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Dindeleux

Massive fire at high rise flats in London

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Just now, Jacksgranda said:

It is pretty damning, isn't it?

Absolutely. It's not exactly some lone resident rambling about a big bad company. It's a detailed dossier laying out exactly what would happen if neglect on the scale it was happening at continued and an expansive recorded history of these fears being reported to those in control, stretching back several years.

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The cladding couldn't have been fireproofed if the fire spread so quickly, surely?

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10 minutes ago, Jacksgranda said:

It is pretty damning, isn't it?

I don't want heads to roll, I'm looking for quite a few jail sentences across the spectrum.

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I mean, I don't want to go all captain hindsight but surely there are H&S officers who come by and inspect the building on a regular basis?

If nothing else the 'stay put' policy in the event of a fire by itself should have raised plenty of questions, especially give it was such a huge bone of contention for the residents.

Edited by djchapsticks

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It is pretty damning, isn't it?

That is unbelievable, like another mentioned, it's a catalogue of concerns going back years. Surely there will be manslaughter prosecutions on individuals responsible?
Not a time for jokes but couldn't help but notice the nearby tower that caught fire was called "Adair Tower" - which immediately made me think of Red.

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3 minutes ago, djchapsticks said:

I mean, I don't want to go all captain hindsight but surely there are H&S officers who come by and inspect the building on a regular basis?

If nothing else the 'stay put' policy in the event of a fire by itself should have raised plenty of questions, especially give it was such a huge bone of contention for the residents.

I'd have said in most circumstances that was probably the sensible thing to do. Unless the fire is in one of the flats directly beside/over/under you. My old man lived 12 floors up for the best part of ten years and there were a few flat fires in that time, almost always in the lower floors. It would have been more dangerous for him to try and get down past the affected flats than to stay put and wait for the fire brigade.

Looks to me like there must have been serious structural issues that have caused this one. There is no way a fire should be able to spread through a block that size that quickly.

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Not sure if I posted before but I was within a couple of hundred metres of the Address hotel blaze in Dubai 18 months ago, it happened on Hogmanay very close to the Burj Khalifa firework / laser show. From first noticing the fire on the lower 2 floor balconies to it being a 20+ floor blaze took literally 2-3 mins. Cladding was the cause of speed of spread or if I'm not remembering wrongly, more to do with the epoxy that fixed the cladding? It's now unlawful to attach non fire retardant cladding and new cladding has to be retro-fitted to buildings over a certain number of floors.

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52 minutes ago, Jacksgranda said:

The cladding couldn't have been fireproofed if the fire spread so quickly, surely?

Very doubtful, even if it was. Possibly a 30 minute rating, something like that.

As the above mentions, the expoxy has a lot to do with it.

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38 minutes ago, Ross. said:

I'd have said in most circumstances that was probably the sensible thing to do. Unless the fire is in one of the flats directly beside/over/under you. My old man lived 12 floors up for the best part of ten years and there were a few flat fires in that time, almost always in the lower floors. It would have been more dangerous for him to try and get down past the affected flats than to stay put and wait for the fire brigade.

Looks to me like there must have been serious structural issues that have caused this one. There is no way a fire should be able to spread through a block that size that quickly.

Don't know if I heard correctly but I think they said that in this particular tower block there's only one set of stairs so they don't want hundreds of people going down the stairs when the firefighters are trying to go up them - that's why people are advised to stay put unless they are in immediate danger.

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Call me cynical if you like but, this is fucking bollocks.  We require a government, there is a country to run. 
Tory-DUP deal announcement put on hold due to London blaze


Think if any excuse can be found to announce a delay it will be used.

Appallingly cynical use of what is a tragic incident but definitely something that should not be stopping the Government of the country attempting to function.

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9 minutes ago, williemillersmoustache said:

Call me cynical if you like but, this is fucking bollocks.  We require a government, there is a country to run. 

Tory-DUP deal announcement put on hold due to London blaze

They know fine well that a flat block on fire will get higher ratings than an announcement from a 'dead woman walking' about a party that the general public had never heard of until last week.

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10 minutes ago, MEADOWXI said:

 


Think if any excuse can be found to announce a delay it will be used.

Appallingly cynical use of what is a tragic incident but definitely something that should not be stopping the Government of the country attempting to function.

 

Quite, anything to kick the can down the road. Despicable

5 minutes ago, Hedgecutter said:

They know fine well that a flat block on fire will get higher ratings than an announcement from a 'dead woman walking' about a party that the general public had never heard of until last week.

Wonder if this has any bearing on today:

Full list of landlord Tory MPs who voted against making properties 'fit for human habitation'

A proper who's who of who's a b*****d that list. 

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There is no way that cladding should have been approved unless it was signed off on a warrant​ by a building control officer.

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1 hour ago, Jacksgranda said:

The cladding couldn't have been fireproofed if the fire spread so quickly, surely?

I quite agree but don't call me surely.

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58 minutes ago, williemillersmoustache said:

Every story like a towering inferno needs a local hero.  Step forward the guy who catches baby thrown from 10th floor (according to that site anyway):

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/london-fire-grenfell-tower-baby-caught-by-stranger-after-mother-threw-it-10th-floor-1626237

Sounds exceptionally dubious though.

Edited by Hedgecutter

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Had a similar fire here, with thankfully no deaths, where the cladding used (which was highly flammable) was superficially indistinguishable from the compliant stuff but much cheaper. Turned out to be a widespread scam.
http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/docklands-apartment-fire-hundreds-of-highrise-towers-to-be-investigated-for-fire-danger-20150428-1mvc9j.html

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2 minutes ago, Arabdownunder said:

Had a similar fire here, with thankfully no deaths, where the cladding used (which was highly flammable) was superficially indistinguishable from the compliant stuff but much cheaper. Turned out to be a widespread scam.
http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/docklands-apartment-fire-hundreds-of-highrise-towers-to-be-investigated-for-fire-danger-20150428-1mvc9j.html

I was wondering if perhaps the contractors were scamming it and using cheap unregulated stuff rather than complaint cladding, save the cash.

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