Queens v Morton

[Guest Flash]

5 minutes ago, Skyline Drifter said:

I don't think we did lose particularly due to poor defending against United. After the sending off they rarely got near our goal. The goal they did get for me came about as a result of Scott McDonald clearing Brownlie out of the way with a clear foul in the build up. I'm not disputing United were well on top prior to McMullan being sent off but that was mainly directly due to him.

If there was a general acceptance of that result then whilst it was undoubtedly at least partly because it was United away, it was also possibly because it was a travesty of a result ultimately and we should have gotten at the very least a draw (again, accepting that we were maybe fortunate to be still level before the McMullan red card).

Yeah, that was my main point - I don't think we've got a decent right back and Rooney playing yesterday probably wouldn't have made much difference, apart from in an attacking sense.  Plus the formation doesn't help when the opposition have decent wide players. I take your point re their second goal, but I'm not that convinced about the centre of defence either. One clean sheet so far.

And I hope there isn't a theme developing against the better teams where we have a lot of the ball, but can't score.

[palmy_cammy]

5 minutes ago, Mr X said:

Naysmith didn't dick about with the defence though. Rooney was set to play against Falkirk but picked up an injury. All he's done is keep the same back four since.

I'd agree, and I've said it before, that brownlie and Fordyce are the best centre half pairing and I'd play Rooney at right back ahead of Kerr in the centre but it's not really a fair criticism of Naysmith that we've ended up the other way round.

He played Fordyce at right-back in the cup vs Airdrie so it's obviously something he had thought about previously, Rooney getting injured against Falkirk forced his hand that's all.

Everybody seems to have jumped to a big conclusion that Rooney isn't good at defending.  Probably because of the penalty he gave away at Stenhousemuir in what may have been his debut?  I think there is also the stark contrast with his attacking ability which is really good making his defending appear less so.  On the other side of the park you have Marshall who is probably marginally better at defending but considerably poorer going forward.  He remains flavour of the month among most of our fans.

[Homer Thompson]

He played Fordyce at right-back in the cup vs Airdrie so it's obviously something he had thought about previously, Rooney getting injured against Falkirk forced his hand that's all.
Everybody seems to have jumped to a big conclusion that Rooney isn't good at defending.  Probably because of the penalty he gave away at Stenhousemuir in what may have been his debut?  I think there is also the stark contrast with his attacking ability which is really good making his defending appear less so.  On the other side of the park you have Marshall who is probably marginally better at defending but considerably poorer going forward.  He remains flavour of the month among most of our fans.

Thinking about and doing are completely different though. His hand was forced but the point is he didn't "dick about" with the defence, which is what you said.

A lot of the Rooney thing probably comes from the utd game too.

The Marshall lovers are just trying to balance you out.

[Monkey Tennis]

40 minutes ago, palmy_cammy said:

 

• Kane's run would have been an absolutely cracking goal had he not fluffed his shot.  Sums up his time with us so far.  He got up well for a header in the second half as well.  Definitely worth persevering with as he is the perfect foil for Dobbie and Lyle.

Kane was hopeless yesterday and he's offered very little thus far that hasn't been.

For the first chance you mention, he gathered the ball well, but did little thereafter.  He didn't actually beat anyone, but the defence parted anticipating a pass being slid through to one of the accompanying attackers.  The 'shot' that finished things was typically laughable.  

The header was a really bad miss from close range.  Getting it on target would almost certainly have resulted in a goal, but he just popped it up in the air.

He ought to be a decent foil for our other ageing front players, as he's younger, quicker and more energetic.  It didn't happen yesterday though. His touch was poor and he kept losing out in 50/50s.  

He's urgently needing to show a lot more, or persevering with him will look perverse.

[Fae_the_'briggs]

1 hour ago, palmy_cammy said:

The phrase "game management" is very popular with managers at the moment, and yesterday was an example of it being carried out very well by Morton.  We had the best of the first 15 minutes and the entire second half but Morton still managed to see the game out in relative comfort.  They scored their goals at good times in the game and then just happily saw it out.  Very frustrating from our point of view.  We resorted to desperation punts forward far too early.  We played as if it was the last 5 minutes for the last 35.

I'm going to lay some of the blame at Naysmith's door for this one.  We all said it pre-match.  If you are going to play that formation you need your full-backs to get forward.  Fordyce tried but lacked quality despite getting into some good areas.  He is very much a centre-half playing right back.  Very frustrating with two right-backs on the bench, and even more so when his partnership with Brownlie was looking so solid.  We've started leaking goals since Naysmith started dicking about with the defence.  Kerr looked very nervous in the first half.  Back to Fordyce and Brownlie next week please.  What makes it even worse is that both goals came from our right-hand side, with Quitongo showing Fordyce a clean pair of heels for the first.  Presumably the logic was that Fordyce would offer us more defensive protection than Rooney, which perhaps he would have.  In the end it still wasn't enough, and we lost out on an attacking option down that side.  I'm all for trying to nullify the opposition's threats, but in home games I'd prefer we concentrated on playing to our own strengths.

Other notable things worth mentioned:

• Dobbies' freekick was very unlucky (the first one, not the one near the end!).
• Kane's run would have been an absolutely cracking goal had he not fluffed his shot.  Sums up his time with us so far.  He got up well for a header in the second half as well.  Definitely worth persevering with as he is the perfect foil for Dobbie and Lyle.
• Tapping was woeful and Jacobs probably had his worst game for us.  He's almost as good at giving it away as he is at winning it back!
• Harkin's is the white, bald, Scottish equivalent of Marouane Fellaini.  I've no idea how he escaped without a booking for persistent fouling.  Bossed the game though, as he usually does against us.
• As already pointed out, woefully inept showing from the referee.  Despite having nothing much to do he still got it all wrong.  Spoiled the flow of the second half by constantly giving free kicks for minor niggles.  It played into Morton's hands a bit as they ran down the clock.
• Nice to see a big away support down at Palmerston, something that will be a rare sight this season.

If we want to make a serious push for the playoffs we need a better return of one point from games like this and Livingston last week.  However on the overall scheme of things I'm not too downhearted as it was a decent enough performance.  It does however put a bit of pressure on the next few away games as we can't afford to go multiple games without a win like last season.

^^^^ Very much in agreement with this.  I was midway through writing a similar post but this about says it all from my point of view.  Persist in playing 3 in the middle and I don't think we will get any joy in our travels in the next two weeks. Also Fordyce has been solid in the middle of defence so needs to go back there with Rooney coming in at right back at the expense of Kerr.

Edit to add: After Dobbie's late free-kick,  Speedy Byers was last sent running up to the prison to ask for the ball back. 

[Homer Thompson]

6 minutes ago, Monkey Tennis said:

Kane was hopeless yesterday and he's offered very little thus far that hasn't been.

For the first chance you mention, he gathered the ball well, but did little thereafter.  He didn't actually beat anyone, but the defence parted anticipating a pass being slid through to one of the accompanying attackers.  The 'shot' that finished things was typically laughable.  

The header was a really bad miss from close range.  Getting it on target would almost certainly have resulted in a goal, but he just popped it up in the air.

He ought to be a decent foil for our other ageing front players, as he's younger, quicker and more energetic.  It didn't happen yesterday though. His touch was poor and he kept losing out in 50/50s.  

He's urgently needing to show a lot more, or persevering with him will look perverse.

You're right, he does continue to disappoint. However I know what Cammy means about a perfect foil. He runs into channels and closes defenders down more than anyone else in the squad. If Dykes had taken the couple of chances he had in the last few games he might well have found himself in the team, but in terms of strikers who dont score Kane is still ahead

[palmy_cammy]

8 minutes ago, Mr X said:

Thinking about and doing are completely different though. His hand was forced but the point is he didn't "dick about" with the defence, which is what you said.

A lot of the Rooney thing probably comes from the utd game too.

The Marshall lovers are just trying to balance you out.

So Rooney was set to play against Falkirk suggesting he is the first choice right-back, yes?

He has now been available for the last two games but not played.  Instead he has opted to break up what both of us agree is the best central defensive partnership.

You don't view that as dicking about?

[Venti]

You really aren't taking this well Mr X.

[GiGi]

My favourite part was finding myself upside down after falling over a row of seats in the first half. 

[Homer Thompson]

49 minutes ago, palmy_cammy said:

So Rooney was set to play against Falkirk suggesting he is the first choice right-back, yes?

He has now been available for the last two games but not played.  Instead he has opted to break up what both of us agree is the best central defensive partnership.

You don't view that as dicking about?

Of course its not. "Dicking about" is making changes for no reason. He was forced to play someone else at right back against Falkirk and has kept the same team. The fact that you, or I, disagree with what the best defence is doesnt mean Naysmith is "dicking about". 

17 minutes ago, Slenderman said:

You really aren't taking this well Mr X.

lol wut

[JessieField]

Does it occur to anyone that maybe our manager HAS to pick the St Johnstone loanees first otherwise we wouldn't have got them on loan? If Kerr has to be fitted in, then we'd be better playing with a back 3 of Fordyce, Kerr and Brownlie, with Rooney and Marshall as wing backs told to get up the pitch in a midfield 5. When I saw the team sheet yesterday I was disappointed to see no wingers in the starting 11.

[tonnitus]

Scenes from behind the goal. Tontastic rapid as ever

[Homer Thompson]

1 minute ago, JessieField said:

Does it occur to anyone that maybe our manager HAS to pick the St Johnstone loanees first otherwise we wouldn't have got them on loan? If Kerr has to be fitted in, then we'd be better playing with a back 3 of Fordyce, Kerr and Brownlie, with Rooney and Marshall as wing backs told to get up the pitch in a midfield 5. When I saw the team sheet yesterday I was disappointed to see no wingers in the starting 11.

Given that Kerr was on the bench against Dundee United and Dumbarton and would have been on the bench against Falkirk had Rooney not been injured it would seem unlikely its the case for him. I think its a far simpler case of him coming in and playing well enough to keep his place.

You might be right about Kane, though, hes started every game, bar the Berwick cup game.

We've played without wingers for the majority of the season but without Carmichael in the midfield 3 we do lack pace and someone to pick up the ball and carry it forward. Tapping has come in and replaced him but hes been far too inconsistent. On his day hes great but we're not seeing it often enough

[JessieField]

Just now, Mr X said:

Given that Kerr was on the bench against Dundee United and Dumbarton and would have been on the bench against Falkirk had Rooney not been injured it would seem unlikely its the case for him. I think its a far simpler case of him coming in and playing well enough to keep his place.

You might be right about Kane, though, hes started every game, bar the Berwick cup game.

We've played without wingers for the majority of the season but without Carmichael in the midfield 3 we do lack pace and someone to pick up the ball and carry it forward. Tapping has come in and replaced him but hes been far too inconsistent. On his day hes great but we're not seeing it often enough

Stirling on the wing maybe?

[Homer Thompson]

Just now, JessieField said:

Stirling on the wing maybe?

See Tapping! Stirling is another one with the quality but hasnt shown it often enough so far.

Naysmith has switched to a 4-4-2 in the last couple of games. It worked against Livingston but didnt really yesterday. Stirling on one wing raises two questions - who doesnt play up front and who plays on the other wing? 

 

[Venti]

OT:

I hope you pump the Skunks next Sunday.

[JessieField]

1 minute ago, Mr X said:

See Tapping! Stirling is another one with the quality but hasnt shown it often enough so far.

Naysmith has switched to a 4-4-2 in the last couple of games. It worked against Livingston but didnt really yesterday. Stirling on one wing raises two questions - who doesnt play up front and who plays on the other wing? 

 

If he's allowed to, I would have Stirling in before Kane, playing on the wing, with Dobbie and Lyle upfront.

[JessieField]

3 minutes ago, Slenderman said:

OT:

I hope you pump the Skunks next Sunday.

Believe me, so do I.

 

[palmy_cammy]

Did we go 4-4-2 yesterday?  I lost track of the shape altogether after the subs and I think the team did as well.  It seemed to be a case of throw on as many attackers as possible and hope for the best.  Something James Fowler was roundly criticised for I'm sure.  Reminds me of my 12 year old self when playing Championship Manager.

I don't want to take anything away from Quitongo's strike, I think the sheer power in it alone probably would have seen it go in regardless.  It doesn't look like a great starting position from Martin though.  Perhaps understandably wasn't expecting a shot.  He's an upgrade on Robinson but I'm yet to see this outstanding goalkeeper the Dumbarton fans told us we would be getting.  He looks to be carrying a bit of weight as well.

[Guest Flash]

That footage from behind the goal shows Martin's athleticism really well. His feet were at least 6 inches off the ground at one point.