flyingscot Posted May 23, 2018 Share Posted May 23, 2018 2 minutes ago, Poet of the Macabre said: Why is Jack Ross so desperate to leave St Mirren? 1. He's ambitious. 2. His stock won't get any higher. Manager of the year, takes club marooned and L1 bound to Premiership as champions. If he has an average season and we finish 9th, then will clubs think of him as highly? Once on the English merry-go-round you can usually get another job or at worse come back here. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ludo*1 Posted May 23, 2018 Share Posted May 23, 2018 Didn't Gordon Ross pull this stunt with us as well? Accusing Nelms of tapping Ross up. Purely to save face IMO. He's powerless. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacksgranda Posted May 23, 2018 Share Posted May 23, 2018 17 minutes ago, Buddist Monk said: Some interesting quotes: Sky Sports... Reveal hidden contents Sunderland are paying St Mirren £50,000 in compensation for their manager, and are believed to have offered Ross five times what he is being paid in Scotland. Gordon Scott... Reveal hidden contents "been no contact from Sunderland". "Jack is on holiday. So unless there is some major skullduggery going on then it's nonsense." "To hold talks with Jack, we would have to grant permission, but we've had no contact from Sunderland at all." This should be fun. 50K is laughable you would looking at least 4 or 5 times that value and as he's under contract to us that is entirely reasonable, so I'm guessing Sky have probably asked Sunderland how much they are going to pay when they finally get round to asking us and they threw out a derisory figure. Of course, there could be something in Ross' contract that allows for him to move for nominal compensation if "a bigger club" comes in. Even if that is the case could you argue that a club languishing 3 levels below their top division be considered "a bigger club" than on that is in the top division in another country. While we all know the sensible answer is "yes, it's fucking Sunderland of course it's bigger", legally though that is a tough one to get past a judge. When I read the headline on the BBC football site (Ross to be announced as Sunderland manager), I thought "Is he mad?". What has changed at Sunderland to entice in a half sensible/decent manager? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buddist Monk Posted May 23, 2018 Share Posted May 23, 2018 1 minute ago, Ludo*1 said: Didn't Gordon Ross pull this stunt with us as well? Accusing Nelms of tapping Ross up. Purely to save face IMO. He's powerless. Publicly announcing it then flying to the location another club's manager is on holiday somewhat takes the shine off your suggestion it was only an "accusation". It's quite clear that was what Nelms was up to. Ross staying put only demonstrated Dundee are not an attractive club to go to, that's why you had to go begging to the manager who blew you off. You are right about the limited power we have, but that's the same for all clubs and the same for players as well as managers. All we can do is keep to the rules, hammer them for compensation and if it's not enough report them for tapping up. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buddist Monk Posted May 23, 2018 Share Posted May 23, 2018 9 minutes ago, Poet of the Macabre said: Why is Jack Ross so desperate to leave St Mirren? Once you've seen off Dunfermline, what more is there to achieve in Scotland? 1 minute ago, Jacksgranda said: When I read the headline on the BBC football site (Ross to be announced as Sunderland manager), I thought "Is he mad?". What has changed at Sunderland to entice in a half sensible/decent manager? It's not the same Sunderland that McInnes was touted for. Change of ownership, removal of debt. Is it still a basket case? Yes, but it's less than it was and the path is there to turn it around. As I said earlier, whether he's timed it right we will know in about 6 months time. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyingscot Posted May 23, 2018 Share Posted May 23, 2018 1 minute ago, Jacksgranda said: When I read the headline on the BBC football site (Ross to be announced as Sunderland manager), I thought "Is he mad?". What has changed at Sunderland to entice in a half sensible/decent manager? New owners and now in L1. Worth a gamble, if you can use some of the Premiership cash to get them half stabilised and back up, you'll have done well. Of course end up like Leeds, Bradford and Sheffield spending ages in there trapped then.... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacksgranda Posted May 23, 2018 Share Posted May 23, 2018 2 minutes ago, Buddist Monk said: Once you've seen off Dunfermline, what more is there to achieve in Scotland? It's not the same Sunderland that McInnes was touted for. Change of ownership, removal of debt. Is it still a basket case? Yes, but it's less than it was and the path is there to turn it around. As I said earlier, whether he's timed it right we will know in about 6 months time. 1 minute ago, flyingscot said: New owners and now in L1. Worth a gamble, if you can use some of the Premiership cash to get them half stabilised and back up, you'll have done well. Of course end up like Leeds, Bradford and Sheffield spending ages in there trapped then.... Thanks. Still think it's a bit of a gamble. Sunderland wouldn't have been my first choice. (Although I doubt they would have been asking me...) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buddist Monk Posted May 23, 2018 Share Posted May 23, 2018 Just now, Jacksgranda said: Thanks. Still think it's a bit of a gamble. Yeah, I mean we could throw out the "every managerial job is a gamble" shenanigans, but there is going to be a sweet spot where Sunderland have plateaued and are ripe for a decent manager to push them back to the big time. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacksgranda Posted May 23, 2018 Share Posted May 23, 2018 1 minute ago, Buddist Monk said: Yeah, I mean we could throw out the "every managerial job is a gamble" shenanigans, but there is going to be a sweet spot where Sunderland have plateaued and are ripe for a decent manager to push them back to the big time. "bottomed out", more like! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coventry Saint Posted May 23, 2018 Share Posted May 23, 2018 7 minutes ago, kanyewestbank said: "Agreeing to our terms" being shorthand for just take him for next to f**k all in compensation. Yep. Reports are that he will be on £350k pa at the Mackems, and that is a five-fold increase on his current wage. I think we can therefore deduce that the buyout clause was equivalent to one year's salary. Look at it a different way: this means everything Jack has done for us over the past year has been done for free. Gutted, but we move on. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skyline Drifter Posted May 23, 2018 Share Posted May 23, 2018 37 minutes ago, Buddist Monk said: Hide contents Sunderland are paying St Mirren £50,000 in compensation for their manager, and are believed to have offered Ross five times what he is being paid in Scotland. Gordon Scott... Hide contents "been no contact from Sunderland". "Jack is on holiday. So unless there is some major skullduggery going on then it's nonsense." "To hold talks with Jack, we would have to grant permission, but we've had no contact from Sunderland at all." This should be fun. 50K is laughable you would looking at least 4 or 5 times that value and as he's under contract to us that is entirely reasonable, so I'm guessing Sky have probably asked Sunderland how much they are going to pay when they finally get round to asking us and they threw out a derisory figure. Of course, there could be something in Ross' contract that allows for him to move for nominal compensation if "a bigger club" comes in. Even if that is the case could you argue that a club languishing 3 levels below their top division be considered "a bigger club" than on that is in the top division in another country. While we all know the sensible answer is "yes, it's fucking Sunderland of course it's bigger", legally though that is a tough one to get past a judge. I'd be very surprised if he doesn't have a buyout clause in his contract and it's not going to be for £200k+ in a month of Sundays. Whatever it is it will be peanuts to Sunderland. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poet of the Macabre Posted May 23, 2018 Share Posted May 23, 2018 2 minutes ago, Coventry Saint said: Yep. Reports are that he will be on £350k pa at the Mackems, and that is a five-fold increase on his current wage. I think we can therefore deduce that the buyout clause was equivalent to one year's salary. Look at it a different way: this means everything Jack has done for us over the past year has been done for free. Gutted, but we move on. Looking forward to seeing John Hughes getting the gig due to his "top flight experience". 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shull Posted May 23, 2018 Share Posted May 23, 2018 Ross should have stayed for another Season. -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandomGuy. Posted May 23, 2018 Share Posted May 23, 2018 Assume the new chairman there is legit can't see Ross risking his reputation if he wasn't convinced. Could go either way really, but English football is utterly cut throat and he likely won't get two transfer windows to sort them out. Chairman's comments reek of someone who's desperate to seem like a "hard done by" person, and that statement combined with the "improved contract" talk yesterday tie in nicely to him knowing Ross is gone and making absolutely nothing moves to save face. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buddist Monk Posted May 23, 2018 Share Posted May 23, 2018 Just now, Skyline Drifter said: Whatever it is it will be peanuts to Sunderland. Let's get this one out of the way first, you are totally right it will be which is all the reason to squeeze them for as much as possible. As you say, peanuts to them. Just now, Skyline Drifter said: I'd be very surprised if he doesn't have a buyout clause in his contract and it's not going to be for £200k+ in a month of Sundays. I'd be surprised if there is, as his contract wasn't updated after the Barnsley incident so his contract would have been from the start of this season. It's very unlikely either he or the club would be looking at the buyout clauses from a manager who finished 8th in a 10 team league. As for the £200k, anyone could easily make a case for that as he's been crowned manager of the year ahead of such notables as Rodgers and/or Clarke. Now you and I both know the context to that, but ultimately if it got so far as to be arguing over the money the MotY will heavily weight any CAS compensation (if they took it that far). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coventry Saint Posted May 23, 2018 Share Posted May 23, 2018 3 minutes ago, Poet of the Macabre said: Looking forward to seeing John Hughes getting the gig due to his "top flight experience". You mean 'owing to' in that context. 'Due to' means 'caused by'. Hope this helps. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddie06smfc Posted May 23, 2018 Share Posted May 23, 2018 Wonderful move for Jack Ross, I wish him all the very best. Sunderland are a huge club in that piss poor league. He’ll be a major success there no doubt. He’s left us as an attractive proposition for any new manager. When he took over we were far from that. Perhaps the aforementioned Gordon Ross might be worth a shout, whoever he is. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buddist Monk Posted May 23, 2018 Share Posted May 23, 2018 2 minutes ago, buddie06smfc said: Wonderful move for Jack Ross, I wish him all the very best. Sunderland are a huge club in that piss poor league. He’ll be a major success there no doubt. He’s left us as an attractive proposition for any new manager. When he took over we were far from that. This. Ok, it's not great to lose him but 18 months ago we were an absolute mess. We most certainly aren't now. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demented Zebra Posted May 23, 2018 Share Posted May 23, 2018 Love Jack Ross this move will be life changing for him and his family. He is a man who could help our club out in the future by loan players , friendly's if successful. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buddist Monk Posted May 23, 2018 Share Posted May 23, 2018 Oh, one other fun thing in all this - the new owners sacked the Bain, the ex Rangers Chief. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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