Fort William tomorrow

[HibeeJibee 7,293]

Unfortunately it depends very heavily on the priorities individual councils - and councillors - put on them.

As noted D&G has numerous 3G pitches: almost every major town now has one.

In contrast the Scottish Borders only has 2 - of which 1 only opened earlier this year and was partly externally funded. Meanwhile there are more plastic hockey pitches than hockey clubs.

[strichener 1,302]

On 12/17/2017 at 22:43, HibeeJibee said:

Unfortunately it depends very heavily on the priorities individual councils - and councillors - put on them.

As noted D&G has numerous 3G pitches: almost every major town now has one.

In contrast the Scottish Borders only has 2 - of which 1 only opened earlier this year and was partly externally funded. Meanwhile there are more plastic hockey pitches than hockey clubs.

And why can't football be played on the plastic pitches that you erroneously call "hockey pitches"? 

[The Mantis 1,945]

1 hour ago, strichener said:

And why can't football be played on the plastic pitches that you erroneously call "hockey pitches"? 

Errr.... because they’re different 

hockey pitches are water based so there’s no bounce. 

[HibeeJibee 7,293]

Yeh, the surface is almost smooth and they're infilled with sand or water. Like in the Olympics.

Plus they've got hockey lines.

[strichener 1,302]

2 minutes ago, The Mantis said:

Errr.... because they’re different 

hockey pitches are water based so there’s no bounce. 

Hockey pitches are not all water based.

[strichener 1,302]

1 minute ago, HibeeJibee said:

Yeh, the surface is almost smooth and they're infilled with sand or water. Like in the Olympics.

Plus they've got hockey lines.

So back when 2G pitches were the norm, these sand based pitches and even the earliest water based (Chris Anderson & DISC) were used for Football without complaint.  It was even a condition of funding that they were put into multi-sport use.  Aberdeen Football Club used to train on the Keith Park artificial surface which was sand based (and used for Hockey!)

[HibeeJibee 7,293]

Well, the ones in the Borders have never been used for organised football, not even for bounce games.

About 10yrs ago the council commissioned an external agent to produce a report - the "Kit Campbell Report" - into future provision of all different kinds of sport facilities in the Borders, with particular focus on artificial pitches (at that time there were no plastic pitches suitable for rugby or football with 1 underway for Galashiels). It was pretty damning about the over provision of plastic hockey pitches, which it put down to them being chosen for every new high school plus the power of the local hockey lobby and the receptiveness of the council to them... That's where the stat about there being more hockey pitches than hockey clubs comes from. It recommended that no new plastic hockey pitches should be constructed although I think one was still put on Tweedbank athletics stadium.

Ten years on and the only other 3G pitch is at Hawick - opened this year, part-funded by the "Bill Maclaren Foundation". Plans for one at Peebles fell through. There are others in the pipeline.

[cmontheloknow 1,925]

I wandered by a shinty game up at Fort William earlier in the year - head count of about 150. It would seem to be a participation sport rather than something hundreds flock to (ok the televised cup finals are busy). The smaller shinty clubs seem to have almost no one watching.

Then again, a top of the table clash here looks very healthy:

 

 

Edited December 19, 2017 by cmontheloknow

[The Mantis 1,945]

13 minutes ago, strichener said:

So back when 2G pitches were the norm, these sand based pitches and even the earliest water based (Chris Anderson & DISC) were used for Football without complaint.  

^^^^^^^

thread in danger of turning into ‘Four Yorkshiremen ‘

[The Mantis 1,945]

39 minutes ago, strichener said:

Hockey pitches are not all water based.

Yeah, I thought sand ones were no longer made but they are. Water based ones seem to be used at the elite levels though. We had a sales presentation  last year and they never even mentioned sand.

[info 80]

17 hours ago, strichener said:

So back when 2G pitches were the norm, these sand based pitches and even the earliest water based (Chris Anderson & DISC) were used for Football without complaint.  It was even a condition of funding that they were put into multi-sport use.  Aberdeen Football Club used to train on the Keith Park artificial surface which was sand based (and used for Hockey!)

 

[Marshmallo 7,037]

18 hours ago, cmontheloknow said:

I wandered by a shinty game up at Fort William earlier in the year - head count of about 150. It would seem to be a participation sport rather than something hundreds flock to (ok the televised cup finals are busy). The smaller shinty clubs seem to have almost no one watching.

Then again, a top of the table clash here looks very healthy

 

Sounds very similar to Junior football.

[info 80]

There was a time when ash and blaize  pitches were acceptable, Fortunately, these days are gone!

But it does go to show you can play a game of football anywhere. So you could play football on a sand-based  hockey pitch. You could also play hockey on a 3/4 G football pitch.

BUT , A  3/4 g football pitch would not last very long if you played hockey on it and  football could not be safely played to a good standard on a hockey pitch.

A good well maintained all weather pitch is a priceless, and well used, asset even in an area with a smaller population.

It  gives schoolkids teenagers and adults the chance to play under the same conditions as professional footballers. eat your heart out Ally McCoist!

 

[strichener 1,302]

11 minutes ago, info said:

There was a time when ash and blaize  pitches were acceptable, Fortunately, these days are gone!

But it does go to show you can play a game of football anywhere. So you could play football on a sand-based  hockey pitch. You could also play hockey on a 3/4 G football pitch.

BUT , A  3/4 g football pitch would not last very long if you played hockey on it and  football could not be safely played to a good standard on a hockey pitch.

A good well maintained all weather pitch is a priceless, and well used, asset even in an area with a smaller population.

It  gives schoolkids teenagers and adults the chance to play under the same conditions as professional footballers. eat your heart out Ally McCoist!

 

The artificial pitches laid in the '80s for English league clubs were what is being referred to here as "hockey pitches".  They may be most suited to hockey but they are multi-sport (including football) pitches.   That there have been technological improvements to the surfaces does not mean that traditional 2G pitches cannot be used for football. 

The bigger barrier to increased use of synthetic grass is the "they cause more injuries" brigade and traditionalists that think football must always be played on grass.

 

[cmontheloknow 1,925]

15 minutes ago, Marshmallo said:

Sounds very similar to Junior football.

yes and no. Not sure if (all) shinty teams charge? If not, it's more akin to the amateurs.

[info 80]

16 minutes ago, strichener said:

The artificial pitches laid in the '80s for English league clubs were what is being referred to here as "hockey pitches".  They may be most suited to hockey but they are multi-sport (including football) pitches.   That there have been technological improvements to the surfaces does not mean that traditional 2G pitches cannot be used for football. 

The bigger barrier to increased use of synthetic grass is the "they cause more injuries" brigade and traditionalists that think football must always be played on grass.

 

I think the original point was  Fort William and there is no way Senior football teams would be allowed to play  on your multi-sport pitch

[strichener 1,302]

14 minutes ago, info said:

I think the original point was  Fort William and there is no way Senior football teams would be allowed to play  on your multi-sport pitch

 

[Ivo den Bieman 2,205]

strichener is on his last afternoon in the office, alone, and needs a plughole of an argument to circle around.

 

[Ivo den Bieman 2,205]

Back on topic, I hope the Fort just write off what is going to be one of their all-time disaster seasons and try ti find a way to becoming a little bit more competitive in the long term.

I saw them a few times last season in HL games, and whilst absolutely chronic at the back, they did have a threat in Scott Davidson (now Rothes) and Sean Ellis ( when home for Christmas from Australia where he normally plays).

Without a strategy beyond just keeping the doors open it's hard to see them lasting in the medium term.

[ICTChris 8,177]

My mate used to play for them - he was a good player and had played amateur for a few years.  It's really being run on the bare bones though.  As IDB says they have had some good players - Scott Davidson was on trial with us over the summer (cut short when he broke a metatarsal) and they previously had John MacLeod, now of Buckie but bought by Brora, who was a really good player.