Cyclizine Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 17 minutes ago, LongTimeLurker said: We'll see what happens, but it's important to remember that it's not the west region that does the negotiating at PWG level but the SJFA doing so on behalf of its entire membership. Their entire membership; apart from The North... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairWeatherFan Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 23 minutes ago, LongTimeLurker said: We'll see what happens, but it's important to remember that it's not the west region that does the negotiating at PWG level but the SJFA doing so on behalf of its entire membership. That's why I said there doesn't have to be any sort of breakaway until March. PWG at the end of January - nothing happens. February is meant to be the only licensing committee meeting before the SFA AGM. News of x amount of clubs will probably filter through. Probably a PWG in March - nothing happens. The East, for the most part, have the EoSFL to move to. So where do the West clubs go after doing all this prepartion for entering the pyramid? Does Clydebank, Petershill, Cumnock etc sit another year out or do they start making noises. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 Start making noises now for me.Of the 4 options only 1 will work for everyone concerned.3 have the west in but I doubt the sjfa will just hand the west over.West clubs have to push this through. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert James Posted January 11, 2020 Share Posted January 11, 2020 10 hours ago, FairWeatherFan said: There shouldn't be at the moment as everything looks good for 2020/21. Any sort of breakaway wouldn't be needed until say March when it looks like nothing's happening again. ......."everything looks good for 2020/21" : Or does it ? Not unless SLL/West promotion and relegation rules comply with the pyramid framework. The SJFA needs to confirm that if any current or future West 'senior' club (eg the Colts or the Braves) is relegated from the Lowland, will slot automatically into the junior West Premiership. Junior clubs having dual membership of the SFA (if licensed) and the SJFA can't be a problem, given the Girvan FC precedent. However it may cause future fixture congestion if leading West clubs do well in both the Scottish and the Junior Cup. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongTimeLurker Posted January 11, 2020 Share Posted January 11, 2020 8 hours ago, Cyclizine said: Their entire membership; apart from The North... It's only the LL side of things that are covered by the current set of meetings. If the SJFA wants to remain relevant as a national association they need either all three regions in or all three remaining on the outside. As things stand at the moment the way to achieve the latter is to only agree to options the EoS can be relied upon to block. This would be the most obvious explanation for why a complete non-starter option from an EoS standpoint (i.e. east region entry at tier 6) is still part of the package for discussion apparently at SJFA insistence. If the west wants in next season best to push very hard for the west in with east left to be sorted out later option at the meeting. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairWeatherFan Posted January 11, 2020 Share Posted January 11, 2020 What does the West Region or WoSFL entering the pyramid for 2020-21 look like: West Premiership / WoSFL season ends the first weekend of May 2021. Licenced West Premiership / WoSFL champion enters the Lowland League pyramid play-off. Start of 2020-21 the West Region / WoSFL, the LL, SoSFL and EoSFL decide which of the 16 clubs in the 2020-21 LL would be relegated where. For the West Region / WoSFL that basically means accepting the possibility of East Kilbride, Cumbernauld Colts, Caledonian Braves and a current SPFL2 club if say Albion Rovers get relegated in 2019/20. That's it. The Lowland League pyramid play-off rules already exist. It's just the format that changes. The SFA have already said they would look over the goverance of Tier 6 after the EoSFL pushed for it. In May of 2013 the Lowland League was put together for the 2013/14 season. There's plenty of time to get this done and the likes of Clydebank that have previously voted to go "senior" to have to worry about what ground they will be playing at in 2020-21, so might turn out to be more vocal as time elapses. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bestsinceslicebread Posted January 11, 2020 Share Posted January 11, 2020 3 hours ago, FairWeatherFan said: What does the West Region or WoSFL entering the pyramid for 2020-21 look like: West Premiership / WoSFL season ends the first weekend of May 2021. Licenced West Premiership / WoSFL champion enters the Lowland League pyramid play-off. Start of 2020-21 the West Region / WoSFL, the LL, SoSFL and EoSFL decide which of the 16 clubs in the 2020-21 LL would be relegated where. For the West Region / WoSFL that basically means accepting the possibility of East Kilbride, Cumbernauld Colts, Caledonian Braves and a current SPFL2 club if say Albion Rovers get relegated in 2019/20. That's it. The Lowland League pyramid play-off rules already exist. It's just the format that changes. The SFA have already said they would look over the goverance of Tier 6 after the EoSFL pushed for it. In May of 2013 the Lowland League was put together for the 2013/14 season. There's plenty of time to get this done and the likes of Clydebank that have previously voted to go "senior" to have to worry about what ground they will be playing at in 2020-21, so might turn out to be more vocal as time elapses. Everything stated Fairweather seems fine and logical. I take it any club that wins the premier West region to get promotion playoff to the lowland must be licensed so if they are not would it fall to second place or no joy then third place etc... In regards to cup, the Scottish Cup, which one do they enter as I've spoken to 7 committee members of 3 different junior clubs recently who all think bar one that they will be playing in the Scottish junior cup. This is the part I've been unsure as I believe they will play in the same Scottish cup that EOS and SOS play in, its this correct and what off the current West of Scotland cup and the other domestic cups, will they continue or change ? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongTimeLurker Posted January 11, 2020 Share Posted January 11, 2020 5 minutes ago, Bestsinceslicebread said: Everything stated Fairweather seems fine and logical. I take it any club that wins the premier West region to get promotion playoff to the lowland must be licensed so if they are not would it fall to second place or no joy then third place etc... As things stand it has to be the champion. So if a non-licensed club kept winning the west region season after season there would be no promotion. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairWeatherFan Posted January 11, 2020 Share Posted January 11, 2020 (edited) 12 minutes ago, Bestsinceslicebread said: Everything stated Fairweather seems fine and logical. I take it any club that wins the premier West region to get promotion playoff to the lowland must be licensed so if they are not would it fall to second place or no joy then third place etc... Current rules with the SoSFL and EoSFL is that only a licenced Champion can participate in the LL Pyramid Play-off. It wouldn't be fair for a licenced champion have to compete against a runner up from another league. If we're assuming that the Lowland League will only have one promtion spot for 2020-21, I don't see that principle changing. 12 minutes ago, Bestsinceslicebread said: In regards to cup, the Scottish Cup, which one do they enter as I've spoken to 7 committee members of 3 different junior clubs recently who all think bar one that they will be playing in the Scottish junior cup. This is the part I've been unsure as I believe they will play in the same Scottish cup that EOS and SOS play in, its this correct and what off the current West of Scotland cup and the other domestic cups, will they continue or change ? The South Region Challenge Cup is only for SFA members and those in the Lowland League, EoSFL and SoSFL. You will notice that Girvan have the right to play in the competition, yet choose not to take up their spot. Even if they would lose their licence this year they would still retain that right as they took part in the last Qualifying Cup (South). So in 2020-21 all the West Region clubs can continue to participate in the exact same cup competitions. As more members become licenced and participate in the SFA Scottish Cup, then things would have to be looked at with how the Junior Scottish Cup is run. EDIT: To add the South Region Challenge Cup rules. You don't even have to be a SFA member. Right now under current rules West Region clubs other than Girvan would be unable to participate in it. Edited January 11, 2020 by FairWeatherFan 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ginaro Posted January 11, 2020 Share Posted January 11, 2020 6 minutes ago, Bestsinceslicebread said: In regards to cup, the Scottish Cup, which one do they enter as I've spoken to 7 committee members of 3 different junior clubs recently who all think bar one that they will be playing in the Scottish junior cup. This is the part I've been unsure as I believe they will play in the same Scottish cup that EOS and SOS play in, its this correct and what off the current West of Scotland cup and the other domestic cups, will they continue or change ? The rules of the South Challenge Cup would need to be adjusted to include the West Region as one of the leagues eligible to take part. It might just be simpler to keep the status quo for 2020-21 and then try to come up with a non-league trophy to replace/merge the Junior Cup and South Challenge Cup for the following season. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bestsinceslicebread Posted January 11, 2020 Share Posted January 11, 2020 1 minute ago, Ginaro said: The rules of the South Challenge Cup would need to be adjusted to include the West Region as one of the leagues eligible to take part. It might just be simpler to keep the status quo for 2020-21 and then try to come up with a non-league trophy to replace/merge the Junior Cup and South Challenge Cup for the following season. Yeah this sound right Ginaro as its a process we all want to get right and I take it, what Fairweather said regarding south challenge cup y if any west team becomes licensed then they can partake in The South Region Challenge Cup the following season 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairWeatherFan Posted January 11, 2020 Share Posted January 11, 2020 3 minutes ago, Ginaro said: The rules of the South Challenge Cup would need to be adjusted to include the West Region as one of the leagues eligible to take part. It might just be simpler to keep the status quo for 2020-21 and then try to come up with a non-league trophy to replace/merge the Junior Cup and South Challenge Cup for the following season. That's what will hopefully happen. The SCC is now 7 rounds, the Junior Cup is 8 rounds with replays and a two legged semi-final. If you put ALL the clubs together you would only have 8 rounds to play. Scrap the replays, scrap the two legged semi-final and it can easily be slotted into the Senior Calendar. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairWeatherFan Posted January 11, 2020 Share Posted January 11, 2020 Listening to the Junior Football Podcast episode 7. Doesn't bode well for this week's meeting to me. Worry about losing cups, losing money and it's not for next season but the season after. The guests coming from Cumbernauld United who are looking good to be a West Premiership side next season. If I could bet on it i'd say the majority will go for Lowland League West 2021-22. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stanley Posted January 11, 2020 Share Posted January 11, 2020 30 minutes ago, Bestsinceslicebread said: Yeah this sound right Ginaro as its a process we all want to get right and I take it, what Fairweather said regarding south challenge cup y if any west team becomes licensed then they can partake in The South Region Challenge Cup the following season You don't have to be licensed to be in the South Regional Challenge Cup. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bestsinceslicebread Posted January 11, 2020 Share Posted January 11, 2020 7 minutes ago, FairWeatherFan said: Listening to the Junior Football Podcast episode 7. Doesn't bode well for this week's meeting to me. Worry about losing cups, losing money and it's not for next season but the season after. The guests coming from Cumbernauld United who are looking good to be a West Premiership side next season. If I could bet on it i'd say the majority will go for Lowland League West 2021-22. That's one mans perception of it at Cumbernauld albeit, an important one for Cumby. Listed to it as well and they are doing a great job and how they have helped Kirky Rob Royfor many years with a cheap price from what I gather but in football you have to have a vision and not be stagnant not saying Cumby are by the way. I think all the committee men and chairmen should take a more proactive jump at this pyramid and find out everything about it as a few I've spoken to seem to see a negative and stay with that when there are about 10 positives beside it. They should be given every info possible from the PWG and the SJFA and the regional junior committees, everything should be open and public as I feel too many power struggles going on but as each month goes on there's more and more looking at the pyramid as the better option, not just for their team but the whole of Scottish football 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairWeatherFan Posted January 11, 2020 Share Posted January 11, 2020 1 minute ago, Bestsinceslicebread said: That's one mans perception of it at Cumbernauld albeit, an important one for Cumby. Listed to it as well and they are doing a great job and how they have helped Kirky Rob Royfor many years with a cheap price from what I gather but in football you have to have a vision and not be stagnant not saying Cumby are by the way. I think all the committee men and chairmen should take a more proactive jump at this pyramid and find out everything about it as a few I've spoken to seem to see a negative and stay with that when there are about 10 positives beside it. They should be given every info possible from the PWG and the SJFA and the regional junior committees, everything should be open and public as I feel too many power struggles going on but as each month goes on there's more and more looking at the pyramid as the better option, not just for their team but the whole of Scottish football Listening to the current one with Tommy Sloan as a guest. I think in general between the two podcasts everyone is okay with joining the pyramid. Even if that's just because they see it as inevitable. There's just a lot of fear and that's the problem. Ticket prices have been brought up in episode 8. Those attending the upcoming meeting seem willing to listen and have those fears dispelled. Just hoping some there will take on that role. There were obviously clubs that looked into licensing and Clydebank had their previous vote to go. So there are clubs that know what's going on and what pyramid entry would mean. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bestsinceslicebread Posted January 11, 2020 Share Posted January 11, 2020 2 minutes ago, FairWeatherFan said: Listening to the current one with Tommy Sloan as a guest. I think in general between the two podcasts everyone is okay with joining the pyramid. Even if that's just because they see it as inevitable. There's just a lot of fear and that's the problem. Ticket prices have been brought up in episode 8. Those attending the upcoming meeting seem willing to listen and have those fears dispelled. Just hoping some there will take on that role. There were obviously clubs that looked into licensing and Clydebank had their previous vote to go. So there are clubs that know what's going on and what pyramid entry would mean. In total agreement with Fairweather with regarding Clydebank are one of the most proactive in the junior level, but many, I feel after chatting, have not done so and just going to go with the flow but If I was a fan of one of those 64 West teams, I would want my committee to know the full ins and outs and inform me as a fan of the positives as well as the negatives, the requirements for each tier etc.. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
santheman Posted January 11, 2020 Share Posted January 11, 2020 4 hours ago, Bestsinceslicebread said: Everything stated Fairweather seems fine and logical. I take it any club that wins the premier West region to get promotion playoff to the lowland must be licensed so if they are not would it fall to second place or no joy then third place etc... In regards to cup, the Scottish Cup, which one do they enter as I've spoken to 7 committee members of 3 different junior clubs recently who all think bar one that they will be playing in the Scottish junior cup. This is the part I've been unsure as I believe they will play in the same Scottish cup that EOS and SOS play in, its this correct and what off the current West of Scotland cup and the other domestic cups, will they continue or change ? If they remain members of the SJFA then they will compete in all the SJFA competitions unless the clubs vote to change that 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnie_man Posted January 11, 2020 Author Share Posted January 11, 2020 42 minutes ago, santheman said: If they remain members of the SJFA then they will compete in all the SJFA competitions unless the clubs vote to change that Will you be able to complete in the WRJFA without SJFA membership? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
santheman Posted January 11, 2020 Share Posted January 11, 2020 17 minutes ago, Burnie_man said: Will you be able to complete in the WRJFA without SJFA membership? I wouldn't think so as things stand 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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