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Burnie_man

Junior football, what is the future?

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27 minutes ago, santheman said:

There is absolutely no chance of teams in the lower leagues getting a licence unless a sugar daddy comes on board with the ones who own their own grounds(egDarvel) or the Local Authority help fund the improvements necessary for teams who play on Council owned pitches (eg Yoker) so the lure of SFA money is ,in their eyes, nothing but pie in the sky.

Well these clubs are little different to clubs in the EoS who are currently putting up lights and going through the process (or already have a licence).

I wouldn't describe St.Andrews, Haddington, Coldstream, Burntisland Shipyard or the like giants of the game or backed by sugar daddies, but they have managed it.

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Did you see the stuff from the Montrose Roselea guy today? The north are still part of what's going on. A meeting was held last week between the HL and NRSJFA.
So why not split the sjfa into its 3 regions and let each region negotiate their own entry into the pyramid? They surely couldn't make as much of a mess of this on their own if they tried, like really hard.

Let the North speak with the HL, let the west speak with.... Oh wait the west is and always has been a penalty kick.

And let the east discuss with the eos what conference they want to join.

Then let that happen naturally, over time and at a pace that's suits each region.

Another quick point. Junior clubs like Talbot and others who are getting licence ready, they do realise you can't get your sfa licence if you play out with the Pyramid? It's part of the whole process that underpins the licence, you have to currently play in a pyramid league. And if you want to play LL football you must have a licence. Therefore the only way to get your licence is to join at tier 6, get your licence then work towards the LL.

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6 minutes ago, Robert James said:

...I suspect that the answer is "no", which can only mean that there is absolute fear on the part of the Junior' hierarchy' that 'pyramid-itis'  will infect its clubs and be incurable...

In reality SJFA clubs decided almost unanimously to enter the pyramid at their 2018 AGM. The SJFA's end game is to enter the pyramid as an intact national association and the SFA are trying to help them achieve that through Option Z.

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4 minutes ago, G4Mac said:

....And if you want to play LL football you must have a licence. Therefore the only way to get your licence is to join at tier 6, get your licence then work towards the LL.

The rules on that are set by the SFA board. If the SFA board want to pass on applications to the licensing committee they will.

Edited by LongTimeLurker

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I'm sorry lurker you are wrong. They won't do that. If they did their organisational reputation would be in tatters. You cannot have a policy and a process in place then forget about it when it suits you. It isn't the way business works.

I'm sure the sfa board don't pass things to the licensing committee, I'm pretty sure the licensing committee deal with everyting until the audit and then they pass it to the board for ratification and sign off.

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7 minutes ago, LongTimeLurker said:

In reality SJFA clubs decided almost unanimously to enter the pyramid at their 2018 AGM. The SJFA's end game is to enter the pyramid as an intact national association and the SFA are trying to help them achieve that through Option Z.

"Fear" is the 'reality' factor.  Otherwise the SJFA would have openly published the statistics/preferences arising from each of the 4 Options.

Are these results important ? Yes. For all we know the aggregated highest preference ('vote') from the lower division Junior clubs, may have outweighed that of the Premiership clubs.  This view is of course 'speculation', as the 'reality' situation has not been published !

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17 minutes ago, LongTimeLurker said:

The rules on that are set by the SFA board. If the SFA board want to pass on applications to the licensing committee they will.

When the current version of Licencing was introduced, there was no requirment to join the Pyramid, hence why Linlithgow and Banks O'Dee are Licenced.  That was quickly changed by the SFA Board to say you must be committed to join the Pyramid.

I really can't see them engaging reverse and going back on that after everything that has happened, and if they really do want a LL West/East at some point, then they don't want to upset the LL clubs who have worked their backsides off to meet requirements (and some still are trying).

Try telling Vale of Leithen or Civil Service Strollers you can now come in at tier 5 without a Licence.

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After this omnishambles - what's the chances of a WoSFL (tier 6) breakaway for 2020-21?

Obviously Clydebank would probably be the leaders in this. You'd 10 clubs for it to work 

Clydebank (and Yoker), Rutherglen, Pollok, Arthulie, Glasgow Uni*, Petershill, Cumnock and then you'd only need a couple more.
 

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13 minutes ago, ArabAuslander said:

After this omnishambles - what's the chances of a WoSFL (tier 6) breakaway for 2020-21?

Obviously Clydebank would probably be the leaders in this. You'd 10 clubs for it to work 

Clydebank (and Yoker), Rutherglen, Pollok, Arthulie, Glasgow Uni*, Petershill, Cumnock and then you'd only need a couple more.
 

Pollok cant have lights afaik ... due to neighbouring flats. Bens ( and Rossvale ) have lights as do Renfrew. Sure others - Kilwinning and Talbot for example - could move quickly if needs be

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1 minute ago, BANKIEBILL said:

Pollok cant have lights afaik ... due to neighbouring flats. Bens ( and Rossvale ) have lights as do Renfrew. Sure others - Kilwinning and Talbot for example - could move quickly if needs be

Wouldny need lights for tier 6 though

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Just now, BANKIEBILL said:

Pollok cant have lights afaik ... due to neighbouring flats. Bens ( and Rossvale ) have lights as do Renfrew. Sure others - Kilwinning and Talbot for example - could move quickly if needs be

You don't necessarily need lights to play at Tier 6. But aye I imagine that the a bunch of teams have been royally pissed off by last night.

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i dont think they can stay at Newlandsfield and have lights ( ie no promotion ) although id be delighted if that were not the case

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3 minutes ago, ArabAuslander said:

... But aye I imagine that the a bunch of teams have been royally pissed off by last night.

Not if they think they have a potential shortcut to tier 5 and have been led to believe rightly or wrongly (time will tell) that Option Z has the support of the SFA board, the SPFL and LL.

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6 minutes ago, BANKIEBILL said:

i dont think they can stay at Newlandsfield and have lights ( ie no promotion ) although id be delighted if that were not the case

That's a common assumption that afaik has never been seriously looked into. There are training lights already in place but I'm not sure whether they are currently operational.

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12 minutes ago, BANKIEBILL said:

Pollok cant have lights afaik ... due to neighbouring flats. Bens ( and Rossvale ) have lights as do Renfrew. Sure others - Kilwinning and Talbot for example - could move quickly if needs be

That would depend on the attitude of the Planning Authority. There are houses backing right on to Beechwood Park on three sides, but Talbot will soon have lights.

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That would depend on the attitude of the Planning Authority. There are houses backing right on to Beechwood Park on three sides, but Talbot will soon have lights.

Likewise at Dunipace, houses on 3 sides. Diffusers fitted on the directional lights to prevent as much leakage as possible in the wrong directions and planning were happy enough.

 

But either way a moot point, lights are needed for a licence, not for Tier 6. One of many reasons that the preferred option from last night feels like selling clubs up the garden path, again.

 

I know it hasn't been discussed, but It's almost like they are hoping the debate on a LL split will stop folk noticing that plan Z also includes ERSJFA at Tier 6, which was unanimously rejected last year for reasons that haven't changed and are not considered in the plan.

 

 

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1 hour ago, Burnie_man said:

Well these clubs are little different to clubs in the EoS who are currently putting up lights and going through the process (or already have a licence).

I wouldn't describe St.Andrews, Haddington, Coldstream, Burntisland Shipyard or the like giants of the game or backed by sugar daddies, but they have managed it.

Can't comment on EOS clubs but there is little or no financial help through this neck of the woods (particularly Lanarkshire).

Teams are signing  more and more players on Amateur contracts because they can no longer afford the wages and are even struggling to pay expenses  in some cases, so the chances of them raising 40/50/60k plus for lights etc off their own backs is pretty remote.  The local authorities (from experience) are not interested in anything other than keeping the council owned stadiums in a decent state of repair, nothing more, and charging plenty for the priviledge of playing in them.

Maybe some of these EOS teams could share their scources for funding ?

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iirc aren't clubs from ex-mining communities eligible for grants for some regeneration fund thing?

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9 minutes ago, santheman said:

Can't comment on EOS clubs but there is little or no financial help through this neck of the woods (particularly Lanarkshire).

Teams are signing  more and more players on Amateur contracts because they can no longer afford the wages and are even struggling to pay expenses  in some cases, so the chances of them raising 40/50/60k plus for lights etc off their own backs is pretty remote.  The local authorities (from experience) are not interested in anything other than keeping the council owned stadiums in a decent state of repair, nothing more, and charging plenty for the priviledge of playing in them.

Maybe some of these EOS teams could share their scources for funding ?

I'm not denying that the ground improvements demanded by the licence are cheap. However, other clubs in similar circumstances have managed, through various means. Anyway, you do not need a licence to play in tier 6 or below.

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