The St. Mirren FC 2023/24 thread

[djchapsticks]

I'd be happy with Obika signing a years extension as well, only a year at a time though given he's now in his 30s. Brophy as far as I can recall, is very much more of the 'busy' type of forward compared to what we currently have and in certain circumstances, would work well alongside Obika.

[ulysses]

Gavin Reilly rumoured to be heading back to Scotland. 

[djchapsticks]

Doyle-Hayes' contract offer is also 3 years.

That would be an amazing outcome. I dunno why but I just expected us to put an extra year in front of him.

[Coventry Saint]

7 minutes ago, Ric said:

Oh, yeah, you just do that, you recycle the same point I made earlier in the thread.

Clearly that's how you managed to earn best St Mirren poster award!

  Reveal hidden contents

 

btw, I'm on record as wanting Obika to sign an extension. I believe he brings more to the team than Erwin does.

 

 Sorry mate, I missed that. Apologies.

5 minutes ago, djchapsticks said:

I'd be happy with Obika signing a years extension as well, only a year at a time though given he's now in his 30s. Brophy as far as I can recall, is very much more of the 'busy' type of forward compared to what we currently have and in certain circumstances, would work well alongside Obika.

I know this much: a club that plays with one up front doesn't need four out-and-out strikers, plus Morias. Ah well, we're investing in the squad and planning ahead. I'm not complaining.

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, djchapsticks said:

Doyle-Hayes' contract offer is also 3 years.

That would be an amazing outcome. I dunno why but I just expected us to put an extra year in front of him.

If he signs that would be outstanding business as he is a class apart in that midfield. 

[Ric]

2 minutes ago, djchapsticks said:

That would be an amazing outcome.

it absolutely would.

Now to be fair, while we aren't exactly a blue ribbon club, but he's almost guaranteed game time and with the pandemic a contract in the hand is worth more than.. er, two in the bush?

[Munoz]

https://www.sportsmole.co.uk/football/celtic/news/former-st-mirren-chairman-blasts-celtic-jolly-in-dubai_429199.html

[houston_bud]

I hope we are offering Obika another deal. He's by far our best striker. His hold up and link up play are miles better than anyone else we've got. 

Brophy and Obika could work well together. What I like about Brophy is that he actually hits a shot when he can. Too many of our players look afraid to shoot. 

[djchapsticks]

9 minutes ago, Ric said:

it absolutely would.

Now to be fair, while we aren't exactly a blue ribbon club, but he's almost guaranteed game time and with the pandemic a contract in the hand is worth more than.. er, two in the bush?

Well here's the thing, it does look like a lot falls in our favour.

He's apparently settled up here and is the first name on the team sheet. He also has a decent Irish contingent of around the same age about him and they appear to be pretty happy in the circumstances.

He's 21 and playing regular football every week - this will continue for as long as he wants to stay here.

He could definitely walk into any team down south in league 2 and most in league 1 but on a like-for-like basis now, most clubs at that level can't outgun the SPFL with money offered due to wage caps. On the levelled playing field in terms of wages that we now find ourselves in, the top flight of Scottish football blows level 3 and 4 of England out the water in terms of size of shop window for a player to put themselves in. There will be a lot more very good players from that level making their way north in the next few years. 

He could feasibly get a gig in the English Championship where the wage cap doesn't exist but he's almost certainly not just at the level yet to be playing week-in week-out, so it's maybe unlikely.

That really leaves his only realistic option as another Scottish club for the moment and the league isn't exactly awash with money.

A 3 year deal is perfect - it gives him opportunity to bed down here and settle with plenty of game time and also gives a suitable shop window for both him and for us to get a good deal at the end of the pandemic.

 

[Coventry Saint]

4 minutes ago, djchapsticks said:

A 3 year deal is perfect - it gives him opportunity to bed down here and settle with plenty of game time and also gives a suitable shop window for both him and for us to get a good deal at the end of the pandemic.

Yeah, let's be real: a long deal protects him, but the sort of fees we tend to command wouldn't prohibit him from getting the upper-end move he's said he is after. I don't see how anyone loses, tbh.

[RandomGuy.]

6 minutes ago, Coventry Saint said:

Yeah, let's be real: a long deal protects him, but the sort of fees we tend to command wouldn't prohibit him from getting the upper-end move he's said he is after. I don't see how anyone loses, tbh.

He also apparently got fucked about a lot last Summer too.

Better to be looking for a new job while you've got one, type scenario. He spent months last Summer without a wage.

Edited January 5, 2021 by RandomGuy.

[djchapsticks]

Interesting bit of reading - someone has mentioned over on BAWA how Brophy's goal return doesn't strike much confidence and although I'm factoring in @craigkillie mentioning how about 10 of his goals were penalties - he still averages a goal every 208 minutes in a Kilmarnock shirt.

Some other Saints forwards by comparison (all competitions and only seasons when we were in top flight):

Jon Obika - Goal every 268 minutes

Steven Thompson - Goal every 240 minutes

Michael Higdon - Goal every 283 minutes

Danny Mullen - Goal every 277 minutes

 

[irvine_buddie]

5 hours ago, djchapsticks said:

Much fairer to go with his record at his current club. 28 goals in around 70 league starts and 35 sub appearances for Killie. 

Brophy scored 9 in the league last season (short season), 11 and 7 the seasons before. St Mirren's top scorers in the premiership in the last 10 years have been Obika with 8 last season and to get better than that you need to go back to Steven Thompson who scored 13 for 3 seasons in a row and Higdon who got 14 in 2010/11.

So to sign a player with a proven record in your league better than anyone you've had for 6 or 7 years is a good signing, especially since he's still only 24. Erwin and Dennis haven't showed anything to suggest they are good enough to be the 2nd choice striker so delighted we've brought in a proven goalscorer.

[djchapsticks]

4 minutes ago, irvine_buddie said:

Brophy scored 9 in the league last season (short season), 11 and 7 the seasons before. St Mirren's top scorers in the premiership in the last 10 years have been Obika with 8 last season and to get better than that you need to go back to Steven Thompson who scored 13 for 3 seasons in a row and Higdon who got 14 in 2010/11.

So to sign a player with a proven record in your league better than anyone you've had for 6 or 7 years is a good signing, especially since he's still only 24. Erwin and Dennis haven't showed anything to suggest they are good enough to be the 2nd choice striker so delighted we've brought in a proven goalscorer.

And he has a better minutes to goals ratio than any of those players.

[craigkillie]

Went to the effort of checking - 9 penalties in amongst his 27 league goals for us. Only 8 non-penalty goals in his last 54 league games for us though, which probably partially explains why he's out the team this season and why we aren't really pushing the boat out to keep him.

[Coventry Saint]

19 minutes ago, craigkillie said:

partially explains why he's out the team this season 

Can you expand on that at all? Like, what the other reasons might be? That remains my only nagging doubt is that, given it's fair to say we're operating on about the same level this season, why he hasn't been an automatic starter and why he's not scored many when he has played.

[Spam_Valley]

2 hours ago, ZingaliMan said:

No harm to any of our strikers but Goodwin did say if they did not start scoring then they would be replaced.  So I expect more than one striker to be shown the door come the end of the season. 

Yeah. Realistically all of them should leave and we start again. Brophy is a good start, hopefully a couple other 'better than what we had' this season strikers to come in this summer.

Edited January 5, 2021 by Spam_Valley

[DukDukGoose]

30 minutes ago, craigkillie said:

Went to the effort of checking - 9 penalties in amongst his 27 league goals for us. Only 8 non-penalty goals in his last 54 league games for us though, which probably partially explains why he's out the team this season and why we aren't really pushing the boat out to keep him.

Scored a couple of free kicks too hasn't he? Definitely remember two against us although one may have been in the cup.

[Shuggie_Murray7]

If Obika was to leave, it's not like he's irreplacable. I like him as much as the next guy, but he's hardly prolific. He's scored some important goals, but if he could shoot properly and get at least a few inches off the ground to win a header he'd be a 15-20 goal a season striker. As it stands at present he's an 8-12 goal a season striker. I'd like to keep him, wouldn't be overly gutted if we let him go.

Edited January 5, 2021 by Shuggie_Murray7

[craigkillie]

52 minutes ago, Coventry Saint said:

Can you expand on that at all? Like, what the other reasons might be? That remains my only nagging doubt is that, given it's fair to say we're operating on about the same level this season, why he hasn't been an automatic starter and why he's not scored many when he has played.

He's had a few injuries too. He's been a wee bit injury-prone since he joined us - mainly hamstring I think - nothing terrible, just that he'll miss the odd week or two here and there and can struggle to put a run of games together as a result.

His most prolific spell at the club was in the first half of 2018/19, when he was playing alongside Greg Stewart, who was literally unplayable for that six month period we had him. After Stewart left, the goals dried up for Brophy big time, and I think he only scored penalties for the remainder of the season.

Then at the start of 2019/20 he was literally our only striker, and even when we did sign other ones it was the clown car duo of Osman Sow and Simeon Jackson, so he ended up run into the ground a wee bit in that period and it's probably not surprising he didn't score many. When Kabamba arrived in January and we eventually went to a 4-4-2 it seemed to suit them both, so we had fairly high hopes for that pairing this year.

However, he had another wee knock which meant he missed a chunk of pre-season and ended up on the bench on the opening day against Hibs. We then played Celtic at home in a 4-5-1 with Kabamba up front and played really well, which meant Dyer stuck with that system for a while and Brophy was on the bench. We went 4-4-2 against Dundee United and probably had our best performance of the season, with him and Kabamba getting three goals between them (one for Brophy), but then were fairly poor up in Aberdeen in the same system. We stuck with it for the Hamilton game and he got himself sent off for a daft tackle, and after he was back we then had a couple of games in a row where we got first half red cards and had to either take him off or shove Kabamba out wide, thus not having the pairing together again.

I've never fully made my mind up on him as a player. He has loads of really good traits - when he's up for it he's an absolute pest for defenders, his link up is generally fine, and he generally gets a lot of power and accuracy in his shots. However, his decision making is poor, he takes far too many shots in positions where he's never going to score, and he struggles against any sort of intelligent defenders. He's also very much a confidence player, as his recent form shows. He definitely has something to offer at this level, but I don't think he was ever an international standard player, and I think the main reason he got a chance was that Clarke wanted players who understood how he played the game.

I was adamant that we should have sold him in the summer of 2019 when his stock was at its highest (I may even have posted so on here), because I always felt like this sort of regression to the mean was a possibility. It's one of a number of really poor business decisions that the club have made over the last couple of years.