Junior football, what is the future?

[cmontheloknow]

5 hours ago, Hampden Diehard said:

On 26/12/2019 at 21:15, GNU_Linux said:

iirc back in 70s or 80s Pollok nearly moved to somewhere in Pollokshields
 
 

Safeway ( now Morrisons) offered to buy their ground, which is on a main road, and build them a new one about 200 yards away, but they turned it down. Different days, right enough, when their crowds were better and they got funding from the social club.

The rebuild was to be where Homebase is on Cogan Road. From what I have heard, there were concerns about some of the locals taking too much interest in the facilities after hours.

Edited December 31, 2019 by cmontheloknow

[wow-wee]

8 minutes ago, cmontheloknow said:

The rebuild was to be where Homebase is on Cogan Road. From what I have heard, there were concerns about some of the locals taking too much interest in the facilities after hours.

Do you think it's something pollok may regret now not moving to a modern facility when you consider the problems that newlandfield have through lack of basic facilities and the cost of putting these in place .

[cmontheloknow]

3 minutes ago, wow-wee said:

Do you think it's something pollok may regret now not moving to a modern facility when you consider the problems that newlandfield have through lack of basic facilities and the cost of putting these in place .

The view was it was the wrong place to move to so who knows what sort of club there would have been there.

[Mr Prez]

On 29/12/2019 at 23:55, BTID said:

This Friday night

8pm ko at Holm Park

Thank you bud I had not noticed this in my fone which had been sent out will be there

[parsforlife]

Think there would have to be some work done to join the Fife FA. Dundonald and HoB were only officially accepted once they became SFA members.

Fife FA only accept full SFA members.

[glensmad]

West Region General Meeting on Wednesday 16th January 2020, primarily to discuss the pyramid proposals.

It'll be interesting to see which option of the four is recommended by the management, and whether this option is the agreed preferred option of the clubs. 

Edited January 9, 2020 by glensmad

[Meadowman]

16 minutes ago, glensmad said:

West Region General Meeting on Wednesday 16th January 2020, primarily to discuss the pyramid proposals.

It'll be interesting to see which option of the four is recommended by the management, and whether this option is the agreed preferred option of the clubs. 

Hopefully they’ll discuss the fiasco at New Cumnock and the game at Renfrew,don’t sweep it under the carpet 

[Ginaro]

2 hours ago, glensmad said:

West Region General Meeting on Wednesday 16th January 2020, primarily to discuss the pyramid proposals.

It'll be interesting to see which option of the four is recommended by the management, and whether this option is the agreed preferred option of the clubs. 

Well three of the options have the West coming in at tier 6 so in that sense it doesn't really matter which one the clubs choose.

However the question is, what happens once the West agrees to join at tier 6, but the East aren't happy with options 1 or 2, i.e. staying out of the pyramid or joining at tier 7? (option 3: tier 6, having been rejected last season by the EOS) Does the SJFA then report back to the PWG to say they don't have agreement, or do they just default to option 1 so the west can join?

Edited January 9, 2020 by Ginaro

[Bestsinceslicebread]

44 minutes ago, Ginaro said:

Well three of the options have the West coming in at tier 6 so in that sense it doesn't really matter which one the clubs choose.

However the question is, what happens once the West agrees to join at tier 6, but the East aren't happy with options 1 or 2, i.e. staying out of the pyramid or joining at tier 7? (option 3: tier 6, having been rejected last season by the EOS) Does the SJFA then report back to the PWG to say they don't have agreement, or do they just default to option 1 so they west can join?

I think its inevitable that the EOS will reject the ERSJFA coming in at tier 6 and the ERSJFA don't want to come in at tier 7 so it will be a stalemate and the east region juniors will stay junior for the foreseeable future.  The West just arrange accordingly to join in at Teir6 and go from there.  Once the west joins the ERSJFA will find it difficult to stay in the junior rank with only the North region for company.  The only reason why the SJFA will not allow the West to join as a whole is that is West leaves, it gives the SJFA less of a bargaining tool.

[Kennie]

1 hour ago, glensmad said:

West Region General Meeting on Wednesday 16th January 2020, primarily to discuss the pyramid proposals.

It'll be interesting to see which option of the four is recommended by the management, and whether this option is the agreed preferred option of the clubs. 

It's on Thursday not Wednesday.

[glensmad]

It's on Thursday not Wednesday.

So it is, correct date though. [emoji106]

[perthmo]

I think its inevitable that the EOS will reject the ERSJFA coming in at tier 6 and the ERSJFA don't want to come in at tier 7 so it will be a stalemate and the east region juniors will stay junior for the foreseeable future.  The West just arrange accordingly to join in at Teir6 and go from there.  Once the west joins the ERSJFA will find it difficult to stay in the junior rank with only the North region for company.  The only reason why the SJFA will not allow the West to join as a whole is that is West leaves, it gives the SJFA less of a bargaining tool.

But surely the West clubs will remain Junior if they join the pyramid. The West Region will continue as it is. Teams will play in the Scottish Junior Cup and West of Scotland Cup. All that will have changed is that the Champions might go up to the Lowland League and any of the 63 clubs could try to get a licence if they wanted.

This isn’t about Junior clubs turning Senior. It is about Juniors joining the Pyramid.

[Bestsinceslicebread]

3 minutes ago, perthmo said:

 

But surely the West clubs will remain Junior if they join the pyramid. The West Region will continue as it is. Teams will play in the Scottish Junior Cup and West of Scotland Cup. All that will have changed is that the Champions might go up to the Lowland League and any of the 63 clubs could try to get a licence if they wanted.

This isn’t about Junior clubs turning Senior. It is about Juniors joining the Pyramid.

 

Yes I believe so but they wont be under the junior name anymore, they will be part of the pyramid and if they join in at tier 6 then tier 5 would be promotion to the Lowland league if the champions of the west win  the play off games, whatever way the play off games are arranged.

As far as im aware not many of the 25 odd junior teams from the East junior region who joined the |EOS two years ago are no longer junior teams

[Burnie_man]

9 minutes ago, perthmo said:

But surely the West clubs will remain Junior if they join the pyramid. The West Region will continue as it is. Teams will play in the Scottish Junior Cup and West of Scotland Cup. All that will have changed is that the Champions might go up to the Lowland League and any of the 63 clubs could try to get a licence if they wanted.

This isn’t about Junior clubs turning Senior. It is about Juniors joining the Pyramid.

So what happens if say, Cumbernauld Colts are relegated from the LL, do they have to apply for membership of the SJFA and the WRJFA?

This is the problem with trying to keep the SJFA relevant, they have no business being involved.  Let the WRJFA control their own affairs in senior football as a league body, league's are members of the Pyramid, not Associations.

[parsforlife]

If the SJFA is going to exist at all with member clubs in the pyramid then surely it can only be in the manner the regional FA’s currently work.

Therefore Cumbernauld colts can play in the west premiership without joining the SJFA and talbot can get promoted without resigning their membership.

This would mean things they would need to give up things like control over disciplinary etc and also if they run a cup it wouldn’t be able to be run on league dates.   

[FairWeatherFan]

16 minutes ago, perthmo said:

 

But surely the West clubs will remain Junior if they join the pyramid. The West Region will continue as it is. Teams will play in the Scottish Junior Cup and West of Scotland Cup. All that will have changed is that the Champions might go up to the Lowland League and any of the 63 clubs could try to get a licence if they wanted.

This isn’t about Junior clubs turning Senior. It is about Juniors joining the Pyramid.

They will but then there's the knock on effects that have to be considered.

Last year's West Premiership finished on the 7th June. It would need to be finished by the first weekend of May. That's something that they're already trying to do this year to show they can fit in the Lowland League playoff.

Champions go up to the Lowland League - no longer junior, no longer participate in the Junior Scottish Cup as they will have other commitments. Could possibly still play in the West of Scotland Cup if it can be accomadated in the same way LL clubs play in the Qualifying Cup or Southern Counties Cup.

Other clubs get licenced, that means participation in the SFA Scottish Cup which would require amendments to how the Junior Scottish Cup is run to fit it all in.

You've also got to confirm how relegated teams not traditionally from the West Region will be handled.

[perthmo]

So what happens if say, Cumbernauld Colts are relegated from the LL, do they have to apply for membership of the SJFA and the WRJFA?
This is the problem with trying to keep the SJFA relevant, they have no business being involved.  Let the WRJFA control their own affairs in senior football as a league body, league's are members of the Pyramid, not Associations.

Same way as Berwick became members of the Lowland League or Whitehill became members of the East of Scotland League.

Cumbernauld apply to West Juniors and are accepted on the nod. West Juniors becomes the Pyramid League for the area. SJFA runs the Scottish Junior Cup for the West, North and any rump East.

Clear role for both West Region and SJFA. Ideally all football should be under a single umbrella but pragmatically it is better to take small steps now rather than none at all.

After all the priority is to bringJunior football into the pyramid, not to terminate it.

[TFW]

What will the situation be for those WJFA current members in such a scenario then if they apply, and are successful with their application, for a Licence for next season as well? Would they then get the same financial incentives as those from the East enjoy, and would they have to give up competitions like the Junior Cup?

[FairWeatherFan]

4 minutes ago, perthmo said:

 

Same way as Berwick became members of the Lowland League or Whitehill became members of the East of Scotland League.

Cumbernauld apply to West Juniors and are accepted on the nod. West Juniors becomes the Pyramid League for the area. SJFA runs the Scottish Junior Cup for the West, North and any rump East.

Clear role for both West Region and SJFA. Ideally all football should be under a single umbrella but pragmatically it is better to take small steps now rather than none at all.

After all the priority is to bringJunior football into the pyramid, not to terminate it.

Berwick and Whitehill didn't have to apply for anything. Berwick and East Stirlingshire were guaranteed their spots in the Lowland League by the rules of the SPFL pyramid playoff. Whitehill were assured a spot in the EoS Premier Division by the Lowland League pyramid playoff rules that every Lowland League club is assigned a designated league to be relegated to EoS or SoS. These is by agreement of the 3 leagues.

It would be written in to the rules in the same way for the West Region where they would have to accept clubs.

[FairWeatherFan]

9 minutes ago, TFW said:

What will the situation be for those WJFA current members in such a scenario then if they apply, and are successful with their application, for a Licence for next season as well? Would they then get the same financial incentives as those from the East enjoy, and would they have to give up competitions like the Junior Cup?

The prize money is the prize money doesn't matter what league you're in. SFA membership payouts are tied to the level of licence not league. If you're talking about grants and the like they're supposedly being cut to lower levels to what they've been historically for everyone.

The Junior Cup will remain as long as the SJFA are around. It's just going to have to change a little due to more clubs getting licenced and playing in the SFA Scottish Cup. This year Girvan had 2 weekends taken up by the Scottish Cup, Auchinleck Talbot had 6. That's just two clubs in the West Region. Imagine there was a dozen or more across the divisions.

So things like Junior Cup replays, two legged semi finals would probably have to be looked at to help it fit into the calendar.