RabidAl Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 Hehe, caught me! I did that, but it's mostly from impressions that I've formed from years of looking at individual attendances and asking whether, say, Annan would have brought many supporters up to Arbroath or wherever - probably not, or not much more than 10% of their home support - and so arriving at whichever club's core home support by deducting that way. --- The regionalisation thing - I just look at the difference between the high attendances at the derby matches and low attendances at the matches against clubs from Timbuktu and my mouth waters. Obviously, too many derbies would kill them off for the fans in terms of interest but plenty of fans are happy to travel in good numbers fairly locally - because we are creatures of habit and would love to see a game every weekend if the distances/costs (time, money) weren't so prohibitive. Anyway, I'm clearly in a minority of one on these issues so i'll head back off to dreamland and leave youz in peace. (Also I am a hypocrite since I quit going to senior football a dozen years ago - it was too expensive and too repetitive; now just happy going to watch the local youths at the weekend, which is free, several matches to choose from, and I can leave after half an hour if I'm too cold, too bored or when my old knees are too sore from standing without feeling guilty about having wasted sixteen quid!) Cheers. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1320Lichtie Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 Hehe, caught me! I did that, but it's mostly from impressions that I've formed from years of looking at individual attendances and asking whether, say, Annan would have brought many supporters up to Arbroath or wherever - probably not, or not much more than 10% of their home support - and so arriving at whichever club's core home support by deducting that way. --- The regionalisation thing - I just look at the difference between the high attendances at the derby matches and low attendances at the matches against clubs from Timbuktu and my mouth waters. Obviously, too many derbies would kill them off for the fans in terms of interest but plenty of fans are happy to travel in good numbers fairly locally - because we are creatures of habit and would love to see a game every weekend if the distances/costs (time, money) weren't so prohibitive. Anyway, I'm clearly in a minority of one on these issues so i'll head back off to dreamland and leave youz in peace. (Also I am a hypocrite since I quit going to senior football a dozen years ago - it was too expensive and too repetitive; now just happy going to watch the local youths at the weekend, which is free, several matches to choose from, and I can leave after half an hour if I'm too cold, too bored or when my old knees are too sore from standing without feeling guilty about having wasted sixteen quid!) Cheers. The derbies would certainly lose their appeal if they were to be held every single season though. One of the main bonuses about us getting relegated to the 4th tier is usually that we will have that Montrose away game back on the calendar. Personally my favourite away days in the last few seasons have been Annan and Ayr, if they were to be removed from the calendar I would be gutted. Infact one of the reasons I support Arbroath is because we compete on a national stage. I’ve said elsewhere too that we have players from Aberdeen to Saltcoats and everywhere inbetween, we train in Perth. The regionalisation thing would just make it much harder for clubs further away from the central belt to attract players. That’s why if Montrose did end up relegated a few seasons back and ended up in the highland league it could’ve been disastrous for them. They can sign players who are willing to travel up to Montrose every 2 weeks for a game but getting them to Montrose and north of Montrose all over the highlands every single week would be a no goer. Infact a Montrose player I know of was getting offered unreal money (in the context) by a highland league club a few seasons ago but he was based in Dundee and just couldn’t commit to it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergeant Wilson Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 35 minutes ago, RabidAl said: Anyway, I'm clearly in a minority of one on these issues so i'll head back off to dreamland and leave youz in peace. I think that's best for everyone. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Che Dail Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 1 hour ago, RabidAl said: Anyway, I'm clearly in a minority of one on these issues Cheers. Different approach to FT football taken by Edusport, funded by the players themselves! Also Selkirk had a tie-in at one point through Borders College and the modern apprentice scheme... not sure how successful it was though 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergeant Wilson Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 2 minutes ago, Che Dail said: Different approach to FT football taken by Edusport, funded by the players themselves! Also Selkirk had a tie-in at one point through Borders College and the modern apprentice scheme... not sure how successful it was though Are you both trying to out do each other with daft examples? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross. Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 @RabidAl Re the "Full time with youths" model: I was under the impression that most of the young players who are sent out on loan by the full time teams still train full time, they simply split it between the two clubs depending on when the teams are playing and all that malarkey. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Che Dail Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 42 minutes ago, Sergeant Wilson said: Are you both trying to out do each other with daft examples? Ha! "Edusport Academy eyes Premiership place by 2025 under web-based fan membership" On the BBC website today... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1320Lichtie Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 [mention=45814]RabidAl[/mention] Re the "Full time with youths" model: I was under the impression that most of the young players who are sent out on loan by the full time teams still train full time, they simply split it between the two clubs depending on when the teams are playing and all that malarkey. Scott Martin will train with Hibs all week and with ourselves one of either Monday or Wednesday night I’m sure. Definitely the case with all these loans. Clydes 2 loanees from Huddersfield are supposedly only in Scotland Thursday night to Saturday night before going back down the road. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclizine Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 [mention=45814]RabidAl[/mention] Re the "Full time with youths" model: I was under the impression that most of the young players who are sent out on loan by the full time teams still train full time, they simply split it between the two clubs depending on when the teams are playing and all that malarkey. Development loan players can play for their U20s and loan club as well 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parsforlife Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 The regionalisation thing - I just look at the difference between the high attendances at the derby matches and low attendances at the matches against clubs from Timbuktu and my mouth waters. Derby games are massive outliers for most clubs. A far fairer assessment would be comparing the difference in crowds with the same team at home against long distance opponents and other run of the mill games against teams they would share a region with. With 5 minutes of lazy research we could take Clyde as an example. Home last 2 weeks against Peterhead and Edinburgh city. Vs Peterhead 449 Vs Edinburgh city 421 I'm actually slightly the city game is lower given its importance but I guess it's too early attract fans based on games being decisive. What is clear is the difference is minimal 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclizine Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 Derby games are massive outliers for most clubs. A far fairer assessment would be comparing the difference in crowds with the same team at home against long distance opponents and other run of the mill games against teams they would share a region with. With 5 minutes of lazy research we could take Clyde as an example. Home last 2 weeks against Peterhead and Edinburgh city. Vs Peterhead 449 Vs Edinburgh city 421 I'm actually slightly the city game is lower given its importance but I guess it's too early attract fans based on games being decisive. What is clear is the difference is minimal I think when you're taking about this level, it's the regular home support that's important, away support is so variable and distance is only one of a load of factors influencing this. Regionalising at the third or fourth tier just isn't palatable for current clubs, there's no evidence regional leagues significantly reduce travel given the geography of Scotland. If clubs thought it would be beneficial, they'd be doing it already! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo'ness Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 3 hours ago, Che Dail said: Ha! "Edusport Academy eyes Premiership place by 2025 under web-based fan membership" On the BBC website today... Had to check there it wasn't April 1st. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergeant Wilson Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 3 hours ago, Che Dail said: Ha! "Edusport Academy eyes Premiership place by 2025 under web-based fan membership" On the BBC website today... http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/42958694 That went swimmingly for Ebbsfleet. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hillonearth Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 3 minutes ago, Sergeant Wilson said: http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/42958694 That went swimmingly for Ebbsfleet. Newmains United tried it about seven or eight years ago. Ditto. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergeant Wilson Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 1 minute ago, Hillonearth said: Newmains United tried it about seven or eight years ago. Ditto. Some people get to an age and having been relatively successful, think they can do no wrong. Somehow they think they'll succeed where others failed and that normal rules and market forces don't apply to them. Unfortunately, they often gravitate towards football, hence we get shite like this. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo'ness Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 5 hours ago, Che Dail said: Ha! "Edusport Academy eyes Premiership place by 2025 under web-based fan membership" On the BBC website today... Loved the quote from Chris Ewing... "We have no history, we have no fan base and we have carte blanche to create a brand new football club that meets the needs of the supporters." If they have no fan base how is it meeting needs of supporters? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archieb Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 18 minutes ago, Jambo'ness said: Loved the quote from Chris Ewing... "We have no history, we have no fan base and we have carte blanche to create a brand new football club that meets the needs of the supporters." If they have no fan base how is it meeting needs of supporters? Even more bonkers than Brexit! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goalie Hamish Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 28 minutes ago, Jambo'ness said: Loved the quote from Chris Ewing... "We have no history, we have no fan base and we have carte blanche to create a brand new football club that meets the needs of the supporters." If they have no fan base how is it meeting needs of supporters? Well they'd need a ground to start with, and a base to call home, then they'd need fans. The whole thing is an utter farce and best ignored. They've had their publicity today and they'll sink back to being a poor Lowland League side. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Che Dail Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 34 minutes ago, Goalie Hamish said: Well they'd need a ground to start with, and a base to call home, then they'd need fans. The whole thing is an utter farce and best ignored. They've had their publicity today and they'll sink back to being a poor Lowland League side. I like that its new and different and somebody is trying to build something from the ground up rather than what we're used to seeing which is a generous sprinkling of money from the top down. Seems to be plenty demand from students abroad wanting to pay to come here for more than just football. From the number of students and the fees being charged it must be close to a £1m business aside from the fan ownership venture. It reminds me of the Camp America / Bunac projects, and US football scholarships. I'm sure Davie Weir embarked on that before returning home to play for Falkirk then Hearts. It'll be interesting to see how they progress and if they can get a home base in the central belt. Colin Cameron is good, credible. I say good luck to them... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo'ness Posted February 8, 2018 Share Posted February 8, 2018 9 hours ago, Che Dail said: I like that its new and different and somebody is trying to build something from the ground up rather than what we're used to seeing which is a generous sprinkling of money from the top down. Seems to be plenty demand from students abroad wanting to pay to come here for more than just football. From the number of students and the fees being charged it must be close to a £1m business aside from the fan ownership venture. It reminds me of the Camp America / Bunac projects, and US football scholarships. I'm sure Davie Weir embarked on that before returning home to play for Falkirk then Hearts. It'll be interesting to see how they progress and if they can get a home base in the central belt. Colin Cameron is good, credible. I say good luck to them... Yes, good luck to them but a fanciful notion of reaching the Premiership. I'm sure my own club, with its history and fan base has no such delusions. I well remember the Ebbsfleet experience and it is not profitable. Most people joined up out of curiosity, myself included, just to see how it would work but soon lost interest when it became clear I was better off playing Football Manager! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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