Jump to content

A Photographic History Of Scottish Football


Recommended Posts

17 minutes ago, HibeeJibee said:

They'd reached the League Cup Final in 1960... finished 3rd in league in 1961, qualifying for the Anglo-Franco-Scottish Friendship Cup, where they played Rouen... and won the Glasgow Cup in 1963 (still a big tournament then)... then got relegated in 1965 and were bust 2yrs later. However you interpret theories of them being deliberately rundown: it was a spectacular, catastrophic demise.

They'd installed floodlights in 1959 - before Hampden - and as noted covered the side terrace in 1962.

Their average crowd went from 12,000 in 1958 and a similar 11,000 in 1961 down to 4,700 in 1964 and then a dire 700 in 1967. No club could lose 94% of their attendance in the space of just a few seasons without almost certainly facing terrible difficulties.

Beat Celtic in the final. As I posted before, 4 years later Thirds went bust and Celtic won the European Cup

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, HibeeJibee said:

Their average crowd went from 12,000 in 1958 and a similar 11,000 in 1961 down to 4,700 in 1964 and then a dire 700 in 1967. No club could lose 94% of their attendance in the space of just a few seasons without almost certainly facing terrible difficulties.

That is an astonishing decline! I know the trend in attendances was downward throughout the 1960s with most clubs, but I wonder why Thirds suffered so badly?

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 minutes ago, Lurkst said:

That is an astonishing decline! I know the trend in attendances was downward throughout the 1960s with most clubs, but I wonder why Thirds suffered so badly?

 

They would have got a couple of 25,000 attendances when Rangers and Celtic came calling, boosting their average by 3,000 per game. They obviously didn't get that in Division 2.

However, it is still a phenomenal drop from 1958 to 1964.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Lurkst said:

That is an astonishing decline! I know the trend in attendances was downward throughout the 1960s with most clubs, but I wonder why Thirds suffered so badly?

 

1 hour ago, Jacksgranda said:

They would have got a couple of 25,000 attendances when Rangers and Celtic came calling, boosting their average by 3,000 per game. They obviously didn't get that in Division 2.

However, it is still a phenomenal drop from 1958 to 1964.

Rangers was their only really massive draw. Here are their crowds for those 4 seasons grouped into thousands/hundreds (rounded up).

1957-58
36,000     v Rangers
24,000     v Celtic
19,000     v Hearts
15,000     v Clyde
14,000     v St Mirren
12,000     v Kilmarnock; Partick
10,000     v Queen's Park; Motherwell; Raith
   9,000     v Aberdeen
   8,000     v Dundee; QotS
   7,000     v East Fife; Hibs
   6,000     v Airdrie
   4,000     v Falkirk

1960-61
33,000     v Rangers
15,000     v Celtic; Motherwell
14,000     v St Mirren
12,000     v Clyde
10,000     v Airdrie; Dunfermline; St Johnstone; Ayr
   9,000     v Raith; Hearts; Aberdeen; Kilmarnock
   8,000     v Hibs
   7,000     v Dundee Utd; Dundee
   6,000     v Partick

1963-64
22,000     v Rangers
15,000     v Celtic
   7,000     v Partick
   6,000     v Dundee
   5,000     v Hearts; Motherwell
   4,000     v Kilmarnock; Hibs; Aberdeen
   3,000     v QotS; Airdrie; St Johnstone; Dundee Utd; Falkirk; Dunfermline
   2,000     v East Stirlingshire; St Mirren

1966-67 (Second Division)
   2,700     v Morton
   1,500     v Queen's Park
   1,300     v Raith
   1,200     v Hamilton
   1,100     v Berwick
   1,000     v Montrose; Albion Rovers
       900     v Brechin
       800     v Arbroath; Cowdenbeath; Dumbarton; Forfar
       700     v East Stirlingshire; Stenhousemuir; Alloa; QotS
       600     v East Fife; Clydebank
       500     v Stranraer


They basically went from drawing 5 figure crowds versus provincial sides in Division One to only barely drawing 4 figure crowds against almost everybody in Division Two.

I've seen it ascribed to redevelopment of surrounding area; neutrals who went to Thirds top-tier games when their own clubs were away but wouldn't after relegation; eventual disenchantment; but none alone explains it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

14 minutes ago, HibeeJibee said:

 2,000     v East Stirlingshire; St Mirren.

The St. Mirren Programmes site gives the attendance as 1555, it was a rearranged midweek game at the end of February.

I can only believe the weather was horrendous as the previous TL v SM attendances were 7,127 (LC 11/08/62), 2,142 (05/04/63, another midweek rearranged, end-of-season league game), 7,811 (16/12/61), 14,000 (14/01/61), 20,893 (SC replay 28/02/61...St. Mirren's biggest ever away win), 15,000 (LC 22/08/59), 10,000 (06/01/60), 8,000 (20/12/58) and 13,000 (30/11/57).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 minutes ago, Arch Stanton said:

The St. Mirren Programmes site gives the attendance as 1555, it was a rearranged midweek game at the end of February.

I can only believe the weather was horrendous

It was arranged at short notice - played on Tuesday night having been postponed on Saturday due to snow. They had been due at Tynecastle the following night but it was put back a week. Incidentally it is given as 1,855 in Third Lanark history book... perhaps somebody had poor handwriting!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Albion Rovers bought the Cathkin Park stand seats and the boardroom sideboard when Thirds went bust.

I don't know if the sideboard is still there but presumably the current wooden seats in the Cliftonhill Stand are the old Thirds seats 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 hours ago, tamthebam said:

Albion Rovers bought the Cathkin Park stand seats and the boardroom sideboard when Thirds went bust.

I don't know if the sideboard is still there but presumably the current wooden seats in the Cliftonhill Stand are the old Thirds seats 

The stand is built with wood from the Ark.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

In the context of Celtic having to play their Europa League game yesterday on a weekday afternoon: I noted that precisely 50 years ago today (Wednesday 20th October 1971), both Celtic and Rangers played home European ties simaltaneously. Evidently the City of Glasgow Police were made of sterner stuff than Police Scotland when it came to having 2 key matches on the same night.

Wednesday 20th October 1971
Celtic 5-0 Sliema Wanderers     (29,000)     European Cup R2 1st leg
Rangers 3-2 Sporting Lisbon      (50,000)     European Cup-Winners' Cup R1 1st leg


Latter tie's return famously finished by same scoreline of 3-2 in Portugal a fortnight later, went to extra-time during which it became 4-3, but referee mistakenly took it to penalties which Sporting won by the itself unusual scoreline of 2-0 (visitors missing all their opening 4 attempts).

UEFA ultimately awarded the victory to Rangers making it "the shootout that never was":

1971110301.jpg     1971110501.jpg

 

Edited by HibeeJibee
Link to comment
Share on other sites

22 minutes ago, HibeeJibee said:

In the context of Celtic having to play their Europa League game yesterday on a weekday afternoon: I noted that precisely 50 years ago today (Wednesday 20th October 1971), both Celtic and Rangers played home European ties simaltaneously. Evidently the City of Glasgow Police were made of sterner stuff than Police Scotland when it came to having 2 key matches on the same night.

Wednesday 20th October 1971
Celtic 5-0 Sliema Wanderers     (29,000)     European Cup R2 1st leg
Rangers 3-2 Sporting Lisbon      (50,000)     European Cup-Winners' Cup R1 1st leg


Latter tie's return famously finished by same scoreline of 3-2 in Portugal a fortnight later, went to extra-time during which it became 4-3, but referee mistakenly took it to penalties which Sporting won by the itself unusual scoreline of 2-0 (visitors missing all their opening 4 attempts).

UEFA ultimately awarded the victory to Rangers making it "the shootout that never was":

1971110301.jpg     1971110501.jpg

 

I was at Airdrie v Huddersfield!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Seems to have been near enough a yearly occurrence for Glasgow to host 2 games in European competition on the same night during 1970s:

Wednesday 20th October 1971
Celtic 5-0 Sliema Wanderers     (29,000)     European Cup R2 1st leg
Rangers 3-2 Sporting Lisbon      (50,000)     European Cup-Winners' Cup R1 1st leg
Wednesday 22nd March 1972

Celtic 1-1 Ujpest Dozsa     (70,559)     European Cup QF 2nd leg
Rangers 1-0 Torino      (75,000)     European Cup-Winners' Cup QF 2nd leg
Wednesday 19th April 1972
Celtic 0-0 Inter Milan (4-5p)     (73,724)     European Cup SF 2nd leg
Rangers 2-0 Bayern Munich      (80,000)     European Cup-Winners' Cup SF 2nd leg


Wednesday 3rd October 1973
Celtic 3-0 TPS Turku                (15,969)     European Cup R1 2nd leg
Rangers 4-0 Ankaragucu      (30,000)     European Cup-Winners' Cup R1 2nd leg

Wednesday 18th September 1974
Celtic 1-1 Olympiacos                 (36,828)     European Cup R1 1st leg
Rangers 1-3 Southamptton      (40,000)     Texaco Cup QF 1st leg

Wednesday 5th November 1975
Celtic 3-1 Boavista               (37,000)     European Cup-Winners' Cup R2 2nd leg
Rangers 1-2 St Etienne      (51,000)     European Cup R2 1st leg

Wednesday 15th September 1976
Celtic 2-2 Wisla Krakow     (30,000)     UEFA Cup R1 1st leg
Rangers 1-1 Zurich                 (35,000)     European Cup R1 1st leg

Wednesday 14th September 1977
Celtic 5-0 Jeunesse Esch     (22,000)     European Cup R1 1st leg
Rangers 0-0 Twente               (40,000)     European Cup-Winners' Cup R1 1st leg
(Partick Thistle 2-0 Bristol City in Anglo-Scottish Cup QF 1st leg was played Tuesday 13th)


Wednesday 27th September 1978
Celtic 1-2 Burnley             (27,000)     Anglo-Scottish Cup QF 2nd leg
Rangers 2-0 Juventus     (44,000)     European Cup R1 2nd leg

Edited by HibeeJibee
Link to comment
Share on other sites

It then happened twice in 1984:

Wednesday 3rd October 1984
Celtic 3-0 Gent                                         (32,749)     European Cup-Winners' Cup R1 2nd leg
Rangers 2-0 Bohemians Dublin     (31,000)     UEFA Cup R1 2nd leg
Wednesday 7th November 1984
Celtic 3-0 Rapid Vienna     (48,813)     European Cup-Winners' Cup R2 2nd leg
Rangers 3-1 Inter Milan     (30,594)     UEFA Cup R2 2nd leg


Celtic v Rapid Vienna was marred by crowd disorder, during which a Rapid Vienna player was struck by an object thrown from the crowd. Having won tie 4-3 on aggregate Celtic were made to contest a playoff at Old Trafford which they lost 1-0.


Wednesday 22nd October 1986
Celtic 1-1 Dynamo Kiev     (47,858)     European Cup R2 1st leg
Rangers 2-1 Boavista           (38,772)     UEFA Cup R2 1s leg



Wednesday 30th July 1997
Celtic 5-0 Inter Cardiff     (41,537)     UEFA Cup QR1 2nd leg
Rangers 6-0 GI Gotu          (44,433)     Champions League QR1 2nd leg



That seems to have been the last time.

It never seems to have occurred in Edinburgh, Dundee or Falkirk.

Edited by HibeeJibee
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...