Junior football, what is the future?

[Marten]

6 hours ago, GordonS said:

What's the difference between "junior football" and "football"?

None, it's the same game, but try telling some of the staunchest people that...

[Vollyman]

What do the ERJFA West Lothian clubs now want? What on earth are they aiming to achieve?
Do they have a “Gordon Ronney” ? Someone who can negotiate on their behalf?
Or are they still relying on TJ to conjure up some magic beans.
It all seems so sad and unnecessary.

When are they going to realise that junior football in Central Scotland is finished. Where are they going to compete ? This attitude of wait and see who survives the present situation is a nonsense.

[Whitburn Vale]

Passed Central Park,Whitburn on a "daily" walk the other day and to my astonishment heard work being undertaken I.e the sound of a stihl saw.

Looked thru the turnstile next to the social club and it looks like Whitburn are putting an entrance or turnstile into and behind the "shed" on the Lomond Crescent side of the ground.

All in all in the last few yrs at Central park theres been new changing rooms erected,new steel main gates with "Central Park 1934" on them also a 40 seater stand plus 2 new dugouts and now the new entrance/turnstile into the shed.

Seems a lot of work being done just to stay where they are in the ERJFA!!

Edited March 29, 2020 by Whitburn Vale

[Pyramidic]

Dev logged this one but I missed the tweet 
 

 

 

[DiamondOwl]

7 hours ago, GordonS said:

What's the difference between "junior football" and "football"?

I used “Junior” as the adjective to define the level of the players playing the football. Similarly, I could have written “Kids” football or “Amateur” football. It’s all football. The word “Junior” has been used for over 100 years to describe a level or grade of football in Scotland. Many teams and players are happy to see that continue and are happy to call themselves “junior” and play in a Junior Football League. I hope that’s cleared that up for you.

[Doonhamer1969]

On 28/03/2020 at 10:46, Dev said:

25 Clubs which have Applied so far/have said that they will be applying:
Premiership (4)	Championship (10)	League One (7)	League Two (3)	Others (1)
Clydebank	Arthurlie	Bellshill Athletic	Ashfield	Drumchapel Utd PYM
Kilwinning Rangers	Blantyre Victoria	Glasgow Perthshire	Newmains United
Kirkintilloch Rob Roy	Cambuslang Rangers	Greenock Juniors	Vale of Clyde
Rutherglen Glencairn	Cumbernauld United	Kello Rovers
	Gartcairn Juniors	Larkhall Thistle
	Kilsyth Rangers	Maryhill
	Neilston Juniors	Royal Albert
	Petershill
	Renfrew
	Whitletts Victoria
Not known to have applied so far:
Auchinleck Talbot	Craigmark Burntonians	Ardrossan Winton Rovers	Annbank United
Beith Juniors	Dalry Thistle	Carluke Rovers	Ardeer Thistle
Benburb	Darvel	East Kilbride Thistle	Forth Wanderers
Cumnock Juniors	Irvine Victoria	Girvan	Johnstone Burgh
Glenafton Athletic	Shotts Bon Accord	Lanark United	Lugar Boswell Thistle
Hurlford United	St Roch's	Lesmahagow Juniors	Maybole Juniors
Irvine Meadow XI		Port Glasgow Juniors	Muirkirk Juniors
Kilbirnie Ladeside		Shettleston	Saltcoats Victoria
Largs Thistle		Wishaw Juniors	St Anthony's
Pollok			Thorniewood United
Rossvale			Vale of Leven
Troon			Yoker Athletic

Is there a pattern emerging here ?

Are a lot of the smaller League 1 and 2 clubs undecided ?

Or are they planning on staying where they are in a rump West Region JFA league ?

It certainly looks now as if the vast majority of the top 2 tiers and probably most of the 3rd tier are heading WoS way.

It could just be the case of course that a lot of the smaller clubs are dithering or just not putting out public statements.

Edited March 29, 2020 by Doonhamer1969

[Marten]

17 minutes ago, DiamondOwl said:

I used “Junior” as the adjective to define the level of the players playing the football. Similarly, I could have written “Kids” football or “Amateur” football. It’s all football. The word “Junior” has been used for over 100 years to describe a level or grade of football in Scotland. Many teams and players are happy to see that continue and are happy to call themselves “junior” and play in a Junior Football League. I hope that’s cleared that up for you.

And what is the difference between junior football and senior "non league" football? I can tell you, there isn't any. It's the same game, 22 players on a pitch, playing for community clubs with hard working volunteers. It's all the same game and we should stop pretending there is some kind of major difference.

[cmontheloknow]

Just now, DiamondOwl said:

I used “Junior” as the adjective to define the level of the players playing the football. Similarly, I could have written “Kids” football or “Amateur” football. It’s all football. The word “Junior” has been used for over 100 years to describe a level or grade of football in Scotland. Many teams and players are happy to see that continue and are happy to call themselves “junior” and play in a Junior Football League. I hope that’s cleared that up for you.

So how is it different to the football played in the EoS or SoS over the decades? It's not. Football is football. The survivalists of West Lothian will wake up one day.

[spit]

Just to bring this up to tonight.  
Interesting that two-thirds are from the Championship and League One. League Two clubs are still the quietest.
Pollok moving may help others to decide to go public after-all. Who knows?

29 Clubs which have Applied so far/have said that they will be applying:
Premiership (5)	Championship (11)	League One (	League Two (4)	Others (1)
Clydebank	Arthurlie	Bellshill Athletic	Ashfield	Drumchapel Utd PYM
Kilwinning Rangers	Blantyre Victoria	Glasgow Perthshire	Newmains United
Kirkintilloch Rob Roy	Cambuslang Rangers	Greenock Juniors	Vale of Clyde
Pollok	Cumbernauld United	Kello Rovers	Vale of Leven
Rutherglen Glencairn	Darvel	Larkhall Thistle
	Gartcairn Juniors	Maryhill
	Kilsyth Rangers	Port Glasgow Juniors
	Neilston Juniors	Royal Albert
	Petershill
	Renfrew
	Whitletts Victoria
Not known to have applied so far:
Auchinleck Talbot	Craigmark Burntonians	Ardrossan Winton Rovers	Annbank United
Beith Juniors	Dalry Thistle	Carluke Rovers	Ardeer Thistle
Benburb	Irvine Victoria	East Kilbride Thistle	Forth Wanderers
Cumnock Juniors	Shotts Bon Accord	Girvan	Johnstone Burgh
Glenafton Athletic	St Roch's	Lanark United	Lugar Boswell Thistle
Hurlford United		Lesmahagow Juniors	Maybole Juniors
Irvine Meadow XI		Shettleston	Muirkirk Juniors
Kilbirnie Ladeside		Wishaw Juniors	Saltcoats Victoria
Largs Thistle			St Anthony's
Rossvale			Thorniewood United
Troon			Yoker Athletic

Cumnock have applied for there licence so must have applied for senior status,

[DiamondOwl]

12 minutes ago, Marten said:

And what is the difference between junior football and senior "non league" football? I can tell you, there isn't any. It's the same game, 22 players on a pitch, playing for community clubs with hard working volunteers. It's all the same game and we should stop pretending there is some kind of major difference.

 

10 minutes ago, cmontheloknow said:

So how is it different to the football played in the EoS or SoS over the decades? It's not. Football is football. The survivalists of West Lothian will wake up one day.

To reply to both.... I stated "It's all football".

I didn't say there was any major difference between senior non-league football and junior football, did I?

The bottom line is that some clubs see no reason to throw away their junior history and are happy to continue to be defined by that grade/level.

Surely it's up to them if they want to continue to stay loyal to what they see as their identity?

Edited March 29, 2020 by DiamondOwl

[Hillonearth]

26 minutes ago, DiamondOwl said:

 

To reply to both.... I stated "It's all football".

I didn't say there was any major difference between senior non-league football and junior football, did I?

The bottom line is that some clubs see no reason to throw away their junior history and are happy to continue to be defined by that grade/level.

Surely it's up to them if they want to continue to stay loyal to what they see as their identity?

Couple of loaded statements there.

No-one's "throwing away" their history. My club has the founding date of 1884 on the front gates, and that'll remain 1884. We started off as a senior team, went junior in the 1890s because prevailing circumstances changed and if accepted into the WoSFL will go back senior in 2020 because circumstances have changed again. You can't preserve a football club in aspic and ignore the fact that the outside environment is in a state of flux.

It's not a case of "loyalty" or otherwise. Those in charge of a football club have a duty to do what they see as best for the club rather than to associations or grades of football, which after all are just groupings of clubs and have no real independent existence.

Edited March 29, 2020 by Hillonearth

[glensmad]

My information is that the number of actual applications by last night is considerably higher than the number of clubs who have actually declared that they have or will be applying.

[Marten]

22 minutes ago, DiamondOwl said:

 

To reply to both.... I stated "It's all football".

I didn't say there was any major difference between senior non-league football and junior football, did I?

The bottom line is that some clubs see no reason to throw away their junior history and are happy to continue to be defined by that grade/level.

Surely it's up to them if they want to continue to stay loyal to what they see as their identity?

You have at first claimed there is some sort of difference, like saying: "I used “Junior” as the adjective to define the level of the players playing the football", which excludes the SoS, EoS, LL, HL & NCL for no reason.

Obviously the WL clubs ultimately have to decide for themselves. But there is no rational argument to not switch other than just being afraid of any change. Especially now that with switching they can continue playing in the Junior Cup, which they see as very important. They are stuck in a bubble which is very damaging for the clubs in the long term. I find that especially sad to see happen to once great clubs like Whitburn. It will be of their own making, but I'd still rather not see the demise of such clubs for failing to accept things change.

[cmontheloknow]

I think what this month is increasingly teaching me is that life is too short for some things. Thanks Marten for replying there! If 'social distancing' is going to continue into the autumn, it will be a blessed relief when the football restarts!

[peasy23]

Cumnock have applied for there licence so must have applied for senior status,

Not necessarily. Like us they applied long before the new league was planned, almost certainly on the basis that by the time the application was being judged, the Junior leagues would have become part of the Pyramid. Done deal etc...

 

[Doonhamer1969]

20 hours ago, San Starko Rover said:

 

It’s more this

 

Genuine LOL 

[Vollyman]

Passed Central Park,Whitburn on a "daily" walk the other day and to my astonishment heard work being undertaken I.e the sound of a stihl saw.
Looked thru the turnstile next to the social club and it looks like Whitburn are putting an entrance or turnstile into and behind the "shed" on the Lomond Crescent side of the ground.
All in all in the last few yrs at Central park theres been new changing rooms erected,new steel main gates with "Central Park 1934" on them also a 40 seater stand plus 2 new dugouts and now the new entrance/turnstile into the shed.
Seems a lot of work being done just to stay where they are in the ERJFA!!

Same situation at Armadale in the last year a new roof on enclosure, Ladies,gents disabled toilets been built,east terracing refurbished, entrance to ground improved new enclosure on east terracing next project.great credit to the committee.Would be a shame to end up in some irrelevant league, the community who give good support to the club deserve a club competing at the highest level of non- league football

[Sergeant Wilson]

23 minutes ago, glensmad said:

My information is that the number of actual applications by last night is considerably higher than the number of clubs who have actually declared that they have or will be applying.

Like Covid 19, they are spreading unseen.

[Hillonearth]

8 minutes ago, Vollyman said:

Same situation at Armadale in the last year a new roof on enclosure, Ladies,gents disabled toilets been built,east terracing refurbished, entrance to ground improved new enclosure on east terracing next project.great credit to the committee.Would be a shame to end up in some irrelevant league, the community who give good support to the club deserve a club competing at the highest level of non- league football

I was over at Armadale for a game earlier this season and there seemed to have been a hell of a lot of improvements done from the last time I had been there a few years back...not least that mental deathtrap bit of terracing on the road side of the park finally being seen to! Even little things like the quarterly magazine gave the impression of them getting it together off the field.

Obviously no-one knows what's going on behind the scenes at another club, but it would be a real pity if they're perhaps being held back by one or two shouty committee types, one of which obviously knows the password to the club Twitter and is doing them no favours whatsoever.

 

 

[davie talbot]

GLENAFTON ATHLETIC CLUB STATEMENT

As most of out members and fans are aware of we were in talks to incorporate the junior set up into the SFA, but eventually the pyramid talks collapsed, sonafter long discussions on social media, group text and live feeds Glenafton Athletic has decided to apply for the proposed new league set up for next season.
There will be a new West of Scotland management committee formed and the it will be taken forward for presentation and as existing members of the Scottish junior FA we still will be eligible to continue to compete in the Scottish Junior Cup , but may be some alterations to suit the new league set up.
This is an enormous opportunity for our club to participate in this new exciting venture and challenge, all applications must be in for 7th April then to be ratified by the SFA in early June, but in the meantime we will keep everyone updated and release any information as it comes available.
So everyone please stay safe and healthy and hope we return to some normality in the near future

Yours in sport John Stewart (Glenafton Athletic Secretary)

Surprised that this hasn't been mentioned here or did I just miss it