The OP Posted January 13, 2020 Share Posted January 13, 2020 16 minutes ago, invergowrie arab said: It's a long time since I did my criminal law lectures but I'm pretty sure not having struck the fatal blow is no defence to murder when a pair of you are going at someone with knives. https://www.scotcourts.gov.uk/search-judgments/judgment?id=ea6e86a6-8980-69d2-b500-ff0000d74aa7 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The OP Posted January 13, 2020 Share Posted January 13, 2020 Watched it and I had misunderstood why we were discussing 'no comment' interviews. Neither of them gave one. Cairney gave lots of mixed statements (containing both exculpatory and incriminatory information). There is no doubt he would have been better off had he shut up. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICTChris Posted January 14, 2020 Share Posted January 14, 2020 Eddie Cairney is definitely near the top of my ‘People in a wheelchair that I wouldn’t feel guilty about punching’ list. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirty dingus Posted January 14, 2020 Share Posted January 14, 2020 As the burden of proof is on the prosecutors to prove guilt, I think innocent or guilty you should say nothing. Your forever seeing the CPS dropping cases due to lack of evidence. If it makes it to court and you want to prove innocence/dodge guilt this would be the place to do it. You never see the polis standing outside saying he said he didn't do it, that's good enough for me. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dosser-fae-the-shire Posted January 14, 2020 Share Posted January 14, 2020 Served on a jury before and the folk serving with me were complete fuckin simpletons. “Guilty- he’s a junkie c**t” was one of my favourite quotes. I reckon being a juror should be a full time job with training etc. Having some fuckin idiots being responsible for ruining people’s lives is insane. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shotgun Posted January 14, 2020 Share Posted January 14, 2020 15 minutes ago, Dosser-fae-the-shire said: Served on a jury before and the folk serving with me were complete fuckin simpletons. “Guilty- he’s a junkie c**t” was one of my favourite quotes. I reckon being a juror should be a full time job with training etc. Having some fuckin idiots being responsible for ruining people’s lives is insane. Older P&Bers might remember the Guinness share-trading fraud and subsequent trials in the 1980's. There doesn't appear to be much in the way of doubt about the guilty verdict but I remember the son of one of the accused railing to the press afterwards. His complaint was that the jurors quite clearly didn't understand the issues being discussed. "What business experience do they have? Do they know how the stock-market works? Could any of them tell you now what the case was all about? How can they decide someone is guilty or not when they don't even understand the crime they've been accused of committing?" He too, called for professional juries and I have to say, I think he had a point. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Musketeer Gripweed Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 Only so much you can show on a two hour documentary, I know, but that show left open so many loopholes. Clearly, something happened, but why they have been convicted of murder based on what we saw is beyond me. The authorities who paid money to her without even seeing her for 17 years should be in the dock as well though. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peasy23 Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 Older P&Bers might remember the Guinness share-trading fraud and subsequent trials in the 1980's. There doesn't appear to be much in the way of doubt about the guilty verdict but I remember the son of one of the accused railing to the press afterwards. His complaint was that the jurors quite clearly didn't understand the issues being discussed. "What business experience do they have? Do they know how the stock-market works? Could any of them tell you now what the case was all about? How can they decide someone is guilty or not when they don't even understand the crime they've been accused of committing?" He too, called for professional juries and I have to say, I think he had a point.Don't remember too much about it other than Ernest Saunders winning his appeal to have his sentence reduced due to being diagnosed with Alzheimer's, and then his subsequent recovery after he was released early from prison. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
energyzone Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 Surprised nobody has mentioned the mad former firefighter who dropped the human flesh bomb to the complete amazement of the entire court. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eindhovendee Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 4 minutes ago, energyzone said: Surprised nobody has mentioned the mad former firefighter who dropped the human flesh bomb to the complete amazement of the entire court. That was drama. You could see that the whole court was thinking ... he's a fucking American! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gc_smfc Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 It's crazy that the prosecution just asks for that witness testimony to get dropped, as if the jury aren't already biased by it, even though there's every chance he just wants some press. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The OP Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 (edited) 6 minutes ago, gc_smfc said: It's crazy that the prosecution just asks for that witness testimony to get dropped, as if the jury aren't already biased by it, even though there's every chance he just wants some press. If anything the testimony would’ve biased the jury against the prosecution case as his testimony was so poor it might create a feeling of reasonable doubt where there was none. They dropped it to make it clear that their case still works without the burning flesh. Edited January 15, 2020 by The OP 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oscar P Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 Why did the police not examine the Inverkip cctv footage after unbelievably not checking it in the first instance? (possibly it's only kept for a certain length of time)Also thought the editor did a fine job of embarrassing their BBC colleague.Firstly showing her getting her piece to camera wrong, and then her being told off in court for trying to give opinions, rather than answering the question. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The OP Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 If anyone hasn’t seen it the Nat Fraser documentary on channel 4 a few years back is worth a watch. A similar case insofar as they’re prosecuting without a body or definitive proof the victim is dead. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melanius Mullarkey Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 22 minutes ago, energyzone said: Surprised nobody has mentioned the mad former firefighter who dropped the human flesh bomb to the complete amazement of the entire court. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Musketeer Gripweed Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 The strange thing about the burning flesh American was the lack of a neighbour to back up his story. No way would they be allowed to introduce a complete stranger's evidence without having any other statement to back it up. In fact, the lack of neighbours evidence was completely missing throughout the whole trial going by the show, bizarre. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herman Hessian Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 On 14/01/2020 at 07:17, ICTChris said: Eddie Cairney is definitely near the top of my ‘People in a wheelchair that I wouldn’t feel guilty about punching’ list. genuinely curious - who might be keeping said gentleman from top spot on your 'punchable raspberries' list ? have any other P&B'ers given a less-able person a good shoeing ? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dee Man Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 16 minutes ago, Herman Hessian said: genuinely curious - who might be keeping said gentleman from top spot on your 'punchable raspberries' list ? have any other P&B'ers given a less-able person a good shoeing ? Not a P&Ber as far as I'm aware but I remember Duncan Ferguson giving a guy on crutches a doing at a taxi rank. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flybhoy Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 2 minutes ago, Dee Man said: Not a P&Ber as far as I'm aware but I remember Duncan Ferguson giving a guy on crutches a doing at a taxi rank. Yep, outside the Fubar in Stirling 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Connolly Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 21 minutes ago, Herman Hessian said: genuinely curious - who might be keeping said gentleman from top spot on your 'punchable raspberries' list ? have any other P&B'ers given a less-able person a good shoeing ? Tanni Grey Thompson 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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