Junior football, what is the future?

[Burnie_man]

21 minutes ago, Robert James said:

I would anticipate that the LL will issue a statement after 29th Feb, confirming the number of clubs that have "expressed an interest". They won't however release the names of these clubs, as there has been a promise of confidentiality.  It will then be up to the clubs themselves, to issue a statement...... or not, as the case may be.

29th February !!!!    Well it is leap year.

 

They wont do anything until after 1st March, which is the closing date for registering interest.  Also 29th is a Saturday and I guess everyone will be at a game......

[wow-wee]

I think about 30 clubs then come March the 31st it could be around 40 then when it's announced officially who's moving then who is left will be phoning asking if it's too late to join and every West club will move .

[Robert James]

32 minutes ago, Burnie_man said:

They wont do anything until after 1st March, which is the closing date for registering interest.  Also 29th is a Saturday and I guess everyone will be at a game......

Yes BM, thank you for the clarification.

I deliberately said  "until after the 29th Feb"  (which is factually correct-: and yes I did know it is was the Sunday before 1/3/20), because it enabled me to link it to a  leap  year pun (ie clubs leaping into a new pyramid future).    Apologies that my 'joke' was too subtle.  I must try harder !

 

[TFW]

Just as a matter of interest....are there any other clubs currently in the EoSL and / or LL that are spending disproportionate amounts of money in trying to secure promotion? Kelty are the obvious ones, Fergie certainly won't come cheap, and I understand East Stirling had a "war chest" this season as well.

I realise we couldn't get into any kind of situation whereby there would be a Financial Fair Play set up, so what do folk feel the likelihood is, in the not too distant future of clubs not just scrambling to join the Pyramid set up, but then putting themselves at financial risk by trying to fast track promotion?

Any other clubs currently in the pyramid set up spending more on players than they ever did before?

 

[FairWeatherFan]

10 minutes ago, TFW said:

Just as a matter of interest....are there any other clubs currently in the EoSL and / or LL that are spending disproportionate amounts of money in trying to secure promotion? Kelty are the obvious ones, Fergie certainly won't come cheap, and I understand East Stirling had a "war chest" this season as well.

I realise we couldn't get into any kind of situation whereby there would be a Financial Fair Play set up, so what do folk feel the likelihood is, in the not too distant future of clubs not just scrambling to join the Pyramid set up, but then putting themselves at financial risk by trying to fast track promotion?

Any other clubs currently in the pyramid set up spending more on players than they ever did before?

 

Other than Kelty and East Stirlingshire the only team that springs to mind that spends more money than usual right now is Darvel.

[Guest]

Just as a matter of interest....are there any other clubs currently in the EoSL and / or LL that are spending disproportionate amounts of money in trying to secure promotion? Kelty are the obvious ones, Fergie certainly won't come cheap, and I understand East Stirling had a "war chest" this season as well.
I realise we couldn't get into any kind of situation whereby there would be a Financial Fair Play set up, so what do folk feel the likelihood is, in the not too distant future of clubs not just scrambling to join the Pyramid set up, but then putting themselves at financial risk by trying to fast track promotion?
Any other clubs currently in the pyramid set up spending more on players than they ever did before?
 

Spending becomes an individualised process for me. If a club can spend money on players and stadium upgrades because their income is greater than others then that should be alright.

As long as clubs are sustainable then there should be no issue in the longer term.

The fear for certain clubs, senior and junior would be if the money stopped coming in for whatever reason but they still tried to spend the same. For example if their sponsorship stopped or lowered or people putting money in backed away for business reasons.

Not a massive issue if the club are happy they aren't spending out with their means.

[RedEd]

3 hours ago, LongTimeLurker said:

Prorege had the Brechin lobbying for a boundary shift info posted before anyone else did so has some credibility. Here's the link:

https://nonleaguematters.co.uk/forums/index.php?threads/east-of-scotland-league.870/post-11487

I'm not doubting the accuracy of that claim, but Prorege thinks the North Juniors will retain their status as Juniors if they become a feeder for the Highland League.

Edited February 23, 2020 by RedEd

[stanley]

11 minutes ago, RedEd said:

I'm not doubting the accuracy of that claim, but Prorege thinks the North Juniors will retain their status as Juniors if they become a feeder for the Highland League.

It would be ironic if the region that supposedly has least attachment to the junior name, is the only one that ends up keeping it.

[RedEd]

2 minutes ago, stanley said:

It would be ironic if the region that supposedly has least attachment to the junior name, is the only one that ends up keeping it.

True. But by the sounds of it Tayside and West Lothian will make sure that doesn't happen.

[LongTimeLurker]

4 minutes ago, RedEd said:

True. But by the sounds of it Tayside and West Lothian will make sure that doesn't happen.

...and as you point out the north region probably would have to be on their way out of the junior fold if they hook up with the HL and NCL unless TJ gets his mandate changed.

[nicotina]

Man city backers are now going to uefa to cite

darvel & kelty for financial foul play

 

 

 

 

 

[Robert James]

1 hour ago, RedEd said:

True. But by the sounds of it Tayside and West Lothian will make sure that doesn't happen.

Crazy, if true

[calmac25]

The irony of that balloon having a go at anyone else for dragging a thread off topic [emoji38]
And what of SFA members Golspie Sutherland? Sources say neighbours are objecting to the installation of lights, which may prejudice their SFA license.

Planning permission has been approved

[EdinburghBlue]

The whole concept of the Pyramid is to try and get some kind of level playing field whereby (a) non league clubs (sorry if I've offended anyone with that term!) have the ability to rise up the leagues, and find their true level, at the same time (b) giving teams who fall out of the SPFL a safety net from which to possibly regroup and try and find their way back in. Looking at how Berwick and East Stirling have done since being relegated it seems that once clubs do end up non league, having been in the SPFL, it's a long way back.
Looking at the English set up with the National League, and it's feeders the National Leagues South and North the ex league clubs are finding it increasingly difficult to get back into the League again. In the National League, just one step below the Football League there are twelve ex league teams. In the National League North there are a further five, plus Hereford who reformed after losing their place. That's a healthy set up for the non league game as far as crowds are concerned. Will it happen in Scotland? It doesn't appear likely at the minute, you'd need a big club to fall through the trap door. Berwick and East Stirling don't have large travelling supports although their home support seems to be holding up fairly well.
The SPFL has needed a clear out for donkey's years, and it now seems it's coming along big style. If either Brechin or Albion Rovers get relegated this season there doesn't appear to be any easy route back if the LL gets stronger year by year with the addition of the top ex Junior clubs. Wast at Queen of the South vs Dundee today, and it was absolute dross. A couple of Queens fans who know my affiliation with Talbot were only saying half in jest that they expected to be playing Talbot in a few years time. There's a lot of water under the bridge before anything like that could ever happen, but it's certainly not out of the question for Talbot or any other non league side now it would appear.

I’ve seen an analysis that since automatic promotion and relegation were introduced in 1987, roughly a third of Football League clubs relegated have returned, a third are still in the Conference, and a third are either at a lower level or have gone bust.

Of the 27 ex-Conference teams currently in the Football League, 18 had at least one previous spell in the EFL. So a lot of clubs are shuttling back and forwards.

No reason why this can’t happen in Scotland over time.

PS a bit OTT to claim Berwick are struggling when they haven’t even completed their first non-league season!

[Robert James]

2 hours ago, calmac25 said:

11 hours ago, Marshmallo said:

The irony of that balloon having a go at anyone else for dragging a thread off topic
And what of SFA members Golspie Sutherland? Sources say neighbours are objecting to the installation of lights, which may prejudice their SFA license.

Planning permission has been approved

No resident's appeals were lodged.

[Darvel_Marvel]

Other than Kelty and East Stirlingshire the only team that springs to mind that spends more money than usual right now is Darvel.

Darvel are in the Championship at present (T7) not the LL. The money being spent is not disproportionate as we were always needing to invest heavily in existing/new infrastructure which was “life expired” - new dressing room extension, new function suite/social club/catering/sheltered terrace/new bucket seats for main stand/pitch improvements. Yes we had a mass exodus of players at start of season and re-build project was agreed when we brought new manager in with target being promotion to premier. Regardless of pyramid/junior future - improvements would always have been made in line with our vision/strategy.

[cmontheloknow]

6 hours ago, Darvel_Marvel said:

Darvel are in the Championship at present (T7) not the LL. The money being spent is not disproportionate as we were always needing to invest heavily in existing/new infrastructure which was “life expired” - new dressing room extension, new function suite/social club/catering/sheltered terrace/new bucket seats for main stand/pitch improvements. Yes we had a mass exodus of players at start of season and re-build project was agreed when we brought new manager in with target being promotion to premier. Regardless of pyramid/junior future - improvements would always have been made in line with our vision/strategy.

Forgetting bringing facilities into the 20th century, unless the player budget is what you were spending a few years ago, that has gone up surely?

[cmontheloknow]

9 hours ago, EdinburghBlue said:

 

I’ve seen an analysis that since automatic promotion and relegation were introduced in 1987, roughly a third of Football League clubs relegated have returned, a third are still in the Conference, and a third are either at a lower level or have gone bust.

Of the 27 ex-Conference teams currently in the Football League, 18 had at least one previous spell in the EFL. So a lot of clubs are shuttling back and forwards.

No reason why this can’t happen in Scotland over time.

PS a bit OTT to claim Berwick are struggling when they haven’t even completed their first non-league season!

Berwick have struggled this season. 8 wins in all comps from 35 games. They have lost 21/35. Whether it's a long term pattern remains to be seen but they haven't taken to life in the LL like a duck(et) to water... more like a cat.

[Born To Run]

1 minute ago, cmontheloknow said:

Berwick have struggled this season. 8 wins in all comps from 35 games. They have lost 21/35. Whether it's a long term pattern remains to be seen but they haven't taken to life in the LL like a duck(et) to water... more like a cat.

It took Berwick a long time to adjust, not helped by boardroom upheaval over the summer. They’ve finally got a settled squad together and look like a cohesive unit - people definitely underestimate the talent level in the Lowland though. Put their current team in place at the start of the season and they’d still be outside the top 4/5 IMO.

[cmontheloknow]

11 minutes ago, Born To Run said:

It took Berwick a long time to adjust, not helped by boardroom upheaval over the summer. They’ve finally got a settled squad together and look like a cohesive unit - people definitely underestimate the talent level in the Lowland though. Put their current team in place at the start of the season and they’d still be outside the top 4/5 IMO.

I think there's a bit of a 'no fans, must be cack' POV from some less informed. BSC have a squad littered with decent ex Juniors and would be right up there in our division.