Junior football, what is the future?

[Burnie_man]

17 minutes ago, G4Mac said:

Any LL2 will most likely be a licensed league, or else what would the point be to call it a LL subsidiary and not just say it's a wosfl? A landing place for currently licensed clubs and a place for newly licensed clubs to apply to join once it is formed.

Nothing official but what has been discussed during numerous other conversations.

Any LL2 will be licenced, there's currently no obligation for it to be if it sits between LL and EoS/WoS/SoS at tier 6, but I doubt the LL are in the business of setting-up a second division with unlicenced clubs involved.  Also, I guess there is still scope for it to evolve into LL2West and LL2East.

However I think it will be kicked down the road a season or two until the WoSFL get's upto speed with licencing, otherwise it will just be the EoS Premier renamed.

[holmparkheroes]

1 hour ago, BANKIEBILL said:

reddest of red ticks 

Aw Bill !

[Ginaro]

2 hours ago, Burnie_man said:

 The outcome of the recent Pyramid Working Group and the subsequent statement from the Lowland League suggesting they intend “taking the process forward” has caused further consternation and  uncertainty. I note that the statement doesn’t suggest any detail on how this process might work. It has been suggested elsewhere that “expressions of interest “ will be issued – however will,  as suggested  “every club in the Lowland area have the opportunity to progress through the Pyramid”  or only  a selected few.
 
Its interesting to note that as far as I am aware, neither the EOS or LL have sought agreement as yet or received permission  from the Scottish FA to form a new League(s)
 
We have been consistent in advocating that the Pyramid void in the West of Scotland can be readily filled and administered by the existing West Region structure. We have also been seeking assurances that the North and East  Regions are given the same fair and equitable opportunities

What kind of a question is that? Currently every senior club in the Lowland area already has the opportunity to progress through the Pyramid (of course a licence is needed for tier 5) but adding a WOS league just means west clubs will have the same opportunity as every other club in the pyramid.

As for permission, if the LL/EOS set it up it's highly unlikely the SFA will say no if the SOS also agrees. If the SOS doesn't agree the SFA might say no and reiterate their stance that west clubs should join the SOS, but given the interest so far the SOS might not want to have that sort of influx so instead would agree to the WOS.

[Arthurlie1981]

What kind of a question is that? Currently every senior club in the Lowland area already has the opportunity to progress through the Pyramid (of course a licence is needed for tier 5) but adding a WOS league just means west clubs will have the same opportunity as every other club in the pyramid.
As for permission, if the LL/EOS set it up it's highly unlikely the SFA will say no if the SOS also agrees. If the SOS doesn't agree the SFA might say no and reiterate their stance that west clubs should join the SOS, but given the interest so far the SOS might not want to have that sort of influx so instead would agree to the WOS.

Have I missed something? When was the SFA stance on west moving to to SOSFL mentioned.

[Che Dail]

24 minutes ago, TheLad said:

The TJ statement is quite sad.
It's the (poorly chosen) words of a man desperate to keep his job. Probably his last meaningful job.

He wants everyone across but only under his empire.

If he truly cared about the clubs within west, he would be doing all he could do facilitate this.

He could actually have a legacy as the man who facilitated the full modernisation of Scottish football.

Instead he may be seen as the man who grasped onto what he could, letting teams slip through a bit at a time, while stunting the natural progression of all involved.

The path is clear, undeniable and fair play to those showing a loyalty to an organisation that has served them well.

TJ, if you love them, set them free!

Scottish football is too small to have arguing wee factions. All in, under the one structure, is the only way.

The clubs will still have the same history, same memories, same trophies in the cabinet, just a new chapter, with no limits.

See this article 2 years ago:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/sport/football/focus-local-football-juniors-clubs-could-not-be-convinced-283034%3famp

"We will learn".

But they didn't.

Went back to the table time after time with nothing and failed their members repeatedly.

Edited February 11, 2020 by Che Dail

[Ginaro]

Just now, Arthurlie1981 said:

Have I missed something? When was the SFA stance on west moving to to SOSFL mentioned.

Not recently but in relation to the likes of Talbot, Clydebank as the final stage of going for a licence. Basically if the WOS is blocked by the SFA/SOS (unlikely) and the SJFA continue their all-in nonsense (very likely) then the only other option is to join the SOS.

[AlanCamelonfan]

30 minutes ago, GNU_Linux said:

Full list so far:

Kilwinning Rangers
Clydebank
Whitletts Victoria
Irvine Meadow
Rutherglen Glencairn
Maryhill
Rossvale
Largs Thistle

Plus potentially bonnyton caledonian braves reserves and a bsc team. Plus more. So looks like wosfl could be on  3xt season 

[San Starko Rover]

Have I missed something? When was the SFA stance on west moving to to SOSFL mentioned.

Talbot were told that when they tried to get licensed a few years ago.

[LongTimeLurker]

22 minutes ago, Burnie_man said:

Any LL2 will be licenced, ...

What is your source for that?

[Che Dail]

11 minutes ago, Ginaro said:

Basically if the WOS is blocked by the SFA/SOS (unlikely) 

I can't see how it can be blocked - the EoS was prepared to accept Clydebank, and now it is basically saying it is willing to accept Clydebank plus at least 9 more, and regionalise their structure at T6 forming a pathway into the LL. 

It already has an SFA mandate, and the LL are on board with this, so what's to block? The path is clear.

Edited February 11, 2020 by Che Dail

[Burnie_man]

5 minutes ago, LongTimeLurker said:

What is your source for that?

A LL source.

Edited February 11, 2020 by Burnie_man

[Salvo Montalbano]

Getting desperate........



Dear All
 
The outcome of the recent Pyramid Working Group and the subsequent statement from the Lowland League suggesting they intend “taking the process forward” has caused further consternation and  uncertainty. I note that the statement doesn’t suggest any detail on how this process might work. It has been suggested elsewhere that “expressions of interest “ will be issued – however will,  as suggested  “every club in the Lowland area have the opportunity to progress through the Pyramid”  or only  a selected few.
 
Its interesting to note that as far as I am aware, neither the EOS or LL have sought agreement as yet or received permission  from the Scottish FA to form a new League(s)
 
We have been consistent in advocating that the Pyramid void in the West of Scotland can be readily filled and administered by the existing West Region structure. We have also been seeking assurances that the North and East  Regions are given the same fair and equitable opportunities
 
Whilst it is not the intention to reschedule any further meetings of the PWG meantime, I am continuing communication with the Scottish FA and Rod Petrie has agreed to attend our Management Committee meeting on Thursday evening.
 
I would ask that all clubs stay resolute at this time and hopefully it can be facilitated  that we can process through the Pyramid from within the Junior structure.
 
Regards
Tom Johnston
Scottish Junior FA

So he's worried about exclusivity and not every club in the Lowland Region being part of the pyramid but at the same time says that the WSJFA can slot straight in therefore meaning non-Junior clubs such as Glasgow Uni, Oban or whomever wouldn't be included. So which is it?

[crfc]

Tom johnston seems desperately crasping at straws unless he can move the game it's all change rather than sit still as the scottish game is doing seems to be stuck around the 60s time to move into pyramid system that benefits the game not just a few

[Burnie_man]

1 minute ago, Che Dail said:

I can't see how it can happen - the EoS was prepared to accept Clydebank, and now it is basically saying it is willing to accept Clydebank plus at least 9 more, and regionalise the structure at T6 forming a pathway into the LL. 

It already has a mandate, and the LL are on board with this, so what's to block? The path is clear.

The LL, EoS and SoS run the Pyramid between them, inc South Challenge Cup and the play-off procedure.   I can't see the SoS creating issues (eg refusing to amend PO procedure). They've had their moan at the behest of TAJ and they'll go back to their ambivalent view of it all.

Very few - if any - of their current members want to be playing in the LL so they probably fear slipping into obscurity, esp if the likes of Threave or Bonnyton fancy a shot at better competition in a WoSFL. There's also the prospect of Dalbeattie and Gretna fancying WoS rather than drop into the SoS in the event of relegation, because once they drop out of LL they're probably not getting back anyway.

[Arthurlie1981]

Talbot were told that when they tried to get licensed a few years ago.

I understand and that is ok for Talbot as they are close to the boundary but I believe Clydebank were given the option of either (I could be wrong)

Anyway doesn’t really matter as Ginaro’s point is speculative as we don’t know what the future holds in regards to this. I had just wondered if something had changed and I had missed it (and it hasn’t).

[Arthurlie1981]

I agree with a poster above, we should be prepared from some sort of announcement after Thursdays management meeting with one or more of the following;

1. Done deal
2. EOS/LL poaching clubs
3. PWG to meet again in the future
4. SOSFL are going to block a WOSFL

Finished with a Churchillian rallying of the clubs to stick together.

[Cameron Wilson]

1 hour ago, Robert James said:

A north agreement is believed to be close, as is one with the NCL.

But unless the SJFA/TJ  officially drops his "all in" approach for the remaining ERJFA clubs, there can be no agreement, and the 'stand-off' will continue, year on year.

The leading West clubs won't accept another year where they are NOT in the pyramid.

The West clubs who don't wish to join the pyramid, can stay as they are, with a limited restructuring. Or they could (either now or later), become a junior  'feeder' league to the senior West (pyramid) League.   

It appears that the north juniors are acting independently of the rest of the JFA. Is that the case Robert? If im not mistaken they historically seem to be a bit detached from the rest - the fact their teams joined the HL without any drama in the past, the geographical distance, and also the fact that they are very much second fiddle in their area to a senior league.

But if the north can go their own way, the east juniors can do the same, at least the south of the tay clubs, by joining the EOS.

[Cameron Wilson]

59 minutes ago, TheLad said:

The TJ statement is quite sad.
It's the (poorly chosen) words of a man desperate to keep his job. Probably his last meaningful job.

He wants everyone across but only under his empire.

If he truly cared about the clubs within west, he would be doing all he could do facilitate this.

He could actually have a legacy as the man who facilitated the full modernisation of Scottish football.

Instead he may be seen as the man who grasped onto what he could, letting teams slip through a bit at a time, while stunting the natural progression of all involved.

The path is clear, undeniable and fair play to those showing a loyalty to an organisation that has served them well.

TJ, if you love them, set them free!

Scottish football is too small to have arguing wee factions. All in, under the one structure, is the only way.

The clubs will still have the same history, same memories, same trophies in the cabinet, just a new chapter, with no limits.

Best post of the week. 100% on the nose.

[Hillonearth]

1 hour ago, TheLad said:

The TJ statement is quite sad.
It's the (poorly chosen) words of a man desperate to keep his job. Probably his last meaningful job.

He wants everyone across but only under his empire.

If he truly cared about the clubs within west, he would be doing all he could do facilitate this.

He could actually have a legacy as the man who facilitated the full modernisation of Scottish football.

Instead he may be seen as the man who grasped onto what he could, letting teams slip through a bit at a time, while stunting the natural progression of all involved.

The path is clear, undeniable and fair play to those showing a loyalty to an organisation that has served them well.

TJ, if you love them, set them free!

Scottish football is too small to have arguing wee factions. All in, under the one structure, is the only way.

The clubs will still have the same history, same memories, same trophies in the cabinet, just a new chapter, with no limits.

Oh, I dunno...

 

[BANKIEBILL]

1 hour ago, holmparkheroes said:

Aw Bill !

 ..chronic