Junior football, what is the future?

[FairWeatherFan]

5 minutes ago, Ginaro said:

Not seen this posted here - TJ has commented on the PWG in this week's Loony Joons https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/junior-football-pyramid-talks-hit-21403790

 

Yeah, there's no rush here. West clubs were kind of expecting to be in the pyramid for 2019-20. A wait until 2021-22 is no biggy.

TJ getting that extra year's salary before retirement.

[perthmo]

IF a handful of the westmost EoSFL clubs were persuadable and recruited for the purpose of kicking off this new WoSFL - say, those West of the Queensferries, then add in Ressies. from Stranny, BSCG & Caley Braves, plus some progressive SoSFL clubs, like Bonnyton and maybe a couple others (whom I can't name, but who are committing to licencing)  - then Kilwinning & Clydebank would automatically have a functional League being formed about them. There'd be at very least a dozen sides already making up the numbers, more if further WJFL clubs jump ship.
The point of this legerdemain is to guarantee the new League begins asap. The deal for the 'borrowed' EoSFL teams is that season-by-season, as more WJFL clubs join in, they'll get reabsorbed back into their natural East environment one-by-one. This new League could even allow say, 2-4 top EJFL clubs to be promoted/voted-in to sustain numbers. It would establish a 'soft-border' between WoSFL & EoSFL divisions, sufficient to perhaps somewhat equalise membership numbers between them.
Obviously, once the guarantee's put on the table, the WoSFL should prove a much more attractive proposition.
 

I have read some pish on here over the years but the suggestion that East clubs might join a West League takes the biscuit.

[Guest]

IF a handful of the westmost EoSFL clubs were persuadable and recruited for the purpose of kicking off this new WoSFL - say, those West of the Queensferries, then add in Ressies. from Stranny, BSCG & Caley Braves, plus some progressive SoSFL clubs, like Bonnyton and maybe a couple others (whom I can't name, but who are committing to licencing)  - then Kilwinning & Clydebank would automatically have a functional League being formed about them. There'd be at very least a dozen sides already making up the numbers, more if further WJFL clubs jump ship.
The point of this legerdemain is to guarantee the new League begins asap. The deal for the 'borrowed' EoSFL teams is that season-by-season, as more WJFL clubs join in, they'll get reabsorbed back into their natural East environment one-by-one. This new League could even allow say, 2-4 top EJFL clubs to be promoted/voted-in to sustain numbers. It would establish a 'soft-border' between WoSFL & EoSFL divisions, sufficient to perhaps somewhat equalise membership numbers between them.
Obviously, once the guarantee's put on the table, the WoSFL should prove a much more attractive proposition.
 

Frustrating to say the least. Caley Braves and bsc Glasgow play lowland league. They play at the tier that will ultimately be above any new wosfl.

I don't concur with west clubs joining the sosfl, there is no need. Get discussions going about a newly formed wosfl and invite applications.

Junior clubs can't now expect others to set up a new league for them without the clubs making the first move and informing others, say the LL or eosfl, of their interest.

[Vuvuzela]

2 minutes ago, perthmo said:

I have read some pish on here over the years but the suggestion that East clubs might join a West League takes the biscuit.

Finish your post after the phrase  "pish on here" and you've summed up 981 pages of conjecture.

[FairWeatherFan]

7 minutes ago, G4Mac said:

Frustrating to say the least. Caley Braves and bsc Glasgow play lowland league. They play at the tier that will ultimately be above any new wosfl.
 

Its the reserve sides not the main clubs. Which was a factor behind the BSC attempt at starting a WoSFL and Caledonian Braves have their reserves in the SoSFL so its just a transfer.

 

8 minutes ago, G4Mac said:

I don't concur with west clubs joining the sosfl, there is no need. Get discussions going about a newly formed wosfl and invite applications.

How else to you get discussions started. There's no certainty of the Lowland League starting one. They might just start a Lowland League Two and hoover up existing licenced clubs. The EoSFL were happy to help aid in starting one but first those clubs had to identify themselves.

Applying to the SoSFL gives the pyramid leagues a list of clubs to work with in starting a WoSFL, within the pyramid at Tier 6. There's no poaching from the pyramid leagues. There's no uncertain jump wondering if you're too few that then has to be backtracked into the SJFA fold.

 

[Guest]

How else to you get discussions started. There's no certainty of the Lowland League starting one. They might just start a Lowland League Two and hoover up existing licenced clubs. The EoSFL were happy to help aid in starting one but first those clubs had to identify themselves.
Applying to the SoSFL gives the pyramid leagues a list of clubs to work with in starting a WoSFL, within the pyramid at Tier 6. There's no poaching from the pyramid leagues. There's no uncertain jump wondering if you're too few that then has to be backtracked into the SJFA fold.
 

Why would you want reserve sides at tier 6 (Stirling university apart that is)? That's a non starter of an idea for me.

The LL have said they are looking at a wosfl or a LL 2 for next year, they need clubs to log their interest with them to set something up. There is no certainty the sosfl would accept those from out with their area either, or junior clubs.

And to suggest east clubs go west is lunacy.

The junior clubs fans are now expecting everyone else to deliver them a league in the pyramid, that's not going to happen without the clubs themselves logging their interest. Other associations will help, but will not be the ones to make the first move, the clubs have to push this.

[Robert James]

7 hours ago, Robert James said:

Yes I know the status of the PWG, but although I consider the PWG stalemate to be sad, I (genuinely) bow to your greater knowledge. Let's see what happens, and whether sufficient West junior clubs bite the bullet. We should know in a week or two, whether any junior clubs will get together and support Clydebank & Kilwinning ? 

I could apologise to Marshmellow , because he considers my contributions on this forum to be  "boring", and that their "style" is not to his liking.  Of course I can't communicate this response to him, as he has 'blocked' me.

However, I will instead, try to make my words simpler for him to understand (see above example, posted earlier today in response to  burnie_man'.) ..............in the unlikely event that he decides to read them again in the future.  Although it would be beneficial (to me) if he doesn't.

Keep smiling MM,  this is only a football forum, with nearly 1,000 posts, and we can't all match your standard.

   

[parsforlife]

1 hour ago, Ginaro said:

Not seen this posted here - TJ has commented on the PWG in this week's Loony Joons https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/junior-football-pyramid-talks-hit-21403790

 

What utter terrible journalism.  I know not to expect much from the record. But when the opening  statement talks of an spfl system(HOW? There’s comfortably more clubs outside the spfl in the pyramid than in it) you know it’s half arsed  even for them.

TJ has outright lied serval times there and it’s printed without question, just dreadful.

Edited February 1, 2020 by parsforlife

[santheman]

47 minutes ago, Vuvuzela said:

Finish your post after the phrase  "pish on here" and you've summed up 981 pages of conjecture.

If Carlsberg did Junior forum posts

[FairWeatherFan]

13 minutes ago, G4Mac said:

Why would you want reserve sides at tier 6 (Stirling university apart that is)? That's a non starter of an idea for me.
 

Stranraer Reserves and Caledonian Braves reserves already exist at Tier 6. Annan Athletic reserves were at Tier 6 last year as well. They're not there out of desire, they're there out of necessity.

The reason they get mentioned is because right now all the clubs from the West Region that are potentially interested in stands at two, Kiwinning Rangers and Clydebank.

The same two clubs that engaged with the BSC proposal idea of a WoSFL and went nowhere. The same two clubs that engaged with the EoSFL's idea of supporting a start up a WoSFL, that went nowhere.

So how do you cobble together a WoSFL with just two clubs and the need of at least another 8 to be even remotely viable, reserve sides.

24 minutes ago, G4Mac said:

The LL have said they are looking at a wosfl or a LL 2 for next year, they need clubs to log their interest with them to set something up. There is no certainty the sosfl would accept those from out with their area either, or junior clubs.

The Lowland League said that to who and where. The only thing close to that is TJ's email update that says the LL hates juniors and don't want them in.

And people keep saying that the SoSFL would not accept clubs from outwith their area. They acccepted an amatuer side/collection of youth teams from East Kilbride. They accepted an academy of kids from abroad playing out of Motherwell. They accepted a kids team out of Kilmarnock. Then went along an accepted the reserve side of the kids from abroad now back to playing out of Motherwell. In fact they only club I can remember the SoSFL rejecting is Gretna 2008, you know the one that plays in Dumfries and Galloway.

Ultimately the point isn't to play in the SoSFL its to log clubs interest in joining the pyramid. So that pyramid leagues can then rally around the applicants and collectively work to the more sensible approach of starting a WoSFL.

[crfc]

Some rubbish gets spoken on here be constructive and get on a committee and put your ideas to those in charge as they seem to be making a balls of it at the moment .

[not man of the match]

The writing to the West Region and writng to the SJFA are things that the committees would consider, not you personally.
You say you believe Clydebank will leave. The other committees have seen that before recently. It was known Clydebank favoured the EoSFL over the SoSFL and then never left for the EoSFL. What weight does it carry that Clydebank are once again considering their options. When those options are Tier 6 SoSFL that has been declined and ignored since 2018 or potentially Tier 8 of the EoSFL and trips to the Borders.
You're talking about a group of people, who for the most part thought it was a good idea to do nothing for another year and slide into the pyramid alongside the Lowland League.

Clydebank are bound by the owners to find a way into the pyramid system. No move could be made until Holm Park was in a position to facilitate such a move.

[Ginaro]

5 minutes ago, G4Mac said:

The LL have said they are looking at a wosfl or a LL 2 for next year, they need clubs to log their interest with them to set something up. There is no certainty the sosfl would accept those from out with their area either, or junior clubs.

Their area currently stretches to Motherwell and as they are supposed to be the tier 6 feeder for the west, I don't think they are in a position to reject clubs just because they are from the Glasgow area - especially if they apply for the purposes of fulfilling the licence requirement to join a pyramid league. (after all Auchinleck were told they needed to join the SoS to get a licence)

We heard the same thing in 2018 about the EoS (they might not accept all those who applied, Perth was outwith their "area", etc), but basically all of the clubs were accepted.

[Sancho Panza]

3 hours ago, Inanimate Carbon Rod said:

Did any club boards or committees make any decisions etc today?

Decent gathering of Side and Nock fans in the bar today and it wasn't even mentioned

[FairWeatherFan]

31 minutes ago, not man of the match said:

Clydebank are bound by the owners to find a way into the pyramid system. No move could be made until Holm Park was in a position to facilitate such a move.

I know that Clydebank would have moved in 2018 if they were able. But for the 61 other West Region clubs that haven't declared anything, it looks like 2 years of being happy staying in the SJFA until they can work out a way into the pyramid.

[FairWeatherFan]

8 minutes ago, Ginaro said:

We heard the same thing in 2018 about the EoS (they might not accept all those who applied, Perth was outwith their "area", etc), but basically all of the clubs were accepted.

SoSFL has 15 members already. Clydebank and Kilwinning apply that's 17 on paper. A 32 game league season without everyone having floodlights and long distance travel plus a lot of the cups would require an extra round fitted in. That's near enough unworkable

The SoSFL don't want that. Clydebank and Kilwinning are only applying because its their only way into the pyramid. The clubs, SoSFL, LL and EoSFL get together and work on forming a WoSFL. The link up with the SoSFL could even see Bonnyton Thistle and Caledonian Braves reserves move to the WoSFL if everyone was interested in that. Suddenly the prospective WoSFL has doubled to four clubs, has the support of the pyramid leagues and only needs 6-8 more clubs to make a viable first season. Instead of 8-10.

[Che Dail]

2 hours ago, Vuvuzela said:

Finish your post after the phrase  "pish on here" and you've summed up 981 pages of conjecture.

 

[Guest]

Their area currently stretches to Motherwell and as they are supposed to be the tier 6 feeder for the west, I don't think they are in a position to reject clubs just because they are from the Glasgow area - especially if they apply for the purposes of fulfilling the licence requirement to join a pyramid league. (after all Auchinleck were told they needed to join the SoS to get a licence) We heard the same thing in 2018 about the EoS (they might not accept all those who applied, Perth was outwith their "area", etc), but basically all of the clubs were accepted.

 

They are for the south of the country. One outlier club. 

A west league is the answer not joining the sos.

 

The LL have intimated their support for a wosfl, numerous times, publicly and privately, as have the eosfl. The LL have also always spoken about forming a LL2 as it's a softer landing for their clubs.

 

What they wont do, without contact from west junior clubs, is set up a league.

 

At the end of the day the juniors have had every opportunity to join. If they truly want to play in the pyramid waiting on someone else doing it for you isn't going to work. Meet at committee level, contact the LL, sosfl and eosfl and indicate your interest, then, if they feel they have enough interest they would get a wosfl set up with clubs help.

 

Or, sit and wait for either the sjfa or someone else to do it and you will still be right here in 5 years time, out if the pyramid, not licensed, trying to row away from the sinking ship, in a dingy, with one paddle, going round and round in a circle.

 

 

 

[Robert James]

1 hour ago, FairWeatherFan said:

SoSFL has 15 members already. Clydebank and Kilwinning apply that's 17 on paper. A 32 game league season without everyone having floodlights and long distance travel plus a lot of the cups would require an extra round fitted in. That's near enough unworkable

The SoSFL don't want that. Clydebank and Kilwinning are only applying because its their only way into the pyramid. The clubs, SoSFL, LL and EoSFL get together and work on forming a WoSFL. The link up with the SoSFL could even see Bonnyton Thistle and Caledonian Braves reserves move to the WoSFL if everyone was interested in that. Suddenly the prospective WoSFL has doubled to four clubs, has the support of the pyramid leagues and only needs 6-8 more clubs to make a viable first season. Instead of 8-10.

BSC Glasgow Reserves would surely apply to join a WoSL, having raised the issue of the need for a senior West League a few years ago.

But if reserve sides can join, what is to stop Celtic & Rangers Colts ?

Edited February 2, 2020 by Robert James

[GNU_Linux]

BSC Glasgow Reserves would surely apply to join a WoSL, having raised the issue of the need for a senior West League a few years ago.

Wouldn't think so as their reserve team joined SPFL Reserve League 2 this season