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Junior football, what is the future?


Burnie_man

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34 minutes ago, Burnie_man said:

Thanks, I did acknowledge above that the impact of an U20 league in the west may have a negative impact on their existing U21 set-up. That said, my understanding is that it's already in a bit of a decline. The U20's in the east has been a boon as far as I can see, providing a relatively stable environment at that level, and a step up in standard from U17/U19. The east has never really had a wide scale U21 set-up and the WLYFA didn't even run an U21 league, they top out at U19.

 

If senior non league clubs can provide a stable environment for U20 football - and not all clubs choose to go down that route anyway - then that has to be a benefit, but perhaps there should also be an opening for established youth clubs to enter U20 teams as well if they want. For example, in West Lothian, Murieston United from Livingston.

 

Remember, most clubs in the LL U20 Development League have a mix of anything from 16-20 year olds, all of whom are eligible to play senior. Most of our U20 squad were from last seasons U19, some have been released from SPFL academies, some from other clubs too old for U19, and we also have a couple on loan from Livingston FC. I expect next season we'll have an influx from our U19's from this year. Probably 3 or 4 U20's have already played EoS Premier this season. It's great for smaller clubs like us.

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Looking at the tables some of the teams stand out as potential competing teams that couldn't all have a complete player pathway. Pollok Juveniles v. Pollok FC and Barrhead YFC v Arthurlie Juniors.

Maybe that's where the worry lies in the teams that don't have a senior tie up getting locked out of any restructuring. I know in the LL Development thread there was speculation over the LL asking to set up u18 and u16s leagues

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Not arguing one way or the other, but as an ex West region junior team who moved to EoS, we are possibly the only example to look at currently with regards the problem being discussed.

We currently run both an Under 20's in the EoS Dev league and an Under 19's in the WoSYFA.

Both teams have provided players for the senior team this season in competitive games, the 20's as signed players the 19's as trialists.

We've had 19's playing games for the 20's and for the Scottish youth cup (under 18) a mix of both teams eligible players.

Obviously can't say what the future holds across the league, but given our unique position on both sides of the East/West divide which is the point being discussed, worth pointing out how it works for us currently.
Worth pointing out as well that our teams upto and inc U19 are run by B.U. Community Sports Club and affiliated to WLYFA, whilst the senior club directly fund and run the U20's.

I know there's different ways of doing it (Dunipace are a straight top down structure, one club and committee?).

An agreement between SYFA and EoS/LL would help.
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The important thing like bestsinceslicedbread pointed out is get the juniors in the pyramid.
Youth level is going to be ever changing right now. It's not like the LL u20 model is set in stone. The two conference set up was bursting at the seams this season already.
Once the west come in, I guess there's scope for a west conference if they start wanting to enter u20 teams.

I can't see the conference system changing, it works well at that level, although it could become more regionalised.
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On 27/12/2019 at 02:37, Robert James said:

NCL Golspie Sutherland failed to get council permission to install lights, following objections from local residents.

FYI, Golspie were granted planning permission to install lights last month: https://wam.highland.gov.uk/wam/applicationDetails.do?activeTab=documents&keyVal=PYHD7AIHFZ100

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3 hours ago, Ginaro said:

FYI, Golspie were granted planning permission to install lights last month: https://wam.highland.gov.uk/wam/applicationDetails.do?activeTab=documents&keyVal=PYHD7AIHFZ100

I wonder if with the installation of floodlights Golspie maybe forced into the HL, or certainly applying to join the HL

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10 hours ago, FairWeatherFan said:

 

image.thumb.png.db5779e28c9bc0cae93e492f6af3f13f.png

Looking at the tables some of the teams stand out as potential competing teams that couldn't all have a complete player pathway. Pollok Juveniles v. Pollok FC and Barrhead YFC v Arthurlie Juniors.

Maybe that's where the worry lies in the teams that don't have a senior tie up getting locked out of any restructuring. I know in the LL Development thread there was speculation over the LL asking to set up u18 and u16s leagues

The two Polloks are effectively the same team (afaik). One of the biggest issues I see in Scottish youth football is the idea that a coach starts with say an u11s and follows them all the way up. It is so disjointed. Lok have the two in 21s because one lot were 1999s ran by one coach and another were 2000s ran by another that came up from the 19s this year. Or loosely along those lines. BTSSB is the expert on this so can correct any errors there!

Edited by cmontheloknow
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Some good posts in here.

The issue with West 21s is its big teams and the folks that run them are happy playing Saturday afternoon and have little or no connection with junior sides. Even if there is a loose affiliation, I can’t really see how the pathway works during the season. 

I was with 21s for a year and am back at 19s and to be honest neither is at the standard it needs to be at. I’m hoping part of the pyramid switch would see a u20 west league develop as this would create a bit of professionalism within the 16-20 bracket which is badly needed.

 

Our league isn’t even into the new year and 5 clubs have folded. Lack of commitment/drop out and boys working weekends seems to be the biggest factors these days. So to have a proper fri night setup would be great, Creates an environment that retains and grows interest. 
 

Spoke to Camelon Juniors u20 who we play on fri, pitch costs was a huge issue through here when attempting a fri night last last year. £140 is eye watering and the cost to west clubs would have to be looked at. As also mentioned, Talbot don’t have any sort of youth pathway so unsure all clubs would get involved but think there are progressive community clubs out there to get it started for next season.

 

 

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10 hours ago, BTID said:

Some good posts in here.

The issue with West 21s is its big teams and the folks that run them are happy playing Saturday afternoon and have little or no connection with junior sides. Even if there is a loose affiliation, I can’t really see how the pathway works during the season. 

I was with 21s for a year and am back at 19s and to be honest neither is at the standard it needs to be at. I’m hoping part of the pyramid switch would see a u20 west league develop as this would create a bit of professionalism within the 16-20 bracket which is badly needed.

 

Our league isn’t even into the new year and 5 clubs have folded. Lack of commitment/drop out and boys working weekends seems to be the biggest factors these days. So to have a proper fri night setup would be great, Creates an environment that retains and grows interest. 
 

Spoke to Camelon Juniors u20 who we play on fri, pitch costs was a huge issue through here when attempting a fri night last last year. £140 is eye watering and the cost to west clubs would have to be looked at. As also mentioned, Talbot don’t have any sort of youth pathway so unsure all clubs would get involved but think there are progressive community clubs out there to get it started for next season.

 

 

Where is the game played and KO time

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On 29/12/2019 at 00:46, Ginaro said:
On 29/12/2019 at 00:46, Ginaro said:

FYI, Golspie were granted planning permission to install lights last month: https://wam.highland.gov.uk/wam/applicationDetails.do?activeTab=documents&keyVal=PYHD7AIHFZ100

FYI, Golspie were granted planning permission to install lights last month: https://wam.highland.gov.uk/wam/applicationDetails.do?activeTab=documents&keyVal=PYHD7AIHFZ100

Excellent news, which (assuming installation) will preserve their 50+ years SFA Membership.

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On 29/12/2019 at 04:07, ArabAuslander said:

I wonder if with the installation of floodlights Golspie maybe forced into the HL, or certainly applying to join the HL

They can't be forced into the HFL as a way of retaining their SFA membership, anymore than juniors Banks O'Dee could be. It is also doubtful that they would join the HFL voluntarily at this time.

It should be noted that when the North Caley League reps held discussions with the PWG and HFL, early last year, the NCL confirmed the interest of its clubs in becoming a pyramid feeder league, if/when one is created in the north. However the log-jam caused by the NRJFA, seems to have resulted in no further progress, regarding a north pyramid at tier 6 and below.

Given the geographical logistics of the north & west highlands, and islands, any northern pyramid must be split into two separate feeder leagues, as travelling costs for amateur clubs between Aberdeen and Thurso (+ Orkney) would be prohibitive. Worse still if the Dundee & Angus clubs become involved in a north pyramid.

The above situation for the 'north'  needs to be considered fully once the West juniors pyramid entrance is resolved. 

 

 

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3 minutes ago, gogsy said:

Ah going with the "you should only comment on the grade your own team plays in" argument, that's a classic. :)

I asked a simple question, because the thread is related to the Juniors, and I'm interested to know how many people who are Junior supporters actually contibute.

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45 minutes ago, Blackie Gold said:

I asked a simple question, because the thread is related to the Juniors, and I'm interested to know how many people who are Junior supporters actually contibute.

I've followed the buffs for over 30 years hardly missed a game but I'm a football fan and watch rangers when I get the chance and visit other junior teams when the buffs aren't playing . My opinion on junior football is that it come to an end and lets embrace the new .

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2 hours ago, Blackie Gold said:

As a matter of interest how many posters on here actually follow a Junior club?

Girvan - 30-40 years ago.!

Blackie, if you are an exclusive junior follower, do you have any update  on the club's floodlights situation and current SFA Membership ?

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5 hours ago, Robert James said:

Girvan - 30-40 years ago.!

Blackie, if you are an exclusive junior follower, do you have any update  on the club's floodlights situation and current SFA Membership ?

Floodlights will be up in the close season. I think we tick all the other boxes, seating, toilets etc.

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