Junior football, what is the future?

[Mystic Blastie]

I don't know. If it didn't refer to me apologies. If it did I say again. Brilliant!!

Do you think it's you?

[Burnie_man]

48 minutes ago, Burnie_man said:

Fits in pretty  much with what I was told from those that were there, it's largely the same proposal that was already rejected by the LL and largely went the way most people expected;

Premiership run by LL at tier 6, tier 7 to 9 remain Junior and run by WRJFA/SJFA.  All clubs to retain membership of SJFA and enter Junior Cup.

Glasgow Uni and Bonnyton, if they apply, can be fitted into tier 6, anyone else starts at the bottom of the pile and have to join SJFA and become Junior.

Thinks the "partial" PWG can halt the new WoSFL and also stop Thursday nights meeting!

Claiming discrimination against the Juniors, waving Maxwell's email around and threatening legal action, wanting clubs to congregate on steps of Hampden etc etc.  I'm told most of the big clubs remained largely silent, it was mostly smaller clubs reacting to his rabble rousing.

No idea if anyone raised the matter regarding mandates and on who's authority he was acting. It's a one man show.

The immediate issues I can see are;

No access to SFA Licencing below tier 7, therefore majority of clubs cannot become SFA members, no access to U20 league etc.   Do senior clubs who are relegated from tier 6 revert to Junior status? do they have to join SJFA?

The LL have already rejected this plan out of hand, therefore one can only assume he wants to bog all this down, delay WoSFL and force everyone back round the table.

He is still acting without any sort of mandate from clubs.

The guy is bonkers.

 

Oh one other thing, I believe he was still pushing the cherry picking line "they won't let all of you in"  

[Dev]

1 hour ago, peasy23 said:

I wasn't at the meeting to hear it verbatim, but I'm told the veiled threat of legal action mentioned in one of the earlier West Region statements wasn't aimed at any clubs who might leave, but was in regards to Maxwell's 2 year old email stating that it was a certainty that the Juniors would be in at Tier 6.

Well we can be sure now that there will be current Juniors playing at Tier 6 next season in the WoS run by the Lowland League - that even fits in with the reported proposal by the WRJFA/SJFA.

It's just a question of how many clubs will stay out of the west Pyramid divisions i.e. will still be Juniors and outside the Pyramid.

[Footballfirst]

So it seems increasingly clear that the WRJFA's advice to clubs is that they must stick together, protest on the steps of Hampden and demand access to the Pyramid.

My advice would be that they are going to the wrong venue. Go along to the EK hotel on Thursday, stick together and sign up to the LL WOSFL proposal. That would get all the junior clubs into the pyramid en masse. That is the essence of the offer that is on the table from the LL.

In a year or two's time, the majority of the exec positions in the new league will be filled by the ambitious ex Junior clubs, who have a belief in what they are doing in promoting the new league for everyone.  

[AsimButtHitsASix]

2 hours ago, Jacksgranda said:

However, this morning has more than made up for it so far. I have a funeral to attend at 12 o'clock

Is it the funeral for the SJFA?
 

 

Jokes aside sorry for your loss. Hope all's well with yourself

Edited March 11, 2020 by AsimButtHitsASix

[Whitburn Vale]

2 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

So it seems increasingly clear that the WRJFA's advice to clubs is that they must stick together, protest on the steps of Hampden and demand access to the Pyramid.

My advice would be that they are going to the wrong venue. Go along to the EK hotel on Thursday, stick together and sign up to the LL WOSFL proposal. That would get all the junior clubs into the pyramid en masse. That is the essence of the offer that is on the table from the LL.

In a year or two's time, the majority of the exec positions in the new league will be filled by the ambitious ex Junior clubs, who have a belief in what they are doing in promoting the new league for everyone.  

Well put FF 

[Dev]

55 minutes ago, Marten said:

The main person who is making things up is Gordon Ronney, he is spreading clear lies which create all this uncertainty...

Unfortunately for this person each time he makes any sort of statement on social media or at meetings he invites responses which either question what he is saying or which explain how he has "mis-understood" his subject. This only serves to drive clubs away from the Juniors into the hands of the WoS run by the Lowland League and may cause this new league to start with more than a single division.

[Marten]

1 minute ago, Dev said:

Unfortunately for this person each time he makes any sort of statement on social media or at meetings he invites responses which either question what he is saying or which explain how he has "mis-understood" his subject. This only serves to drive clubs away from the Juniors into the hands of the WoS run by the Lowland League and may cause this new league to start with more than a single division.

Yep, if anything, he is only speeding up the demise of the SJFA...

[Dev]

55 minutes ago, gaz5 said:

You are overlooking one of the key components of contract formation in Scots law, that being that the parties committing to said contract must have the legal authority to do so.

If we accept that an email can form a legally binding contract in Scots law, which it can, then the media is not the issue.

The legal ability of said parties to enter into that contract though quite clearly is an issue as it does not exist in unilateral form based on the clearly written rules.

Ian Maxwell is a representative of one of the six parties, legally, who need to agree to such a change (depending on the Tier we're talking about)

Unless there's similar emails from the SPFL, LL, SoS, EoS and HL, then the WRSJFA are on to plums on any legal challenge.

It would also be foolish in the extreme to attempt to take the governing body down the legal route.

If that's all that last night was, it is yet more self preservation bluster I'm afraid and hopefully enough of those present are now clued up enough to spot that.

It would also be foolish in the extreme to attempt to take the governing body down the legal route.

To try to take on your own Football Governing Body may be truly unwise. The existence of the Junior Association is not in their own hands. It is in the hands of the superior body i.e. the SFA.

[LongTimeLurker]

1 hour ago, Che Dail said:

I think the purpose of the meeting on Thursday is to more or less implement the 'done deal', i.e. provide a platform for Junior clubs to enter the pyramid.

And yet there's going to be a protest / picket line of sorts on the steps of Hampden to demand access to the pyramid, ahead of a meeting which has been set up to facilitate access to it...?

...and is being held in East Kilbride.

[Dev]

45 minutes ago, Mystic Blastie said:

48 minutes ago, Burnie_man said:

Why are you so bothered now? not seen you getting involved before..................

I'm bored

I hope that your club will be in at Tier 6 next season. Will you be there to support them regardless of which organisation wins through this dispute?

[Che Dail]

5 minutes ago, LongTimeLurker said:

...and is being held in East Kilbride.

Haha   "Taxi to East Kilbride boiz, got the wrang fkin venue!"

[Che Dail]

5 minutes ago, gaz5 said:

That's exactly what I said. Ian Maxwell had the authority of the SFA.

But he doesn't have the authority of the HL, LL, SoS, EoS or SPFL, all of whom are legally required to approve the delivery of what has been claimed as the content of the contract (Juniors in at Tier X).

I can't agree to sell a house I'm 20% owner of and that contract be enforceable without the agreement of the other parties who share ownership.

Ignorance of the other parties or the contract with them on the ownership of the item covered in the secondary contract is not an arguable position in law.

You are right - the principle follows that a contract is only enforceable if the person entering into it on an organisation's behalf has the requisite authority to do so.

So he may have been on a frolic, but that isn't the concern of the party suffering the loss (whatever they think that might be at this point).  Not that they want to enforce this alleged 'contract' (they probably can't) but the 'veiled threat' if there even is one, is perhaps to pursue a (frivolous) claim for damages, who knows?  

The SFA as an Association of member clubs appoints a Chief Executive to make executive decisions on its behalf - so if he is holding himself up as someone who has the authority to make offers, and it says so in the Articles of Association or whatever, then it would be reasonable to expect that to be the case.

I just think that in the context of this discussion it is fair to consider and appraise both sides of the argument and not dismiss it out of hand, no matter how absurd it may seem on the face of it.

Anyway, the main point I'm making is, the meaning and interpretation of the 'done deal' is not clearly defined - the SFA could simply state that the meeting this Thursday proves that what the SFA  offered was correct, and is now being implemented: The West Junior clubs will access Tier 6: Fact.

 

[Mystic Blastie]

I hope that your club will be in at Tier 6 next season. Will you be there to support them regardless of which organisation wins through this dispute?

Honestly Dev as long as we are in the Pyramid system no matter what tier I will be happy. Tier 6 preferably, but no, matter where we end up I will follow my team.

[Jacksgranda]

29 minutes ago, AsimButtHitsASix said:

Is the funeral for the SJFA?
 

  Hide contents

Jokes aside sorry for your loss. Hope all's well with yourself

 

It's not a family funeral, thanks all the same. "Only" somebody I knew, who was a right age and has been in failing health for sometime, so probably a blessing.

[Marshmallo]

I can't believe how much discussion this email issue is generating. "It will be dependent on x, y, z". No, it's a complete non-starter and is just made up drivel by the SJFA to confuse clubs. It has no basis in fact whatsoever and is being used to purposely confuse/scare clubs. It is lies and will hopefully be ignored.

[Jacksgranda]

10 minutes ago, Che Dail said:

Haha   "Taxi to East Kilbride boiz, got the wrang fkin venue!"

Fleet of coaches, shirley?

[Dev]

10 minutes ago, Mystic Blastie said:

18 minutes ago, Dev said:

I hope that your club will be in at Tier 6 next season. Will you be there to support them regardless of which organisation wins through this dispute?

Honestly Dev as long as we are in the Pyramid system no matter what tier I will be happy. Tier 6 preferably, but no, matter where we end up I will follow my team.

Good to hear it. Let's hope this is all sorted out quickly.

[Che Dail]

45 minutes ago, Burnie_man said:

Ian Maxwell's email was a draft media release circulated between all parties on the PWG, claiming that

there is now consensus to admit the Juniors into the Pyramid.

 

And when interrogated further, he clarified:

"Aye, that's what I said: There is consensus to admit the Juniors into the Pyramid.  What I meant is, we will help create a league for Auchinleck, Pollok, Killwinning and that, at tier 6, in the pyramid - like what they did in the East.  Is that no what we're doing now likes?  Canny see what the fuss is about"

The end.

 

[LongTimeLurker]

49 minutes ago, Mystic Blastie said:

Sorry, I'm an auld fart. What does that mean?

FTFY = Fixed that for you.