Junior football, what is the future?

[patriot1]

If the Tayside clubs don't want to join the north then the ERSJFA won't agree to it next week.

Ideally they should move the boundary line and amalgamate the EOS and juniors. If the Lothian teams have three trips a year to Tayside and vice versa so be it.

But how much pressure will TJ be putting on the East region before next week?

[The Mantis]

1 hour ago, superbigal said:

EOS website says different ?

Can't help you there mate. He left the club last June and gave notice long before that.

[AlanCamelonfan]

2 minutes ago, patriot1 said:

If the Tayside clubs don't want to join the north then the ERSJFA won't agree to it next week.

Ideally they should move the boundary line and amalgamate the EOS and juniors. If the Lothian teams have three trips a year to Tayside and vice versa so be it.

But how much pressure will TJ be putting on the East region before next week?

The Easiest soulution is the 17 south of the Tay clubs join at tier 7 in the conferences next season in EOSFL. LEave ERSJFA to run Tayside 19 clubs then work out if they playoff with North Juniors for the Highland league

[bluebell1]

9 minutes ago, AlanCamelonfan said:

What do you think will happen? What is the Ersjfa going to ask for ? what are the EOSFl going to ask for?

 

Should be simple they run Tayside and the 17 South of Tay clubs join EOSFL at tier 7.  ERsjfa Tayside go into talks about being tier 6 with the north?

That’s a very closed view prior to any discussion glad you won’t be at the table lol.

 For me we will only get anywhere if we forget about eosl and ersjfa and look at what’s the best scenario for non league football in the east of Scotland.

An all encompassing pyramid including tayside teams should be the goal.  How we run it and how we get there should be the discussion. 

 

[LongTimeLurker]

24 minutes ago, AlanCamelonfan said:

id think newburgh would be in not sure bo'ness reserves would be allowed unless they change their name to something else

It's not fully clear whether BUJFC actually are a reserve team.

[AlanCamelonfan]

Just now, bluebell1 said:

That’s a very closed view prior to any discussion glad you won’t be at the table lol.

 For me we will only get anywhere if we forget about eosl and ersjfa and look at what’s the best scenario for non league football in the east of Scotland.

An all encompassing pyramid including tayside teams should be the goal.  How we run it and how we get there should be the discussion. 

 

But thats not in the gift of either of the two parties unless they move the boundary line. Which would be ridiculous

[The Mantis]

2 hours ago, FairWeatherFan said:

Civil Service Strollers.

And a LL2 unpicks all the mess around 4 feeders for one promotion spot that the SJFA & SOS are happy to indulge as it keeps them largely intact.

 

Who first raised the idea of LL2? It wasn't the Strollers, it was the club currently in 2nd place.

[superbigal]

4 minutes ago, AlanCamelonfan said:

The Easiest soulution is the 17 south of the Tay clubs join at tier 7 in the conferences next season in EOSFL. LEave ERSJFA to run Tayside 19 clubs then work out if they playoff with North Juniors for the Highland league

Alan I can assure you this would be the ERSJFAs Red Line.   Tayside clubs will not go North Fact.

Easy has nothing to do with it.   If the EOS did not "welcome the possibilty of accepting Tayside" then talks would last 10 seconds.

[Burnie_man]

Let’s not get ahead of game here. It’s great that the EoS has taken steps to initiate a meeting and hopefully something positive comes out of it. 

Both parties need to approach this with an open mind, no red lines (inc Tayside although that might be out of their hands), all cards on the table. They need to approach it with what is best for the game in the east of Scotland and nothing else.  If they both do that then hopefully talks can develop and we end up with an agreement to co-operate or merge for 2020/21.

If they can nail this, then it opens up the Pyramid to every current Junior club coming on board with no objections, which is good for everyone.  It might take some time though.

This will be Locheeboy’s interesting revelations from last night.

Edited March 13, 2019 by Burnie_man

[Marten]

3 minutes ago, superbigal said:

Alan I can assure you this would be the ERSJFAs Red Line.   Tayside clubs will not go North Fact.

Easy has nothing to do with it.   If the EOS did not "welcome the possibilty of accepting Tayside" then talks would last 10 seconds.

 

4 minutes ago, superbigal said:

Alan I can assure you this would be the ERSJFAs Red Line.   Tayside clubs will not go North Fact.

Easy has nothing to do with it.   If the EOS did not "welcome the possibilty of accepting Tayside" then talks would last 10 seconds.

Boundary changes are complex obviously. We all know what the SJFA / ERJFA think about the boundary issue, but we don't know what the EOS really think about it. Currently they aren't allowed to accept any applicants north of the Tay but who knows whether or not they've discussed this behind the scenes? If the EOS and ERJFA would both want to have the boundary moved, it would surely have more impact if both would come with a joint request to sort the issue out, probably then backed up by other parties as well.

[AlanCamelonfan]

9 minutes ago, superbigal said:

Alan I can assure you this would be the ERSJFAs Red Line.   Tayside clubs will not go North Fact.

Easy has nothing to do with it.   If the EOS did not "welcome the possibilty of accepting Tayside" then talks would last 10 seconds.

As I said the boundary line is out of both hands.

SOmeone should let Police Scotland know their could be a load of old guys having a serious arguement in a McDonalds somewhere

[The Mantis]

On 09/03/2019 at 20:03, The Mantis said:

Not quite. Apart from Whitehill, the next club without lights are Vale in 10th place with a couple of games in hand over most of their their rivals. FWIW, I would have no complaints if WW went down as tier 5 is a big ask for a village club surrounded by clubs such as Bonnyrigg and Penicuik. We've been rank rotten this/last season though you can argue all the reasons for this, and never been the same since the break up of the EoS winning team of 2013.

I don't really buy the protectionist argument either. Whitehill had a lot of goodwill in the old EoS and the early years of the LL, but Andrew Renwick, who just about made LL Chairman, has retired, a lot of the power has shifted to the west, and they want a more professional league for SPFL clubs to drop into. In the same way that the LL rejected Mr Waddell after his move to Edinburgh Uni, I don't think WW will gather a lot of sentiment from the more ambitious LL clubs. One example of this was the decree at the beginnning of 2018-19 that midweek games should kick off at 7.45, leaving clubs such as WW to make arrangements to groundshare at ridiculous expense.

Sad c**t that I am, I'm quoting myself from the EoS forum, because I don't believe the LL will 'protect'  WW, and I think lots of people are happy just to shout 'protectionism' in a tabloid stylee.

3 hours ago, Marshmallo said:

Completely agree re the likes of Whitehill Welfare. Several fans of those clubs are very quick to put the boot into Junior clubs for self-preservation or not looking at the bigger picture, yet when it comes to their own clubs the sole aim is to milk as much cash out of the system as they can before the ex-Juniors take over.

How does that work then marshy? What financial benefits accrue from being in the Lowland League?

Edited March 13, 2019 by The Mantis

[bluebell1]

7 minutes ago, AlanCamelonfan said:

As I said the boundary line is out of both hands.

SOmeone should let Police Scotland know their could be a load of old guys having a serious arguement in a McDonalds somewhere

The sfa board will be frustrated that the PWG have still not reached agreement on the way forward.  A joint approach from eosl and ersjfa to move boundary lines would be accepted if it then allowed progression and agreement of unified structure.  

A don’t understand why you continually want to alienate the tayside teams.  There top sides were good Valuable members of the old super league for a lot of years.

Regional at the top tier or two below the lowland league and local as you moved down the tiers at some point  all under one organisation should be the goal.  

What a top product for marketing we would have then.  

[AlanCamelonfan]

Just now, bluebell1 said:

The sfa board will be frustrated that the PWG have still not reached agreement on the way forward.  A joint approach from eosl and ersjfa to move boundary lines would be accepted if it then allowed progression and agreement of unified structure.  

A don’t understand why you continually want to alienate the tayside teams.  There top sides were good Valuable members of the old super league for a lot of years.

Regional at the top tier or two below the lowland league and local as you moved down the tiers at some point  all under one organisation should be the goal.  

What a top product for marketing we would have then.  

Apart from Lochee the rest of them weren't great. Tayport were back when but looking at now. I never liked playing those teams didn't think they should have been their. For me thats North. The current line is a fair one. The problem people forget is the juniors didn't ahve teams heading towards the borders.

We twice had to go to Carnoustie midweek for a 715pm kick off in the Juniors and once to Lochee and lochee had to come to us on a monday night once to me that is not right. You need to draw a line somewhere and where the line is now is the correct line when you have the teams heading towards the borders.  If we had Ersjfa running things they'd have coldstream going to Carnoustie on a Monday night. 2 hrs 40 mins a journey according to google maps thats surely isn't right

[AlanCamelonfan]

5 minutes ago, bluebell1 said:

The sfa board will be frustrated that the PWG have still not reached agreement on the way forward.  A joint approach from eosl and ersjfa to move boundary lines would be accepted if it then allowed progression and agreement of unified structure.  

A don’t understand why you continually want to alienate the tayside teams.  There top sides were good Valuable members of the old super league for a lot of years.

Regional at the top tier or two below the lowland league and local as you moved down the tiers at some point  all under one organisation should be the goal.  

What a top product for marketing we would have then.  

Falkirk to Carnoustie 72.5 miles 1 hr 35 mins according to google. Falkirk to Coldsteam 74.5 miles 1 hr 30 mins. Its easier road south than it is north

[Marshmallo]

2 hours ago, FairWeatherFan said:

Nope because then you're dealing with the farce of clubs jumping between leagues thinking they'd have an advantage in getting promoted.

Fixed playoffs that would see leagues with the occasional unlicensed champion give their fixed opponent a bye.

Or random playoffs where you you have the two weakest leagues face each other for a promotion spot.

My solution....

3 hours ago, Marshmallo said:

There should be a season of transition using conferences ala the East of Scotland this season, but comprised of the top two tiers in the West Juniors and the SoSL. If the SoSL refuse this they should get bolted on en masse as a regional league below the top two West Junior leagues. The aim should be to have 2 West region wide leagues at tier 6 & 7, then regional Central/Ayrshire/South leagues below that at tier 8. IMO of course.

 

[GNU_Linux]

The EOS could take the HL approach where they schedule mid-week games using teams close geographically. They also have some designated catch up weekends at the tail end of the season where the longer catch up trips can take place.

I believe thats how it works but someone more familiar with the HL feel free to correct me.

[Kilbowie Benches]

1 minute ago, GNU_Linux said:

The EOS could take the HL approach where they schedule mid-week games using teams close geographically. They also have some designated catch up weekends at the tail end of the season where the longer catch up trips can take place.

I believe thats how it works but someone more familiar with the HL feel free to correct me.

It’s all down to who does the fixtures as we now know in the West! 

[Burnie_man]

I posted up a couple of options a few months back, one with no Tayside clubs involved, one with, this is the one with;

TAYSIDE.pdf

Teams for illustrative purposes only.

Edited March 13, 2019 by Burnie_man

[superbigal]

8 minutes ago, AlanCamelonfan said:

Apart from Lochee the rest of them weren't great. Tayport were back when but looking at now. I never liked playing those teams didn't think they should have been their. For me thats North. The current line is a fair one. The problem people forget is the juniors didn't ahve teams heading towards the borders.

We twice had to go to Carnoustie midweek for a 715pm kick off in the Juniors and once to Lochee and lochee had to come to us on a monday night once to me that is not right. You need to draw a line somewhere and where the line is now is the correct line when you have the teams heading towards the borders.  If we had Ersjfa running things they'd have coldstream going to Carnoustie on a Monday night. 2 hrs 40 mins a journey according to google maps thats surely isn't right

Let go

Carnoustie apparently won the Junior cup in Super League era. Not great in your eyes.   Your park was nothing short of a joke in the Juniors. That was the reason many clubs had to visit you midweek.

Stop slinging mud (from the pitch ) at Tayside

Edited March 13, 2019 by superbigal