2018/19 Challenge Cup

[The Moonster]

12 hours ago, GordonS said:

Would it be stupid to suggest leaving the Championship clubs out too? How excited are fans of Championship clubs about this cup these days? I always think this competition is a bit harsh in mixing serious full-time clubs with part timers. Tiers 3-5 inclusive would be a cracking cup competition in which all but the bottom end of HFL and LL could realistically hope to beat anyone, and as more of the bigger Juniors start coming into the pyramid competition would get even fiercer.

Colts can GTF, obv. Apart from Cumbernauld... 

"Serious full time clubs"? As opposed to those novelty part-time ones?  

In case you haven't noticed, there have been "serious" part time sides in the Championship for years now. I'm not sure they deserve to be cut out of this cup for having some relative success within the leagues. 

[GordonS]

9 minutes ago, The Moonster said:

"Serious full time clubs"? As opposed to those novelty part-time ones?  

In case you haven't noticed, there have been "serious" part time sides in the Championship for years now. I'm not sure they deserve to be cut out of this cup for having some relative success within the leagues. 

I mean clubs like Dundee Untied, Falkirk, St Mirren, Caley Thistle. In terms of support, long-term success and expectations they're clearly a category above clubs like Airdrie, Arbroath, etc. Do fans of those clubs really care about the Challenge Cup? From what I've seen they tend to regard it as a distraction unless they make the semis at least.

There are often one of two part-time clubs in the Championship punching well above their weight, like Dumbarton and Alloa for a while, and 'bigger' clubs in L1 like Ayr and Raith Rovers, but there's a much sharper dividing line there than between the Premiership and the Championship. If the Challenge Cup means that much to them then great, I'll shut up. 

[The Moonster]

2 minutes ago, GordonS said:

I mean clubs like Dundee Untied, Falkirk, St Mirren, Caley Thistle. In terms of support, long-term success and expectations they're clearly a category above clubs like Airdrie, Arbroath, etc. Do fans of those clubs really care about the Challenge Cup? From what I've seen they tend to regard it as a distraction unless they make the semis at least.

There are often one of two part-time clubs in the Championship punching well above their weight, like Dumbarton and Alloa for a while, and 'bigger' clubs in L1 like Ayr and Raith Rovers, but there's a much sharper dividing line there than between the Premiership and the Championship. If the Challenge Cup means that much to them then great, I'll shut up. 

Just the big clubs who find themselves in the Championship then? What about Queen of the South who have won it a couple of times? Morton? Livingston? It was created to give lower league clubs a chance of a cup, it does exactly that and the fans of each team participating in semis/finals enjoy it and it currently attracts a decent sponsor.  Cut it down to League 1 & 2 only and see if it has the same appeal.

 

[vikingTON]

The point of the current tournament is not to win a cup but rather to secure a three-day away day in some complete outpost of Ireland. 

[GordonS]

14 minutes ago, The Moonster said:

Just the big clubs who find themselves in the Championship then? What about Queen of the South who have won it a couple of times? Morton? Livingston? It was created to give lower league clubs a chance of a cup, it does exactly that and the fans of each team participating in semis/finals enjoy it and it currently attracts a decent sponsor.  Cut it down to League 1 & 2 only and see if it has the same appeal.

 

I didn't say just L1 and L2.

[Bully Wee Villa]

I'd rather punt the Championship teams, too. They have at least a theoretical chance of winning one of the two big cups. Leave the diddy cup to the diddy leagues.

That said, I'm not overly-arsed and would be happy so long as they get rid of the "Colts".

[The Moonster]

8 minutes ago, Bully Wee Villa said:

They have at least a theoretical chance of winning one of the two big cups. 

No we fucking don't.

[Ranaldo Bairn]

GordonS having an absolute 'mare here it seems. Unsurprised.

From what I've read on the "Juniors - what is the future?" thread, the only worthwhile form of football in his eyes is if your toddlers are falling in dog turds on the grass slope behind the goals in some discarded alcopops-strewn wasteland, where you paid thruppence-ha'penny to watch tug-o-war teams pretend to play football.

Now, there is absolutely a place for that, but the inverted snobbery is ridiculous. And to suggest second tier teams should not have a go at some silverware because they, er, either have a few bob (relatively speaking of course) or are overachieving part-timers, is also utter guff.

[Bully Wee Villa]

That's a bit pessimistic. I think it could be Dumbarton's year in 2019... if they manage to avoid Clyde, obviously.

[HibeeJibee]

Tbf - it's true to say the now expanded and elongated format, with 'B' teams and foreigners added, has all but eliminated the chance of SPFL1/2 sides reaching SFs and Finals.

That, like the chance for Championship clubs to win a trophy, was a big positive. Possibly why they took out a round and scrapped seeding for the season just ended.

Edited May 8, 2018 by HibeeJibee

[an86]

Scrap the reserve teams and Welsh/Irish teams. For all it’d be great for fans to get a nonsense trip, its a total headache for part-time clubs to sort out. A lot of work for an absolute nothing tournament. I’ve not been to a game in this competition since they decided to mess with it, and it’ll remain that way until they undo the farcical elements.

[Bully Wee Villa]

I want a Welsh away trip, that's the closest I get to a local Clyde game!

[PB1994]

21 hours ago, GordonS said:

I mean clubs like Dundee Untied, Falkirk, St Mirren, Caley Thistle. In terms of support, long-term success and expectations they're clearly a category above clubs like Airdrie, Arbroath, etc. Do fans of those clubs really care about the Challenge Cup? From what I've seen they tend to regard it as a distraction unless they make the semis at least.

There are often one of two part-time clubs in the Championship punching well above their weight, like Dumbarton and Alloa for a while, and 'bigger' clubs in L1 like Ayr and Raith Rovers, but there's a much sharper dividing line there than between the Premiership and the Championship. If the Challenge Cup means that much to them then great, I'll shut up. 

I certainly did when Tremarco smashed the ball into the back of the net in the last minute of the final.

[Ranaldo Bairn]

I absolutely love the Challenge Cup, and get more pissed off when we exit it in a dull fashion every season, than when we go out the League Cup, no doubt about it.

Simply because it's a trophy we should make a good fist of winning every year.

[GordonS]

On 5/8/2018 at 14:58, Ranaldo Bairn said:

GordonS having an absolute 'mare here it seems. Unsurprised.

All of your post was shite.

Farewell.

[HibeeJibee]

So unless alterations, qualifiers/invitees:

Cove Rangers
Formartine Utd
Inverurie Loco Works
Fraserburgh

Spartans
East Kilbride
BSC Glasgow
East Stirlingshire

Celtic 'B'
Aberdeen 'B'
Rangers 'B'
Hibs 'B'
Kilmarnock 'B'
Hearts 'B'
Motherwell 'B'
St Johnstone 'B'
Dundee 'B'
Hamilton 'B'
St Mirren 'B'
Partick 'B' / Livingston 'B'


R1 byes:

Ross County
Partick / Livingston

Crusaders
Coleraine

TNS
Bangor City

Bohemians
Bray Wanderers

[Radford]

I've seen a suggestion on the Saints forum that we won't be entering a team in the reserve league next season, so not sure how that'll impact on Challenge Cup participation? Will it be the U18s or no team at all? We'll only have two players in the 18-20 age bracket.

[HibeeJibee]

Remember they sneaked in an overage mercenaries mentors rule to reinforce the 'B' teams for this season, tbf.


That said: some U20s + overagers still got pasted. Cant think it'd be better with schoolboys a couple of years younger: but given the only real veneer of legitimacy is provided by the assertion that it's all about developing young players, they could hardly hand entry to full-blown reserve teams either?

Given R1's midweek and the rest are on international weekends clubs could field all manner of first-team pros, while the likes of Celtic & Rangers with big squads could put out outrageously experienced XIs in ties.

Edited May 14, 2018 by HibeeJibee

[algy]

On 08/05/2018 at 22:44, Bully Wee Villa said:

I want a Welsh away trip, that's the closest I get to a local Clyde game!

Hold on ... do you post on the Heroes & Villains forum?

On 13/05/2018 at 20:24, HibeeJibee said:

So unless alterations, qualifiers/invitees:

R1 byes:

Ross County
Partick / Livingston

Crusaders
Coleraine

TNS
Bangor City

Bohemians
Bray Wanderers

Bangor City were relegated to the 2nd tier (didn't meet licence requirements, and failed an appeal).  Probably be replaced Connah's Quay Nomads as they finished 3rd.

This is probably an in idiotic question, but are the Scottish league qualifiers taken from the 2017/18 season or the 2018/19 season?  I mean, say Cowdenbeath get relegated, do they still compete because they were in it, or does 5th place in the Highland league get a place [cos Cove already qualify as a league team]?

Edited May 15, 2018 by algy

[Bully Wee Villa]

Yeah, I post on there as cdbullyweefan.

Cowdenbeath have already concluded their playoff against Cove, and Cowden won.

However, both playoff losers enter the Challenge Cup, as do the teams that finished second, third and fourth in the Lowland and Highland Leagues, so playoff performance makes no difference to whether you qualify or not. Both Cowdenbeath and Cove will be in it (unless the format changes).