Junior football, what is the future?

[Jacksgranda]

10 hours ago, craigkillie said:

This supposed maximum number is not formalised in any way, it seems to have come from a discussion at a previous PWG meeting and appears to have been plucked out of thin air by Maxwell or Petrie.

Quite a lot seems to have been plucked out of the air by quite a lot of people, many of whom should have known better.

[glensmad]

Just now, theesel1994 said:

It was the other way about - they asked to come to the Largs meeting from what I am led to believe. Someone from Largs will no doubt be going to the LL meeting.

Will Largs be then holding another public meeting so your representative can then feed back to your members the information from the LL meeting ?

[FairWeatherFan]

2 minutes ago, theesel1994 said:

Gordon Ronney and Bobby MacNamara.

Of Kilbirnie Ladeside and Ardrossan Winton Rovers for those that don't know.

[theesel1994]

1 minute ago, glensmad said:

Will Largs be then holding another public meeting so your representative can then feed back to your members the information from the LL meeting ?

They said at the meeting they intended doing so.

[Jacksgranda]

11 hours ago, the rambler said:

Why do all Clubs that join WOSFL have to be on an equal footing in conferences? 

Why can't League positions be used as a guide? 

Because all the clubs that apply/are admitted may not necessarily be juniors.

Edited March 3, 2020 by Jacksgranda
sllepnig

[glensmad]

Just now, theesel1994 said:

They said at the meeting they intended doing so.

That's good, it's only fair that both sides are heard so an informed decision can be reached.

[GNU_Linux]

Out of interest, did Largs Thistle also invite the LL reps to their meeting last night in the interests of balanced information ?

Keep in mind the short notice as all this WRJFA led malarkey only started on Friday & most of the LL will be east based (with exception of George Fraser) so they may not have had anyone available to send. Even so from what I gather the two west reps offered themselves to attend vs being invited.

[Dev]

2 hours ago, peasy23 said:

One simple fact that the WRSJFA guys can't get away from, despite what they say, is that the Lowland league will only accept one West feeder league, and that will be the one they are creating. No amount of posturing about SFA agms will change that.

In that regard some things I would want answered by the WOSFL when they meet with interested clubs:

1. Will all applicants be accepted (assuming they meet any ground criteria)?
2. What is the proposed new league format (Just a rough idea of the plans, obviously numbers will dictate the final set up) ?
3. Given that they are starting a new league with no cash in the bank, what benefits are there for clubs (e.g. prize money, first aid/coaching courses, grant funding for improvements)?

Indeed. This is what clubs will receive both at the meeting which is due shortly and in writing. Really helpful.

[San Starko Rover]

That's good, it's only fair that both sides are heard so an informed decision can be reached.

Do the WRJFA / SJFA plan to have a large scale meeting to pitch their league idea to member clubs and I guess any interested clubs outside the WRJFA? as you say both sides should put their points across. Then let clubs make their own minds up.

[Dev]

2 hours ago, AlanCamelonfan said:

Camelon did it for about 10k. Ok they did a lot of work themselves from the committee one of the guys is a retired electrical engineer. Ok we had donation of the poles from Angus broadwood and it took us a lit longer to get done because they were relying on guys who were working etc. But we got their in the end

There will be some clubs in the west which could also achieve something like this. Can anyone-else come up with some more useful tips?

[glensmad]

I notice that none of the West Region clubs have made any statement to back up the claims that they have "signed up" to the West Region's plan, as is being claimed.

There have been plenty of statements from clubs confirming interest in the LL's WoSFL plan, but none that I have seen confirming that any has committed to the WRSJFA's plan, despite what is being said.

[Dev]

2 hours ago, Born To Run said:

Another way to look at floodlight installation is of the potential reward to come once a license is acquired.

By gaining annual Scottish Cup entry, you’re just a couple of games away from a few thousand in prize money (especially if the changes to prelim rounds come in).

Long term, clubs can pay off the high initial cost with a few good runs.

….. and as more "non-league" clubs become licenced the better the chances of getting through a round or two each season so maybe £6k or more in some years.

[Dev]

1 hour ago, theesel1994 said:

It was someone at the meeting that brought up the £90K cost. Gordon Ronney said it will cost clubs a minimum of £150K to get grounds to SFA Licence standard.

That doesn't add up.

I dare say that very few west Juniors aren't already meeting any criteria likely to be required by the WoSFL (Lowland). More than that there must be approaching twenty or so which cannot be far off having grounds which already meet Club Licencing standards. Any west clubs not concerned about aiming for Tier 5 (Lowland League) doesn't even need to consider what the Licencing requirements are in any case.

[AlanCamelonfan]

2 minutes ago, Dev said:

That doesn't add up.

I dare say that very few west Juniors aren't already meeting any criteria likely to be required by the WoSFL (Lowland). More than that there must be approaching twenty or so which cannot be far off having grounds which already meet Club Licencing standards. Any west clubs not concerned about aiming for Tier 5 (Lowland League) doesn't even need to consider what the Licencing requirements are in any case.

Quite a lot of them will probably only need lights 

[Dev]

2 hours ago, Marshmallo said:

Maryhill, for example, have already had a licensed club use their stadium. What's the £150k getting spent on there?

Clydebank/Yoker are going to be really disappointed that Holm Park is still at least £150k away given all the work they've just done. The positive for them is it's only £75k each.

Good point! Ground sharers can split the costs or the host club does and pays for works and then gets that back by increased rent and or increased use of the ground if there is a suitable all-weather surface etc. Getting local groups to use these facilities during the week and even on Sundays etc will help clubs to tie further into their communities.

Edited March 3, 2020 by Dev
up-date

[gaz5]

 
Fantastic, both Dunipace and Inverkeithing seemed to have people asking questions about their reasons for joining and both have done fantastic these last two years potential playoff too.
 
Out of interest can you reveal a rough estimate of how much the club spent to gain it’s licence? I appreciate this may be something the club can’t reveal on a public forum. Have you found any negatives to your move? I know a few teams were unhappy about cup gates not being split in the EOS.

Our only "complaint" thus far is a second season at Tier 7 conferences next year, rather than a first division. But that was done openly, via a vote of all the clubs, so it's not really a complaint and was done the right way.

Our experience, and this goes for all the league's (LL/EoS/SoS) is that it's far more open, everyone from the largest club to the smallest club has the same voice and the league committees treat all those voices equally.

Nothing is decided behind closed doors and told to the clubs, the committee's operate more from a position of providing workable options for the clubs to choose between, facilitating discussion and decision making and then making the required rule changes etc. to implement those decisions.

The office bearers are fantastic, always available to help with queries and the level of organisation in terms of how things operate is certainly, in our opinion, night and day.

I think most of our former junior colleagues would echo this statement, but seeing how the EoS runs and our experience within that has been a breath of fresh air.

In terms of licence spend, not going to give any figures on that in public, but it's nowhere near what has been quoted.

We've had floodlights at Westfield since the 70's and those were replaced as part of our park regeneration, but none of the other licence requirements were part of the regeneration work. Covered Enclosure, Disabled enclosure, Toilet Block, Dressing Room Upgrades, fencing, signage, policies etc were all self funded post ground upgrade.

There are several ways to do that, including grants etc.

The biggest commitment, and I know this from experience, is time. The time to understand what you need, to come up with a plan for that and to then chunk that up into deliverable pieces.

[Burnie_man]

24 minutes ago, theesel1994 said:

They said at the meeting they intended doing so.

What evidence did they offer up to prove that they are able to force themselves into the LL play-offs without any of the leagues agreeing to it?    What evidence did they offer up to prove the SFA invited them, as opposed to TJ writing to the SFA Board asking for access (which actually is the real story)?

Did anyone ask about EGM's and mandates?

[gaz5]

I had brought up your club in a discussion and said if Dunipace can do it so could Largs as their ground wasn't exactly spectacular. I was meaning we should visit a ground that is like ours (an old established ground) and not a new facility (like say Blackburn). I was then reminded it was about 28 years ago I was at Dunipace.

Up until 2 years ago it probably hadn't changed since you were last there! [emoji1787][emoji1787]

[Dev]

1 hour ago, gaz5 said:

Anyone on here who is connected with a West Region club who would like a run-through of our experience in the licence process/move to the seniors, given we're a former West Region club who have taken that opportunity, feel free to message me.

I ran the licence process for us, in terms of figuring out the requirements and working with the committee to get the boxes ticked and get us through audit, so I know the process/requirements inside out.

When we left the juniors we were third bottom of the lowest Tier, essentially Tier 9 and plenty of people questioned the logic, not knowing our plans behind the scenes.

Next season we'll play in the Scottish Cup and this season we're competing at the top of Tier 7 (2 levels above where we were in the WRSJFA) and play the South Cup Quarter Final on Saturday, our first such tie in over a decade, having beaten Bonnyrigg in the last round.

Anyone from any of the Top West clubs close to drinking the Kool-aid on why progress can't be made need only look at the size of club we are and what we've managed in less than 2 years.

It will be interesting to see which current lower Division West clubs and Amateurs respond to the opportunity which is now open for them - just as Dunipace did. 

[Jacksgranda]

3 hours ago, cmontheloknow said:

I am not anonymous. My fecking name's on one of these forums!

 

3 hours ago, peasy23 said:

Some of us even know where you live.