The Aberdeen Mega-Hyper New Stadium Thread

[DiegoDiego]

39 minutes ago, Tartantony said:

This is the problem right here and one of the biggest problems in our entire game. For some reason Scottish football fans are incapable of trying something different purely because it's not tradition.

 

Or maybe they don't want to try it because they've seen how shite it is at other clubs?

[Bully Wee Villa]

Relocating miles away to an area devoid of pubs and facilities hasn't exactly helped us. At least in our case it was forced upon us. Aberdeen should ditch this idea. According to extensive research (Wikipedia), the new ground isn't even going to have a larger capacity than Pittodrie so I fail to see the point.

 

 

 

 

[Bambino7]

Why have Aberdeen never buit their own training ground or invested in the local Universities facilities?  Seem completely diddyish to me. 

[Lebowski]

They won't all come from the same place though - some will come from city centre post-pints, some will come from other parts of the City, some will come from outside town. Lots will drive if there is suitable parking. You're right that adequate transport needs to be arranged, however that's a requirement for making the plan successful rather than a reason to be against it.

They might not be coming from the same place, but they'll all be going to/leaving from the stadium. And the numbers are not changing too much there in terms of how many buses it would take to transport that number of people.

I've never lived there or been much outside the city centre, but Aberdeen by all I've heard about it is ridiculously congested as it is? Creating a new stadium outside the population centre reliant on buses and cars to get people there and back sounds more than a bit problematic. I could be entirely wrong obviously and not picking up on stuff.

[ecto]

They should have come south of the city, much of the land around and to the west of Portlethen, is not fit for much really, easy to get to, nothing around it, perfect

Edited August 17, 2017 by ecto

[RussellAnderson]

6 minutes ago, Bambino7 said:

Why have Aberdeen never buit their own training ground or invested in the local Universities facilities?  Seem completely diddyish to me. 

Because we haven't produced any players worth selling in the last 15 years. Did Hibs training ground not come from the Brown/Whittaker/Thomson/Fletcher/Riordan/O'Connor cash? 

Basically, we were far too skint to even consider something like that, and struggling to stay in the division. Only now have we got our shit together and are trying to get this done. Doesn't say very much about the rest of the league if a team who train in cowpat riddled fields can comfortably cement themselves as the second force in the country. 

[Bambino7]

1 minute ago, RussellAnderson said:

Because we haven't produced any players worth selling in the last 15 years. Did Hibs training ground not come from the Brown/Whittaker/Thomson/Fletcher/Riordan/O'Connor cash? 

Basically, we were far too skint to even consider something like that, and struggling to stay in the division. Only now have we got our shit together and are trying to get this done. Doesn't say very much about the rest of the league if a team who train in cowpat riddled fields can comfortably cement themselves as the second force in the country. 

Fair enough but there's no second force in the country.  Why was there at least no investment made in the University sports facilities in Aberdeen? 

[jamamafegan]

Just to summerise my thoughts that posted on the other thread:

1. Stadium design is dreadful - looks like something Darlington would play in. Generic bowl shite. Dons fans who think it looks great are delusional. It has no character whatsoever. 

2. Location is shocking. Miles away from the city centre. A lengthy bus journey awaits home and away fans who probably wanted to have a few pints in the city but no longer can because they have to get a bus to a housing estate. So much for away days. You won't even see Aberdeen.

3. From what I've read Milne wants to move to Kingsford because he'll make money out of it by building flats or something. That stinks.

Enjoy moving to your shite new ground Dons fans. You'll have a season or two of sell out crowds and then the novelty will wear off - just like it did at McDiarmid - and come 2pm on a Saturday people will ask themselves whether they can be arsed going to the game and they'll say "nah."

Aberdeen need a new stadium. But Kingsford is not the answer.

[shootingboots]

21 minutes ago, PauloPerth said:

You've just made that up Tony. Nobody is arguing they don't want it because it's something new. Most fans will have experienced out of town stadia with little in the way of facilities nearby, and if some are saying they don't like them then fair play. Most people I know, their favourite away games are the likes of Tynecastle, Tannadice, Dingwall. How many fans in Scotland list McDiarmid Park, St Mirren, Inverness, Clyde etc as a favourite away trip?

I've been to Dortmund and Wembley and other big arenas watching Scotland, and had the nightmare of waiting ages for a train back into town. They were soulless shells in industrial estates.

Lets be honest, if we all watched football just for the quality of play, we'd just stay at home and watch Barca, Real Madrid etc. The whole match day experience is a massive part of going to a game.

To contrast that, I've been to the Allianz at Munich for a Bayern league game. Sell out 70,000 crowd. We hung around after the game having a couple of pints in the ground checking on the Aberdeen score (2-0 win at Easter Road year they went down). Then went outside and there were still loads of folk milling about so we stayed for another couple of drinks, had some food, then train back into town 2 hours after the game ended. Obviously some people will need to get away straight away, but if the stadiums set up with something like this in mind, instead of the usual disappear after a game the club open up a new 'experience' (for want of a better word). 

 

Tony's right though, no time for sentiment. 

[The Moonster]

15 minutes ago, jamamafegan said:

1. Stadium design is dreadful - looks like something Darlington would play in. Generic bowl shite. Dons fans who think it looks great are delusional. It has no character whatsoever. 

What could they include in the design of the stadium that would give it "character" or "soul" as another poster has mentioned?

[Ross.]

16 minutes ago, shootingboots said:

To contrast that, I've been to the Allianz at Munich for a Bayern league game. Sell out 70,000 crowd. We hung around after the game having a couple of pints in the ground checking on the Aberdeen score (2-0 win at Easter Road year they went down). Then went outside and there were still loads of folk milling about so we stayed for another couple of drinks, had some food, then train back into town 2 hours after the game ended. Obviously some people will need to get away straight away, but if the stadiums set up with something like this in mind, instead of the usual disappear after a game the club open up a new 'experience' (for want of a better word). 

 

Tony's right though, no time for sentiment. 

Getting the fan set up correct on the outside of the ground should be a priority if it goes ahead. Something that will get folk there early and maybe keep them there for a couple after it, as you say. Big difference in Germany is that it is already part of the culture, and for most of the season the weather is much fucking better. That said, it surely wouldn't be too difficult to put up a few tents around the ground with bars in them that can cater for a couple of thousand punters.

The transport issue is probably the main one. The Allianz is in the middle of nowhere but has a train station that leaves you a reasonable walk from the ground, as well as relatively regular bus services when there is a match on. Away supporters won't have much of an issue there but for the home support it sounds like it could be a massive pain in the arse.

ETA: Regarding the desing, I am sure I read that it was based on Bristol City's Ashton Gate? Is that correct, and has anyone been there to confirm it is soulless and without atmosphere?

Edited August 17, 2017 by Ross.

[topcat(The most tip top)]

It's doubtful that you can learn much of any use from comparing the relatively small and isolated city of Aberdeen to Munich, The Ruhr Conurbation or Greater Manchester. These places are an order of magnitude bigger than Aberdeen. 

And while Hearts and Aberdeen fans may enjoy bicker about whose club is "bigger" we both must surely accept that what works for a global megabrand like Bayern might not be directly applicable to an SPFL Middleweight* club. The Allianz Arena has been a success for Bayern but it was a shit idea for TSV 1860 and they're now back in town

 

 

 

 

 

* Super Middleweight in the case of Hearts

Edited August 17, 2017 by topcat(The most tip top)

[KingswellsRed]

18 hours ago, gkneil said:

The RDS should never have been built, each stand should have been upgraded over a period of years like Hearts/Hibs did. Those fans are well within their right to gloat over that. Land was available, but Milne had overreached with spending (£1m Paul Bernard etc), we had built a fucking white elephant and that was that.

Millions of our revenue comes from the RDS. It is the reason we have millions more money than the likes of Hearts. A ground of bus shelters with no revenue streams would not have been any use. We should have probably redeveloped at the time we owned the land but not with bus shelter stands.

[RiG]

44 minutes ago, Bambino7 said:

Why have Aberdeen never buit their own training ground or invested in the local Universities facilities?  Seem completely diddyish to me. 

Bizarrely Aberdeen were offered the use of the ASV indoor pitch when it first opened and turned it down. A fair few Highland League teams use it for training, or at least used to, and I think Aberdeen now do use it on occasions, more during the winter months. Seemed a bit odd that they didn't want to get involved. 

[Bully Wee Villa]

Something like this would be good. Still in the middle of the community at Aberdeen at the docks, and the poor transport links would be partially negated as you could get there by boat.

The breeze off the North Sea might be a bit bracing, but I'm sure fans would get used to it.

[lubo_blaha]

Most German clubs with out of town stadiums also have abundant subsidised public transport links. A shuttle bus service isn't going to be able to service 20,000 people. If it's taking half an hour to get there you'd need about 200 buses to transport that number of people who'd have to be arriving about 2 hours before kick off. In Aberdeen. During winter. And obviously the same amount of time after the game to get them back. That seems implausible.

The transport plan is readily available online. Shuttle buses cover up to 9000 I believe, people also drive their own cars as well, funnily enough. We very rarely hit 20k as it is.

They might not be coming from the same place, but they'll all be going to/leaving from the stadium. And the numbers are not changing too much there in terms of how many buses it would take to transport that number of people.

I've never lived there or been much outside the city centre, but Aberdeen by all I've heard about it is ridiculously congested as it is? Creating a new stadium outside the population centre reliant on buses and cars to get people there and back sounds more than a bit problematic. I could be entirely wrong obviously and not picking up on stuff.

Buses will pick up from across the city centre, 2 park and rides and also private supporters buses from pubs and further afield. AWPR being two minutes from the site will help massively, it wouldn't be built there if it wasn't for that.

Just to summerise my thoughts that posted on the other thread:
1. Stadium design is dreadful - looks like something Darlington would play in. Generic bowl shite. Dons fans who think it looks great are delusional. It has no character whatsoever. 
2. Location is shocking. Miles away from the city centre. A lengthy bus journey awaits home and away fans who probably wanted to have a few pints in the city but no longer can because they have to get a bus to a housing estate. So much for away days. You won't even see Aberdeen.
3. From what I've read Milne wants to move to Kingsford because he'll make money out of it by building flats or something. That stinks.
Enjoy moving to your shite new ground Dons fans. You'll have a season or two of sell out crowds and then the novelty will wear off - just like it did at McDiarmid - and come 2pm on a Saturday people will ask themselves whether they can be arsed going to the game and they'll say "nah."
Aberdeen need a new stadium. But Kingsford is not the answer.

1. It'll be fine once the safe standing is in, should be steeper though. Don't know if it could be much better for £40mil.

2. Away fans can leave the pub half an hour earlier or have a drink in westhill or at the ground (should be allowed for non-OF fans). Although, the ground is being built for Aberdeen fans, not the couple of hundred away fans that turn up.

3. You'd win Aberdeen Mad bingo with an argument like that.

95%+ of our fans have tickets long before 2pm on a Saturday as well, I thought a die hard Dandy like yourself would know that.

[Bully Wee Villa]

Fucking buses. Was the plan written in 1964? Buses are shite.

[RussellAnderson]

3 minutes ago, Bully Wee Villa said:

Fucking buses. Was the plan written in 1964? Buses are shite.

Scotland doesn't really do local trains, outside of Glasgow.

[Bully Wee Villa]

That's why you should build the ground in the city, not out in the sticks.

[RussellAnderson]

3 minutes ago, Bully Wee Villa said:

That's why you should build the ground in the city, not out in the sticks.

Aberdeen doesn't really do leaving-large-swathes-of-the-city-undeveloped though. We're not a post-industrial wasteland (yet).