gaz5 Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 The costs are identical for a LL run WOSFL or a WRJFA run WOSFL within the pyramid, i.e. zero if you are not seeking to obtain an SFA licence, or a variable figure depending on each individual club's starting point if they are looking to get licensed.That's actually not quite right.[emoji6]A WRJFA run league would be MORE EXPENSIVE than a LL run one.Presumably the Junior variant would retain fines for yellow and red cards which don't exist in the Pyramid (even for the top teams) or charging for permits for friendlies (permits don't exist in the senior leagues either), for example.I'm also pretty sure the yearly membership fee is a good bit less in the EoS and that includes all 4 types of insurance supplied by the league.Our screen fencing costs for meeting the licence criteria were covered entirely by those reduced fine and friendly costs within the pyramid. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
holmparkheroes Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 If, as the WJFA seem to be claiming, forming a WoSFL is going to come at an astronomical cost to clubs then why would they want to be involved? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnie_man Posted March 3, 2020 Author Share Posted March 3, 2020 3 hours ago, Burnie_man said: The EoS last season went with seeded Conferences for all, current members and newbies. Each Conference had an even balance of good teams, middle of the road, and weaker teams. The winners played-off for the title and LL promotion, the next 4 or 5 in each Conference went to this seasons Premier. It was tense all the way through, we scraped a Premier place on the last day on goal difference. Sure there were some humpings, but at the end of the day everyone knew it was for one season, and just got on with it and as has been said, you visited grounds you would never normally visit out with cup games. We also hosted (and visited) the likes of Linlithgow in a league game for the first time in over 30 years, we went to Ormiston for the first time in a very long time. It was enjoyable. On the flip side. maybe the smaller west teams who fancy moving will welcome a season hosting a few of the big fishes. As for floodlights, I've seen figures quoted from anywhere between £40k to £80k, it really does depend on individual clubs circumstances. Haddington have just switched on their lights, and they are a smaller club in the scheme of things. A combination of grants (Council and SFP), sponsors and fundraising usually sees clubs push it over the line. Not easy, but it is achievable and you don't need to do it immediately (or at all!). Dunipace are a great club for west clubs to talk to and find out their experiences. they've came from the bottom of the pile in the west and achieved a hell of a lot in a short space of time. The bottom line is, the WoSFL is a brand new league and it will take time to settle, there will be bumps along the way and no doubt mumps and moans, but clubs should be looking at where they want to be in 10 years time, not next year. None of the east clubs who left the Juniors regret it, it has been refreshing and a lot more professional, and the Scottish Cup for those who are licenced is great to look forward to and take part in. In 5 years time I guarantee you'll look back and wonder what all the fuss was about. Just to add to this, two former Junior clubs played each other in a league game on Saturday. The gate was over 1,500, and the home club made a 5 figure sum from the game. 3 seasons ago, these two were playing in the East Superleague in front of 150. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlanCamelonfan Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 12 minutes ago, Burnie_man said: Just to add to this, two former Junior clubs played each other in a league game on Saturday. The gate was over 1,500, and the home club made a 5 figure sum from the game. 3 seasons ago, these two were playing in the East Superleague in front of 150. Lets be honest has anyone regressed since they joined the pyramid? Linlithgow may be seen as but that is maybe because they were so far in front of everyone else. But they have upgraded their facilties, their unrest hasn't came from the grade. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnie_man Posted March 3, 2020 Author Share Posted March 3, 2020 (edited) 55 minutes ago, Burnie_man said: Just to add to this, two former Junior clubs played each other in a league game on Saturday. The gate was over 1,500, and the home club made a 5 figure sum from the game. 3 seasons ago, these two were playing in the East Superleague in front of 150. In addition, since leaving Junior football, the following clubs have gained a Licence; Kelty Hearts Bonnyrigg Rose Athletic Bo'ness United Hill of Beath Hawthorn Broxburn Athletic Tranent Juniors Camelon Juniors Dundonald Bluebell Penicuik Athletic Jeanfield Swifts Blackburn United Newtongrange Star Dunipace Haddington Athletic Easthouses Lily MW Linlithgow Rose were already Licenced when they left. Edited March 3, 2020 by Burnie_man 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enigma Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsimButtHitsASix Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 17 minutes ago, Burnie_man said: Just to add to this, two former Junior clubs played each other in a league game on Saturday. The gate was over 1,500, and the home club made a 5 figure sum from the game. 3 seasons ago, these two were playing in the East Superleague in front of 150. I know it's all hypothetical but would Kelty and Bonnyrigg have got as a crowd if they were battling it out to win the East Super League 3 years ago? Can't imagine it would have reached that figure 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlanCamelonfan Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 6 minutes ago, Burnie_man said: In addition, since leaving Junior football, the following clubs have gained a Licence; Kelty Hearts Bo'ness United Hill of Beath Hawthorn Broxburn Athletic Tranent Juniors Camelon Juniors Dundonald Bluebell Penicuik Athletic Jeanfield Swifts Blackburn United Newtongrange Star Dunipace Haddington Athletic Easthouses Lily MW Linlithgow Rose were already Licenced when they left. you missed out bonnyrigg 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BTID Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 Question no one has asked that may affect west junior clubs - would they have access to a U20s development league with this new proposal? I asked the question about the juniors lack of vision to create a pathway weeks ago to GR and got nothing. We’ve still to sit down with the committee and nothing has been decided, but have declared an expression of interest in joining the LL U20 should the rules be adjusted to let west clubs join. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlanCamelonfan Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 1 minute ago, BTID said: Question no one has asked that may affect west junior clubs - would they have access to a U20s development league with this new proposal? I asked the question about the juniors lack of vision to create a pathway weeks ago to GR and got nothing. We’ve still to sit down with the committee and nothing has been decided, but have declared an expression of interest in joining the LL U20 should the rules be adjusted to let west clubs join. They would if they got in the Lowland League West of scotland league. The sjfa version they wouldnt 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnie_man Posted March 3, 2020 Author Share Posted March 3, 2020 31 minutes ago, AlanCamelonfan said: you missed out bonnyrigg ooops 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BTID Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 4 minutes ago, AlanCamelonfan said: They would if they got in the Lowland League West of scotland league. The sjfa version they wouldnt The rules do need amended Alan to allow west clubs in but I’m told this should be ok at the agm. Think we all know the answer to the WJ ‘proposal’...won’t be any consideration for pathway. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnie_man Posted March 3, 2020 Author Share Posted March 3, 2020 40 minutes ago, Burnie_man said: In addition, since leaving Junior football, the following clubs have gained a Licence; Kelty Hearts Bonnyrigg Rose Athletic Bo'ness United Hill of Beath Hawthorn Broxburn Athletic Tranent Juniors Camelon Juniors Dundonald Bluebell Penicuik Athletic Jeanfield Swifts Blackburn United Newtongrange Star Dunipace Haddington Athletic Easthouses Lily MW Linlithgow Rose were already Licenced when they left. In addition, since leaving Junior football, the following clubs have formed an U20 team playing in the LL U20 Development League Edinburgh United Blackburn United Dundonald Bluebell Bonnyrigg Rose Athletic Dalkeith Thistle Hill of Beath Hawthorn Musselburgh Athletic Kelty Hearts Penicuik Athletic Dunipace Camelon Juniors Broxburn Athletic Newtongrange Star 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnie_man Posted March 3, 2020 Author Share Posted March 3, 2020 9 minutes ago, BTID said: Question no one has asked that may affect west junior clubs - would they have access to a U20s development league with this new proposal? I asked the question about the juniors lack of vision to create a pathway weeks ago to GR and got nothing. We’ve still to sit down with the committee and nothing has been decided, but have declared an expression of interest in joining the LL U20 should the rules be adjusted to let west clubs join. Well it appears only the WRJFA Premiership would be in the senior Pyramid, the levels below that would be plugged into it but remain Junior with own discipline, fines and fixtures. So the answer is, tier 6 clubs probably, others probably no, but then who knows. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John S Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 I rather suspect he does but, disappointingly, he is just the latest in a recent run of posters who are on this thread to obfuscate and confuse before making the claim that they and the Junior grade have been disrespected in some way when the answers they seek are set out patiently and clearly and turn out not to be to their liking. Understanding both the WRSJFA WoSFL offering and the LL/EoSFL WoSFL offering is indeed, as subsequently pointed out, exactly what he and many should be doing - but pedantically querying the LL/EoSFL position while making next to no (no?) queries of the WRSJFA position really isn't going to uncover the answers.Obfuscate. Cheers Sidney. I've not come across that one. I will use it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GordonS Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 51 minutes ago, AlanCamelonfan said: Lets be honest has anyone regressed since they joined the pyramid? Linlithgow may be seen as but that is maybe because they were so far in front of everyone else. But they have upgraded their facilties, their unrest hasn't came from the grade. Our woes are entirely about what happens on the pitch and would have happened regardless. I don't imagine our ability to attract good players and managers would have been better in the Juniors than now, that's for sure. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BTID Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 8 minutes ago, Burnie_man said: Well it appears only the WRJFA Premiership would be in the senior Pyramid, the levels below that would be plugged into it but remain Junior with own discipline, fines and fixtures. So the answer is, tier 6 clubs probably, others probably no, but then who knows. My question would be why the juniors don’t already have some sort of pathway or vision. Had years to set one up. Tells you everything you need to know about how forward thinking ‘the grade’ is. The squad cap rule is just farcical really and sums it up. Dark ages stuff. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bestsinceslicebread Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 (edited) 18 minutes ago, GordonS said: Our woes are entirely about what happens on the pitch and would have happened regardless. I don't imagine our ability to attract good players and managers would have been better in the Juniors than now, that's for sure. I definitely agree about attracting better players and managers/coaches is better to be in the senior grade than the junior grade but the same can be said of better local youth players. I'm still surprised about that Linlithgow don't have a development squad. I feel this is a chance to get more local people involved in Linlithlgow with a development team young lads will want to be a part of Linlithgow and join a Linlithgow academy if there was one and thus spark more interest with the team and you'd get the chance to bring on board better local youth players as they see the chance of making the senior grade with Linlithgow. Is a development team something that Linlithgow have looked into or they quite happy the way things are Edited March 3, 2020 by Bestsinceslicebread 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stulch Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 Just to add to this, two former Junior clubs played each other in a league game on Saturday. The gate was over 1,500, and the home club made a 5 figure sum from the game. 3 seasons ago, these two were playing in the East Superleague in front of 150. And because you could argue more was at stake because it made a difference towards who went into a play-off to get into the actual league... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross. Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 1 hour ago, Burnie_man said: Well it appears only the WRJFA Premiership would be in the senior Pyramid But how can the SJFA expect the clubs to be able to afford floodlights, toilets, improved changing facilities and all the rest?... I mean, that is being put forward as a reason for the WOSL under the LL not being viable for many? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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