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Junior football, what is the future?

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6 minutes ago, Sergeant Wilson said:

I got the impression it was total disinterest. Carluke away so watch the next available game, no interest in grade, level, opponent etc. Just a vague notion that something was happening along the lines of big clubs leaving, smaller ones excluded and left to play in county divisions.

Maybe not too far from reality then?

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Just now, Stag Nation said:

Maybe not too far from reality then?

I doubt any juniors will be excluded.

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The West Region WANT clubs to be excluded as it suits their agenda (the big clubs don't care about the wee ones, all for one and one for all!)

The irony is that the West Region's plan is exactly what will separate clubs out - those that swear fealty to the SJFA and those that see that particular movement as little more than a barrel heading over the Niagara Falls.

Every clubs that signs up for oblivion is a victory for the SJFA and will doubtless be paraded like prizes on a cheap game show on Twitter by a certain somebody. Salvation of the Association, preserving 134 years of history. It would seem to be all they care about. The clubs never come first for an association that fines them (unlike SFA unless serial offenders), taxes them (reinstatement from Senior football) and has failed miserably to attract any decent sponsorship (in financial terms) to its competitions.

Edited by cmontheloknow

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15 minutes ago, Sergeant Wilson said:

I got the impression it was total disinterest. Carluke away so watch the next available game, no interest in grade, level, opponent etc. Just a vague notion that something was happening along the lines of big clubs leaving, smaller ones excluded and left to play in county divisions.

I think we sometimes forget in the P&B microcosm that probably 90%+ of fans care very little about what's going on outside the bubble of their own club's week to week results. A vanishingly small proportion of the remainder will be either hardcore pyramid enthusiasts or grade loyalists no matter how much we'd imagine it to be otherwise based on what we read on this forum.

What everybody's got in common though is that they want to see what's best for their club done.

This being the case, it is genuinely sad the way things have turned out...at this stage in the proceedings I don't see any way to avoid it turning even more acrimonious than it has been till now.

 

 

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21 minutes ago, cmontheloknow said:

The clubs never come first for an association that fines them (unlike SFA unless serial offenders), taxes them (reinstatement from Senior football) and has failed miserably to attract any decent sponsorship (in financial terms) to its competitions.

This reinstatement TAX stuck out for me with a comment from one of the Dunipace guys. They said the screen fencing for their ground was about the same as the money they saved by no longer having to pay this tax after going Senior. Just say a club reinstates 4 or 5 players a season @ £40 a time. Over a decade there's a fair sum that's gone to sit in the SJFA bank account rather than a club use it on repairs to their ground. They're sitting on a half million pound Investment Bond while still taxing players just to play.

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I cant believe you are suggesting the sjfa are doing anything wrong here. Taxing clubs is normal.....when you have to pay 30k a year for a salary.

 

They have a plan. A good plan. The best plan. All the good plan makers say its the best they have seen. Its impressive. You should see it. Everything else is fake news.

 

 

 

 

 

 

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I would expect that a lot of pressure will be exerted on club reps at Tuesday night's WRSJFA "extra General Meeting" to sign up to Gordon Ronney's plan.

However, for the reps representing those clubs who have expressed an interest in the LL-WoSFL plan, they have a duty of due diligence to their clubs to hold fire and wait till they hear both sides by attending the information meeting on Thursday before committing to either side.

Until both sides have been heard, and the results of Thursday's "partial PWG meeting" are known, then no club should be committing either way in my opinion. (Unless they are already absolutely certain of what route they prefer, e.g. Clydebank.)
That's the only sensible option

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I think I am going to go into hiding this week and not see the fall out of what happens at Tuesday and Thursdays meetings. The thread is the quietest it's been for ages today. Must be the lull before the storm next week when it will go into meltdown and touch 2000 pages by next weekend. 

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9 minutes ago, morley said:

I think I am going to go into hiding this week and not see the fall out of what happens at Tuesday and Thursdays meetings. The thread is the quietest it's been for ages today. Must be the lull before the storm next week when it will go into meltdown and touch 2000 pages by next weekend. 

Image result for tumbleweed

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5 hours ago, Che Dail said:

Both countries have functioning pyramids.

Go and tell UEFA why you think they don't

In both countries it's not possible to get promoted from the 3rd tier to the 2nd tier. In The Netherlands, 2nd tier is full-time, 3rd is part-time, yet there is no promotion/relegation between them. And considering I'm from The Netherlands myself, I think I know how it works there...

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3 hours ago, theesel1994 said:

This reinstatement TAX stuck out for me with a comment from one of the Dunipace guys. They said the screen fencing for their ground was about the same as the money they saved by no longer having to pay this tax after going Senior. Just say a club reinstates 4 or 5 players a season @ £40 a time. Over a decade there's a fair sum that's gone to sit in the SJFA bank account rather than a club use it on repairs to their ground. They're sitting on a half million pound Investment Bond while still taxing players just to play.

Aye but did Dunipace ever propose a vote at AGM for reinstatement to be abolished ? The clubs make the decisions , reinstatement could have been done away with yonks ago.

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3 hours ago, G4Mac said:

I cant believe you are suggesting the sjfa are doing anything wrong here. Taxing clubs is normal.....when you have to pay 30k a year for a salary.

 

They have a plan. A good plan. The best plan. All the good plan makers say its the best they have seen. Its impressive. You should see it. Everything else is fake news.

 

 

 

 

 

 

ok donald!

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Aye but did Dunipace ever propose a vote at AGM for reinstatement to be abolished ? The clubs make the decisions , reinstatement could have been done away with yonks ago.
Aye your right its the clubs fault.

Just a thought were the clubs consulted/decision makers on forming a new wos league by either the sjfa or the wrsjfa?

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Serious question: without mentioning protecting the grade or history of the level, can someone please tell me the benefits and reasoning for wanting to stay junior in the west under whatever banner it’s presented, or joining the LL/EoS formed WoS?

I cannot see how any of the good elements of junior football aside from the prestige of the junior cup can be lost by moving across.


Almost 20 pages ago I posed this... no answer yet.

Anything now that would convince an ‘on the fence’ west junior team?

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1 hour ago, gaz5 said:

Reinstatement wasn't the only "downside" financially to staying in the juniors when we did our due diligence.

- Reinstatement (none in seniors)
- Disciplinary fines (none in seniors)
- Cheaper membership with more included (£200 all in and we got handed £180 worth of balls for that, a £1k defibrillator, reduced course fees, all 4 licensable insurances, access to ground improvement grants and the licence process etc.)
- Insurance (free with league membership as above)
- Friendlies (no permit or charge in seniors)

Is an off the top of my head list of things that were a drain on club finances. We've saved nearly £500 this season alone so far on 1, 2, and 5 on top of the other benefits.

Why would we propose abolishing/changing those things to stay junior, where we couldn't have pursued a licence, when there was another league already offering that?

Your argument is nonsensical. Essentially, you're saying you should stay with your old gym, at higher cost with shitty old equipment, even though the shiny new one across the road is half the cost with better benefits to try to get your current gym to change the way it treats it's members. Isn't that what you pay the gym office bearers to do already? Did the members of the new gym have to lobby the owners/other members to get the good service they were offering?

That the Junior office bearers didn't do their own due diligence to compare their offering with that of others leading to their "members" choosing a better service in numbers isn't the members who left fault and that's the very head in the sand mindset that's got the SJFA to where it is today.

Let me ask you this another way: The EoS office bearers combined take less from the clubs by a significant margin to perform what are part time roles yet they are able to "offer" these benefits to the clubs for discussion and acceptance. They don't horde huge cash reserves, whatever comes in goes out to benefit the clubs.

Why has little changed in the juniors in 50 years and why is it the clubs jobs to hunt for and put forward improvements rather than those being paid a pretty penny, some in full time roles, to apparently run the association.

Other associations offering a better service to members is not the members fault and now that people realise they do have a choice they are, like most customers, voting with their feet.

That's a bit of a rant lol

Reinstatement is a disgrace but have heard many junior clubs and past junior clubs complain but never did anything about it. It could have been abolished yonks ago no point moaning now.

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1 hour ago, G4Mac said:

Aye your right its the clubs fault.

Just a thought were the clubs consulted/decision makers on forming a new wos league by either the sjfa or the wrsjfa?

Never said it was Dunipace fault it's the fault of every club that could have raised it at an AGM and abolished it. It's an absolute pathetic rule but every club just paid up. Shite like this has come back to haunt the SjFA , all about the cash to them.

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Friendly today  : 
            ARMADALE  4  TYNECASTLE  4


I just get the impression that post adds nothing to this thread...

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