Junior football, what is the future?

[Stag Nation]

1 hour ago, Andy groundhopper said:

Interesting numbers game there, only problem is that what happens when a headcount says 50 but admissions say 75, someone pocketing the difference ?

Quite the reverse?

[Tutankhamen]

2 hours ago, welshbairn said:

Folk interested in their numbers might find this interesting.

http://www.scottishleague.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4620

Interesting read if a bit dated. 

We'll know more once more West clubs start to get licenced. Talbot got 3000/4000 in for a home Scottish Cup tie v Ayr Utd. Would the LL be an attraction to Talbot fans? Time will tell.

[welshbairn]

23 minutes ago, Tutankhamen said:

Interesting read if a bit dated. 

We'll know more once more West clubs start to get licenced. Talbot got 3000/4000 in for a home Scottish Cup tie v Ayr Utd. Would the LL be an attraction to Talbot fans? Time will tell.

On the other hand people are talking about the big numbers Cove Rangers are getting now, back in their Highland League days I think they had about the lowest in the league, 100 on a good day, 200 if the weather was great and Aberdeen were playing away, more usually about 60. I might be talking shite here but there's no reliable stats so I'll stick with it till the day I die. Point is, Talbot is a bit of an exception, as all clubs are in their own way, especially with a Cup fixture like that. There's more to what matters about football than distances and attendances.

[Enigma]

I typed Volgograd instead of Vladivostok - good to know people are paying attention to off-topic posts! [emoji6]

 

It's the equivalent of Raith Rovers going to Ho Chi Minh City or Lima for a league match.

 

A couple of years ago there was a team based in Yuzhno-Sakhalinsk playing in the Russian second tier. That means a two teams playing in the same country’s league were based within pre-1945 German and pre-1945 Japanese borders.

[welshbairn]

7 hours ago, Andy groundhopper said:

Interesting numbers game there, only problem is that what happens when a headcount says 50 but admissions say 75, someone pocketing the difference ? Surely a club has to produce documents on income/expenses every season ?  Guesswork wouldn't stand up legally ?  In my opinion, any club who can attract 200+ up to Lowland level, and then 350 above that,is doing well.

For some reason every North Caledonian League game is counted as 30, I assume that must include the players, subs and referee.

[stulch]

So has the format of the East Juniors for 20-21 actually been decided now?

[superbigal]

So has the format of the East Juniors for 20-21 actually been decided now?

Has been for weeks and mentioned numerous times.

But as you cannot find.

Tayside league ( including the only Fife junior that is left ) with 17 teams.

Lothian league of 13 teams.

 

 

[glensmad]

So that's 30 teams in the East, and I believe 32 teams in the North.

So that means, if there are 113 teams in the SJFA (per Felix McKenna's tweet), there are 51 teams in the West who renewed their membership.

It'll be interesting to see how many of them actually take part in the Scottish Junior Cup this coming season.

[FairWeatherFan]

10 minutes ago, glensmad said:

So that's 30 teams in the East, and I believe 32 teams in the North.

So that means, if there are 113 teams in the SJFA (per Felix McKenna's tweet), there are 51 teams in the West who renewed their membership.

It'll be interesting to see how many of them actually take part in the Scottish Junior Cup this coming season.

I think its meant to be just 50 in the West as Rothie Rovers bumps the North up by 1.

[cmontheloknow]

On 25/07/2020 at 13:37, mcruic said:

I find it interesting that some junior/now senior teams are baulking at travel, but you've got teams like Fort William who seem to manage somehow despite very little success and despite the added costs of Highland League membership. 

Kinlochleven is only 22 miles away from Fort William, and their amateur team (South Lochaber Thistle) - who incidentally beat Fort William away in a 2018 pre-season friendly - play in the Greater Glasgow Premier Amateur League - where pretty much every away match is a 100-mile trip.  I'm sure they've got a lot of players from the Glasgow area in the team, but they do play at home - and clubs have to travel the 100 miles to Kinlochleven to play them.

You've also got Lochgilphead Red Star playing in the Scottish Amateur Football League - where many teams are from the Glasgow area, 90-100 miles away.  There's also other teams from out west in that league - Campbeltown, Dunoon, etc.  Campbeltown to Glasgow is over 130 miles.  You've also got Rothesay and Rhu in the Caledonian Amateur League, which also has teams from Stirlingshire - 60 or 70 mile trips.  These teams have played in these leagues for years.

So, how do these amateur teams manage to find the funds to travel year in year out?  Fewer overheads giving them more money to spend on travelling?  Something else?

 

Red Star players pay approx £400 a season into a travel pot. That was the figure  mid 2010s anyway.

[cmontheloknow]

1 hour ago, FairWeatherFan said:

I think its meant to be just 50 in the West as Rothie Rovers bumps the North up by 1.

53 is the number I heard from two different sources. 

[FairWeatherFan]

13 minutes ago, cmontheloknow said:

53 is the number I heard from two different sources. 

Then the 113 number must be wrong?

53+30+33 = 116

50+30+33 = 113

[glensmad]

Then the 113 number must be wrong?
53+30+33 = 116
50+30+33 = 113

113 was the number quoted by Felix McKenna in his tweet the other day.

[FairWeatherFan]

1 minute ago, glensmad said:

3 minutes ago, FairWeatherFan said:

Then the 113 number must be wrong?
53+30+33 = 116
50+30+33 = 113

113 was the number quoted by Felix McKenna in his tweet the other day.

I know but if it has been said by more than one source that there's 53 West clubs and no one has heard any withdrawals from North & East. Then the best guess without further news is that 113 was a typo.

Which is possible since Mark Stanton is misspelled in the same tweet.

 

[Jimi Shandrix]

7 hours ago, superbigal said:

Has been for weeks and mentioned numerous times.

But as you cannot find.

Tayside league ( including the only Fife junior that is left ) with 17 teams.

Lothian league of 13 teams.

 

 

Has it been confirmed yet how the league will look on Tayside? I was under the impression that it would be a single league of 17 teams with 32 matches but had heard from a few sources that the league may include a split after 16 games .

[Andy groundhopper]

Excuse my ignorance but what is the fascination with these league 'splits' ? Just play home and away games and that's it , be getting like the rugby before long - win the league by 20 pts and then have a play-off, plain stupid. As to the crowds in the West /WOSFL  - anything around 400 is an excellent crowd.

[8MileBU]

19 minutes ago, Andy groundhopper said:

Excuse my ignorance but what is the fascination with these league 'splits' ? Just play home and away games and that's it , be getting like the rugby before long - win the league by 20 pts and then have a play-off, plain stupid. As to the crowds in the West /WOSFL  - anything around 400 is an excellent crowd.

Your post pretty much answers your question. There’s a simple strategy to follow like the one you’ve proposed but up here the blazers pretty much always find a way to f**k it up. 

Edited July 27, 2020 by 8MileBU

[FairWeatherFan]

12 minutes ago, Andy groundhopper said:

Excuse my ignorance but what is the fascination with these league 'splits' ? Just play home and away games and that's it , be getting like the rugby before long - win the league by 20 pts and then have a play-off, plain stupid. As to the crowds in the West /WOSFL  - anything around 400 is an excellent crowd.

In this instance its because they probably can't fit in the 32 game season they would otherwise have to play. Don't know exactly how they would split it with 17 clubs but say its a top 8 and bottom 9.

That's 16+7 = 23 games. Champion also contests two legged final against the Lothian league winners for overall East Region champion.

And 16+8 = 24 games for the bottom section.

Lothian League is only 13 teams so would be a 24 game season. Which makes it easier to arrange for the two legged Championship playoff and to arrange the Region cup competitions.

[Andy groundhopper]

13 minutes ago, FairWeatherFan said:

In this instance its because they probably can't fit in the 32 game season they would otherwise have to play. Don't know exactly how they would split it with 17 clubs but say its a top 8 and bottom 9.

That's 16+7 = 23 games. Champion also contests two legged final against the Lothian league winners for overall East Region champion.

And 16+8 = 24 games for the bottom section.

Lothian League is only 13 teams so would be a 24 game season. Which makes it easier to arrange for the two legged Championship playoff and to arrange the Region cup competitions.

Maths was never my strong point at school, beginning to see the logic !

[FairWeatherFan]

2 minutes ago, Andy groundhopper said:

Maths was never my strong point at school, beginning to see the logic !

There's the potential for other leagues to do something similar. The Highland League (17 teams, 32 games, 34 dates to complete due to idle club), Lowland League (17 teams, 32 games, 34 dates to complete due to idle club), EoS Premier (18 teams, 34 games). The advantage they have is that they are all largely licenced so have floodlights in place to help slot in midweeks.

The WoS Premier with 20 teams and 38 games with less than have half the teams having floodlights is one of the more problematic for fixture congestion.