only those two areas.

That’s not including surrounding areas like Kirky (20k), Stepps (7k) & Glasgow areas where the foundation of this club was built. 18 home games a season, only 18 times in 10 months. You set a target for 9 games in a season (as big teams may take some of the potential fans away) and build on it from there but I do strongly feel that we don’t promote or market Clyde well imo.

Perhaps I just try to see the positive side but I really don’t think getting 2-3k in our home stand is outrageous when the product is there and we have a location like we have.



All these areas you mention are full of old firm fans. Of course I want to see us attract as many fans as possible but just think the figures you are banding about are completely unrealistic.

Hamilton are in the premier league and have been a top end championship / lower premiership side for years. Similar distance from Glasgow as we are yet average under 1500. St mirren and even st Johnstone are around 2000ish.

On your quality of product comment look at Queen of the South. Play cracking football and have Dobbie scoring goals for fun. They really haven’t had it better in my living memory, yet their chairman is talking about falling attendances and the struggle to sustain full time football.

Yes, we should aim to get as many punters through the doors as possible but if we can get the average into 4 figures we will be doing well IMO.
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19 hours ago, support the underdog said:

 

As a neutral (Hibs fan who admittedly is a bit of a Clyde fan too) Clyde are clearly bigger than Arbroath. That is not to demean your team who are clearly doing very well. All you say about good gates, boardroom, and ground ownership may be true and genuine congratulations on your current form, but ultimately it is about potential. So today Arbroath are doing better than Clyde on a number of measures but, there is a natural ceiling to Arbroath, and I would say you are probably close to it- I hope you prove me wrong! 

Clyde have probably underperformed more than any club in Scotland over since the 1970's, outside perhaps Dundee. Sure that has had a big negative impact on Clyde but it doesn't detract from a genuinely outstanding history and contribution to the Scottish game and I would still say potential.  It is hard to judge what sort of support Clyde would get if genuienly successful but I would wager it would be a good deal more than the 750-800 Arbroath get (which for the size of town is outstanding BTW). Clyde probably still are a more natural championship side than almost any current member of League 1 or 2 outside Raith. Let's hope the theory becomes practice.

:lol:

Out of interest, what is Dumbarton's ceiling?

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3 hours ago, Abshok said:

Population in the Nauld 52k, Kilsyth 12k according to wiki. You telling me that it would be crazy to think we could get an average of 2000-3000 Clyde fans to fill up the home stand? That’s just less than 5% of the population for only those two areas.

 

Why aren't these thousands of fans showing up now? Surely if all of those people have an interest in watching Clyde play at the highest level possible they'd be down there every week giving the club their hard earned cash and Clyde could piss these diddy leagues in straight seasons?

You're suggesting that your current crowds can grow 500% by playing in the Championship. It's delusional.

Edited by The Moonster
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29 minutes ago, Clyde01 said:

 


All these areas you mention are full of old firm fans. Of course I want to see us attract as many fans as possible but just think the figures you are banding about are completely unrealistic.

Hamilton are in the premier league and have been a top end championship / lower premiership side for years. Similar distance from Glasgow as we are yet average under 1500. St mirren and even st Johnstone are around 2000ish.

On your quality of product comment look at Queen of the South. Play cracking football and have Dobbie scoring goals for fun. They really haven’t had it better in my living memory, yet their chairman is talking about falling attendances and the struggle to sustain full time football.

Yes, we should aim to get as many punters through the doors as possible but if we can get the average into 4 figures we will be doing well IMO.

 

 

3 hours ago, Abshok said:

 


That’s exactly what’s wrong with our mentality, they figures shouldn’t be unthinkable. I did state that that particular game was a very special occasion. The product of football back then was of higher standards also but for that game we hit serious numbers.

Population in the Nauld 52k, Kilsyth 12k according to wiki. You telling me that it would be crazy to think we could get an average of 2000-3000 Clyde fans to fill up the home stand? That’s just less than 5% of the population for only those two areas.

That’s not including surrounding areas like Kirky (20k), Stepps (7k) & Glasgow areas where the foundation of this club was built. 18 home games a season, only 18 times in 10 months. You set a target for 9 games in a season (as big teams may take some of the potential fans away) and build on it from there but I do strongly feel that we don’t promote or market Clyde well imo.

Perhaps I just try to see the positive side but I really don’t think getting 2-3k in our home stand is outrageous when the product is there and we have a location like we have.
 

 

You were doing well until the last sentence Abshok, because if the road to hell is paved with good intentions, the quickest ones to lay it are positivity tyrants. 

 

In all seriousness, i do think your figures are a bit bananas. C01 gives a truthful, if a little dystopian picture of plenty of empty grounds witnessing their finest football (could add the two Ayrshire grounds to those mentioned) in a lifetime. Cumbernauld is no more full of diehard football "supporters" than any other town, and that's regardless of Clyde's fortunes. You only need to look at Livingston, who arrived in their town with a clean slate, and within a decade had paraded a trophy and qualified for Europe. Fast forward to the next one, and yes Almondvale was well-stuffed during the recent playoffs, but from the Third Division days through to last season, they barely have scraped the 1000 or so 'home' gates we had at our 'peak'.

 

That said, however, only pulling in the figures we did when actually challenging for some relevance, was evidence of how poorly managed and ill-prepared we actually were to build a substantial and worthwhile Premier League club, off the field.  BC has it spot on, that this requires a great deal of work in order to promote the full package. The only thing that unites Clyde fans frankly is our equal and widespread ability to be cunningly divisive and very often piss on our own chips, even when winning. We might cheer goals in unison but the minute the game is done, the discussions swiftly move to subjects like this very one - who are we, what division do we belong in, where should we play (to cap it at three for now) - and of course we all argue because we think we're right. In our own way, most of us probably are, but it's still a dwindling number even if groups like the Glasgow Branch are getting right tore in with helping the club, on top of individuals' commitments with 200 club or STs, merch, etc. There's no reason we should feel marginalised at all if the club cast its net and seeked to take full advantage of the new generation in and around the town and the city at large, too. 

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18 minutes ago, The Moonster said:

:lol:

Out of interest, what is Dumbarton's ceiling?

I wouldn't know, or suggest they have one Moonie. There's one thing a club struggling against relegation as a matter of natural selection, as Arbroath's more intelligent representative on here seems to believe is the extent of his club's birthright, but i haven't encountered a similar defeatist attitude from any of you guys. As i've said before, a team doing shite doesn't make it "diddy" - revelling in its mediocrity does. 

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3 minutes ago, The Moonster said:

What have Clyde been doing for the last 10 years? 

Arguing amongst ourselves about who's to blame for us being pish, mostly. 

 

I don't see any revelling except from those who believed the lies of a Napoleonesque dictator, who thankfully have now all buggered off from the public gaze. 

Edited by Officer Barbrady
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1 minute ago, Officer Barbrady said:

Arguing amongst ourselves about who's to blame for us being pish, mostly. 

Not idolising completely mediocre players like David Marsh then? Or having a Pat Scullion fan club? Or touting that wee Ferguson lad for great things only to see him end up playing with French school kids in the Lowland league?

Of course you've been revelling in mediocrity, that's all there is for you to revel in. Accept it, you'll feel better for it.

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4 minutes ago, The Moonster said:

Not idolising completely mediocre players like David Marsh then? Or having a Pat Scullion fan club? Or touting that wee Ferguson lad for great things only to see him end up playing with French school kids in the Lowland league?

Of course you've been revelling in mediocrity, that's all there is for you to revel in. Accept it, you'll feel better for it.

You'll notice that the bawbags responsible for such crimes against the sport have been quiet about the individuals concerned when presented with an actual team, for a change. 

 

You're taking a bit of a gamble, taunting the club that's about to replace yours next season, are you not?

Edited by Officer Barbrady
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Why aren't these thousands of fans showing up now? Surely if all of those people have an interest in watching Clyde play at the highest level possible they'd be down there every week giving the club their hard earned cash and Clyde could piss these diddy leagues in straight seasons?
You're suggesting that your current crowds can grow 500% by playing in the Championship. It's delusional.
Fully agree with this.

At the moment kids get in for free to Broadwood.

How many actually attend matches? 30-40 if that?

The reason fans don't attend isn't because of our clubs lack of Cumbernauldness but because they'd rather support the old firm, play with their PlayStations or watch Man. United on Sky.

We should look at teams like Livingston and Hamilton and be realistic.
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