Junior football, what is the future?

[Sunrise]

Largs are the same so I'm lead to believe. 

Largs are the same what exactly?

[parsforlife]

Unless the council gift you a plazzy pitch nearly all Junior clubs can't afford lights. We are installing ours in two stages as  the cost to our building committee is far above what we have raised in previous projects. That includes a 500 seat stand.

 

Bonnyrigg, dundonald, St. Andrews, Linlithgow... nobody from the council is paying them.

 

And oh yea, the council gift f**k all, occasionally(and it is occasional) they are willing to invest in a sports facility to provide locals with an accessible football environment year round, they tend to be willing to work with clubs to install these, as they are with other organisations, clubs that have had 3G pitches installed at their grounds have worked hard to make sure they have the right ethos, relationships and community engagement to align themselves with council aims.

 

 

‘Hey spend 300-500k, we’d like to have our first team play under lights,have less postponements and pocket some SFA cash’ doesn’t fly.

 

‘Hi, your possibly looking to install a 3G pitch in the local area, may we suggest installing it at our facility? We have youth teams, community sides, midnight leagued, walking football etc that are willing to use such a facility, of course we will make it available to schools etc at a discounted rate and run the facility as joint enterprise with you, this will result in reduced crime in the area, better mental and physical heath...’ goes a lot further.

 

I think it is easy for people to speculate what clubs would do but we really need a new vote to know where we really stand. Until we know what the exact situation is no planning can take place. Opinions may have changed due to outside factors (real or not).

 

As I have said before I think Maxwell and Petrie would be advised to come and speak to the clubs and give them the facts around licensing and what they see as the future otherwise we will waste the next season and then be in the same position with no alternative in place and clubs in limbo. West clubs (who may want to progress) can’t plan at the moment as no one knows what will happen.

 

Cutting out SJfA would be a massive step forward, clubs would get the info without the spin of those looking after their own paypackets.

 

Unfortunately Petrie and maxwell are clueless and can’t be trusted to actually help matters in this regard.

 

 

In what way?

 

I doubt it’s as much as pricey is suggesting, but the lack of senior clubs compared to the east(even before the exodus) is bound to have some effect. Up until a few years ago you probably only had Queen’s Park, Dumbarton and Albion rovers as teams who have consistently played PT outside of juniors, everyone else probably feels a bit alien with them at least flirting with FT football.

 

Compared to the east where even pre LL SPFL and EoS of similar stature have been on the doorstep of most junior clubs, it isn’t as much of a stretch to think the west exists more inside its own bubble.

[PRICEY]

If say the WRSJFA clubs moved as a whole tomorrow,where does that leave the SOS league?.
Would they a stand alone league at level six or would the be integrated into the new WOS league?

[Whitburn Vale]

10 hours ago, PRICEY said:

One thing I don’t think a lot of posters don’t realise is it’s a completely different mentality in the West Juniors to what’s in the East Juniors,present clubs or those who moved.

Eh,naw it's no.

Those clubs in the Western half of West Lothian(Blackburn excluded) have the same mentality as most of the West Juniors.

[AlanCamelonfan]

1 hour ago, PRICEY said:

If say the WRSJFA clubs moved as a whole tomorrow,where does that leave the SOS league?.
Would they a stand alone league at level six or would the be integrated into the new WOS league?

It would probably stay at tier 6 and be a 3 way playoff similar to what we had in East this year

[Stag Nation]

12 hours ago, Arthurlie1981 said:

As I have said before I think Maxwell and Petrie would be advised to come and speak to the clubs and give them the facts around licensing and what they see as the future otherwise we will waste the next season and then be in the same position with no alternative in place and clubs in limbo. West clubs (who may want to progress) can’t plan at the moment as no one knows what will happen.

Why would they bother to come and "give the facts" when all the info on licensing is freely available on the SFA website?

[santheman]

14 hours ago, Burnie_man said:

You miss my point, if he only had a mandate to take the SJFA intact into the Pyramid, why was he so keen to tell everyone "we're in" when he knew the North weren't interested? That should have meant nobody was in until either the North changed their opinion or the AGM changed the mandate he was working to.

 

Dont miss your point at all.

The vote was taken by ALL clubs in the SJFA and the MAJORITY voted in favour of pursuing entry to the pyramid. Doesn't mean every club or region was happy about it.

That may well change at this years AGM

 

[Burnie_man]

4 minutes ago, santheman said:

Dont miss your point at all.

The vote was taken by ALL clubs in the SJFA and the MAJORITY voted in favour of pursuing entry to the pyramid. Doesn't mean every club or region was happy about it.

That may well change at this years AGM

 

 

So, how could he ignore the North Region in PWG negotiations when he only had a mandate to take all 3 Regions into the pyramid?  that's my point.   If he had achieved his aim, West and East would be in, and the North would not, and as you pointed out that would be contrary to his mandate.

I understand only 4 clubs voted against the resolution for entry to the Pyramid at AGM.

[vikingTON]

14 hours ago, PRICEY said:

 

Out of interest,if there was no interest from any of WRJFA clubs,what clubs do you think could make up a WOS pyramid league?

 

Glasgow Uni should be in for a start, followed by other university teams and clubs from the substantial amateur ranks in the west. Oban Saints, Dunoon, Rothesay Brandane would be interesting entrants to the pyramid* - then you've got a stack of Greater Glasgow-based amateurs as well as more youth clubs that nobody had heard about before like BSC and Edusport. The standard of the league would not be high to begin with and clubs would certainly need to put in a lot of work to get their facilities up to standard - but it's the start of a league, not the finished product. With modest financial support (as the EoS claimed it had last season, not sure whether the SFA is following through with all of that now) then these clubs can develop accordingly. 

Access to the pyramid should not be postponed indefinitely in the west of Scotland just because the members of merely one type of non-league football setup can't fully agree terms to shift over to it. It's inevitable that a western team will be relegated from the Lowland League at some point and the South of Scotland league is not a viable feeder for them: there must be a West league ready and waiting for them to drop into. 

*Bonus points for roping in Lochgilphead Red Star; every thriving national football system needs a Red Star team in it. 

Edited June 6, 2019 by vikingTON

[glensmad]

22 minutes ago, Burnie_man said:

 

So, how could he ignore the North Region in PWG negotiations when he only had a mandate to take all 3 Regions into the pyramid?  that's my point.   If he had achieved his aim, West and East would be in, and the North would not, and as you pointed out that would be contrary to his mandate.

I understand only 4 clubs voted against the resolution for entry to the Pyramid at AGM.

Can anybody show me where it is confirmed that the mandate was for all regions to go in at the same time ?

[Burnie_man]

9 minutes ago, glensmad said:

Can anybody show me where it is confirmed that the mandate was for all regions to go in at the same time ?

It's on this thread somewhere as I posted pics of the minutes.

[Burnie_man]

24 minutes ago, virginton said:

Glasgow Uni should be in for a start, followed by other university teams and clubs from the substantial amateur ranks in the west. Oban Saints, Dunoon, Rothesay Brandane would be interesting entrants to the pyramid* - then you've got a stack of Greater Glasgow-based amateurs as well as more youth clubs that nobody had heard about before like BSC and Edusport. The standard of the league would not be high to begin with and clubs would certainly need to put in a lot of work to get their facilities up to standard - but it's the start of a league, not the finished product. With modest financial support (as the EoS claimed it had last season, not sure whether the SFA is following through with all of that now) then these clubs can develop accordingly. 

Access to the pyramid should not be postponed indefinitely in the west of Scotland just because the members of merely one type of non-league football setup can't fully agree terms to shift over to it. It's inevitable that a western team will be relegated from the Lowland League at some point and the South of Scotland league is not a viable feeder for them: there must be a West league ready and waiting for them to drop into. 

*Bonus points for roping in Lochgilphead Red Star; every thriving football league needs a Red Star team in it. 

Build it and they will come.

You're spot on that a western feeder shouldn't be completely reliant on the intransigence of one particular league/Association. 

Start a WoSFL for 2020-21 in the next few months and invite clubs to apply.

[santheman]

42 minutes ago, Burnie_man said:

 

So, how could he ignore the North Region in PWG negotiations when he only had a mandate to take all 3 Regions into the pyramid?  that's my point.   If he had achieved his aim, West and East would be in, and the North would not, and as you pointed out that would be contrary to his mandate.

I understand only 4 clubs voted against the resolution for entry to the Pyramid at AGM.

You would need to ask him that BM.

 

[Burnie_man]

1 minute ago, santheman said:

You would need to ask him that BM.

I would assume issues like this will be covered at AGM.   surely clubs aren't going to give the hierarchy an easy ride over this, and I also include the WRJFA AGM in this as well.

[santheman]

1 minute ago, Burnie_man said:

I would assume issues like this will be covered at AGM.   surely clubs aren't going to give the hierarchy an easy ride over this, and I also include the WRJFA AGM in this as well.

Depends if enough clubs are bothered about it tbh

[Burnie_man]

@Kilbowie Benches was an expert on this topic, seems to have gone to ground.........

Edited June 6, 2019 by Burnie_man

[Burnie_man]

On ‎10‎/‎03‎/‎2019 at 12:53, Burnie_man said:

Correct. He only has a mandate to move everyone into the Pyramid as a block and keep the SJFA structure intact. It's been like that for a decade or more. That clearly means all in or not in, but no doubt it will be spun in order to avoid an egm.

 

For santheman

[PRICEY]

It would probably stay at tier 6 and be a 3 way playoff similar to what we had in East this year

Would that not mean two overlapping leagues?.

[PRICEY]

Eh,naw it's no.
Those clubs in the Western half of West Lothian(Blackburn excluded) have the same mentality as most of the West Juniors.

I take your point.I was talking from my experience a few seasons back while helping out at a ERJFA club for about 18 months.Coming from a WRJFA background I found it very different.

[Whitburn Vale]

5 minutes ago, PRICEY said:

 

I take your point.I was talking from my experience a few seasons back while helping out at a ERJFA club for about 18 months.Coming from a WRJFA background I found it very different.

 

I get that Pricey,am only talking bout Fauldhouse,Whitburn,Armadale and Harthill,those 4 are right on the West Lothian/Lanarkshire border and in my experience have that "west" mentality.

Edited June 6, 2019 by Whitburn Vale