The St. Mirren FC 2023/24 thread

[Guest]

Main looks a different player, fair play to him. Unrecognisable yesterday, and unlucky not to have scored more. What a finish for his goal, too.

[Ric]

On 04/05/2022 at 09:14, Mr. Smith said:

But talk of microaggressions and 'white privilege', etc, is simply nonsense, IMHO. However, this is the wrong thread. Go to the politics forum if you want to discuss that stuff, please.

Right, so you are an apologist for racists, you have publicly admitted it.

Your claim that somehow there is no evidence to support my claims, despite endless research papers to show the opposite coupled with endless anecdotal evidence, demonstrates the very thing you are railing against. You have demonstrated exactly what white privilege is, while having the arrogance to publicly claim that because you don't understand a situation it doesn't exist. White privilege is dismissing racial aggression because YOU do not experience it on a personal level. I have, and it is a fucking demoralising thing to watch those you love or care about be treated differently *every* *single* *fucking* *day*, and considerably more damaging to them.

In short you are a c**t,  I will not converse with you on this site again.

Edited May 9, 2022 by Ric

[Ric]

Right, onto other things, not stupid wee laddies somehow showing their fucking ignorance of society.

 

Main, he played well, nobody can deny that. However my opinion of his performance probably differs with most others, he still needs to be got shot of. Robinson won't do that because he obviously has a stiffy for him, but the bottom line is this is a man who spent almost all the season putting in terrible, just abject terrible, performances than all of a sudden he puts in a good performance, scoring his first (first!) goal of the season in the 35th game of the season, many many weeks too late. He should be shown the door and replaced with someone who actually can show a level of first team consistency for the whole season and not just when the whim takes them.

In short, Main's good performance on Saturday rather than raising my, already low, opinion of him, it has actually lowered it knowing he could have, at any time, put in that level of effort, but simply chose not to.

[Buddiesaint]

1 hour ago, Ric said:

In short, Main's good performance on Saturday rather than raising my, already low, opinion of him, it has actually lowered it knowing he could have, at any time, put in that level of effort, but simply chose not to.

That's a huge stretch to claim his poor performances this season were because he chose not to play as well as he could.

There's loads of factors to take into account.  Morale and self belief, coaching styles,  injuries, the pressure and reaction from fans,  the performances of the players around him too. Maybe he's even been told straight, your place at St mirren is on the line. 

I'm not saying he's a changed man and will be banging in goals every week, but clearly the return of the guy who saw him have his best spell in his career has helped him conquer some of those demons. For a couple games at least. 

Whether that's enough to justify him staying at the club is entirely up for debate. Itd be taking a risk on someone who has proven they can struggle here.

If there's players out there that are within reach of our club who are better,  or could be better but are also risks, then I'd chose them over Main.  

[pozbaird]

Only a St Mirren fan* could see good performances from a St Mirren player in back-to-back games, which resulted in back-to-back wins which secure top flight status, and say it has actually lowered their opinion on that player.

 

 

 

 

 

 

* Falkirk fans too. Another bunch of torn-faced gits.

[Coventry Saint]

Assuming we go with four strikers in the squad, I think you can find room for the Main we saw on Saturday. He's clearly a confidence player and he was very good. 

Recruitment will depend heavily on how Robbo wants to shape us up. We need more wide players if he's going for a 4-3-3, though Greive could be one of those.

Either way, we'll certainly be bringing in at least one striker and one winger/wide forward, but it's safe to say Main will be in the picture too.

I think our shopping list will look like this:

Striker; 

Winger/WF with pace, please;

One further midfielder (assuming O'Hara and Baccus stories are true - that would leave us perming three from Kiltie, Baccus, O'Hara, Reid + new person);

Possibly a right back if Robinson decides he doesn't want Fraser as first choice;

GK - assuming it's Carson.

Maybe a surprise additional attacking mid to give Kiltie competition.

[Ric]

47 minutes ago, pozbaird said:

Only a St Mirren fan* could see good performances from a St Mirren player in back-to-back games, which resulted in back-to-back wins which secure top flight status, and say it has actually lowered their opinion on that player.

Or... perhaps only a St Mirren fan could somehow hold onto the hope about a player who has failed to score in every single game they have played, until 3 games before the end of the season, and at the same time praise that player for "securing our top flight" when they have been at least partly responsible for why the club needed to wait until the 3rd last game of the season to be secure.

It's not like I have denied his two recent performances have probably been his best, but that is the problem here.

 

56 minutes ago, Buddiesaint said:

That's a huge stretch to claim his poor performances this season were because he chose not to play as well as he could.

There's loads of factors to take into account.  Morale and self belief, coaching styles,  injuries, the pressure and reaction from fans,  the performances of the players around him too. Maybe he's even been told straight, your place at St mirren is on the line.

This is the same for every single player in the squad though. The person most responsible for Main's performances have been Main himself. I have stated time and again, I bear no ill will towards Main. If people are willing to pay him to play then who am I to say he shouldn't. My point is that he has simply not provided the return that even the most modest requirement would consider a success.

In fact, if there is anyone to "blame" here, it's Goodwin for not getting the best out of him. There is no "blame" to be had, I understand why he was bought, but it hasn't worked out. Robinson looks to have improved his output by playing him as a 2, but even at his best, his very best, he is not a consistent scorer, and that as a striker is literally the thing you are brought to the club for.

Edited May 9, 2022 by Ric

[GAD]

7 minutes ago, Coventry Saint said:

Assuming we go with four strikers in the squad, I think you can find room for the Main we saw on Saturday. He's clearly a confidence player and he was very good. 

Recruitment will depend heavily on how Robbo wants to shape us up. We need more wide players if he's going for a 4-3-3, though Greive could be one of those.

Either way, we'll certainly be bringing in at least one striker and one winger/wide forward, but it's safe to say Main will be in the picture too.

I think our shopping list will look like this:

Striker; 

Winger/WF with pace, please;

One further midfielder (assuming O'Hara and Baccus stories are true - that would leave us perming three from Kiltie, Baccus, O'Hara, Reid + new person);

Possibly a right back if Robinson decides he doesn't want Fraser as first choice;

GK - assuming it's Carson.

Maybe a surprise additional attacking mid to give Kiltie competition.

I think we might stick with the 3-5-2 next season tbh. Tanser signing the new deal seems to suggest that to me, and Fraser looks so much better in the back three. I think we will be desperate to get in a Tanser type for the right hand side, and maybe another backup for the left. Means we will have Tanser, Fraser, Shaughnessy, Kiltie and Erhahon in the spots they look most comfortable (providing they all stay) and play a front two , which seems to suit all the strikers at the club.

I don't think we will sign a striker, I think Robinson will go with Brophy, Main and Greive with Offord and Jamieson backing them up. Mind you, I think Robinson's style is to have a big squad with plenty of competition for places and options. We are kind of used to Goodwin having one first pick and a couple of "utility" players filling in. I think we are going back to the Jack Ross days of hundreds of players in every position.

 

[Doctor Sanchez]

3 minutes ago, Ric said:

... perhaps only a St Mirren fan could somehow hold onto the hope that a player who has failed to score in every single game they have played, until 3 games before the end of the season...

Main scored against Aberdeen in the 3-2 game. 

[Ric]

It's obviously far too soon to make predictions for what we'll look like under Robinson, but I'd be surprised if we don't end up with a 5-3-2 (with the RWB/LWB pushing high). The team is sort of set up that way anyway due to Goodwin trying that (albeit with one up front) and looking at the players that have either been confirmed or rumoured it doesn't really change my opinion on that.

We're actually in a decent place, in terms of building towards next season. I would love to convince Gogic to stick around but I feel he'll be snapped up by others (either here or abroad). Ronan I'm sort of so-so about. He's a great player, no doubting, but I always accepted he'd be a loan only and I really can't see us putting up the finances to bring him back permanently. Again, others will be interested. With that in mind, we do need to look at bringing in someone with a bit of creativity. We've been lucky to have both McGrath then Ronan, and it's more hope than expectation Robinson could find a similar player to bring in. Fingers crossed though.

Other than that, it'll be interesting to see where Robinson stands on bringing through the youth. Henderson should now be considered a 1st team player, he has earned that right imo, but will Robinson prefer to loan him out? I think we'd all agree a successful loan to a club in the Championship would do wonders for him, but he's at the cusp of being very useful to use in the Premiership. Offord and Jamieson, too, while maybe not ready for consistent 1st team involvement, it'll be interesting to see where Robinson sees them in terms of development.

 

[Ric]

11 minutes ago, Doctor Sanchez said:

Main scored against Aberdeen in the 3-2 game. 

Saturday saw Main's first league goal of the season.

[Lex]

5 minutes ago, Ric said:

Saturday saw Main's first league goal of the season.

Depends on your source:

He also scored a perfectly good goal against Celtic at Parkhead, which was incorrectly given as offside. For me Main is a good option to have in the squad, and it seems Goodwin and now Robinson agrees. He's not had a great season by any stretch, but he will be here next year and I can see him making a positive contribution, like he has in the last few games. 

[Ric]

6 minutes ago, Lex said:

Depends on your source:

He also scored a perfectly good goal against Celtic at Parkhead, which was incorrectly given as offside. For me Main is a good option to have in the squad, and it seems Goodwin and now Robinson agrees. He's not had a great season by any stretch, but he will be here next year and I can see him making a positive contribution, like he has in the last few games. 

Yeah, the BBC are wrong there. From memory all Main did was stand in the way of Lewis while the ball floated above both of them into the goal. Can't remember who it was that crossed it in, but they should have been credited. Presumably other sources agree. Not sure what went down in the official report, mind, perhaps the referee recorded it for Main (do refs record who scores? they must do, right?).

I mean, to be honest, arguing whether it was his first, or second, league goal after 35 games have been played, is not really enhancing his reputation.

 

Edit: I should add, if Main performs next season like he has in the last two games, then I have no issue with the guy. "issue" is the wrong word, I have no "issue" with the guy at all, I am looking at this whole situation utterly objectively, he simply hasn't provided the return.

Edited May 9, 2022 by Ric

[NorthBank]

Marcus Fraser scored that goal against Aberdeen. Goodwin only gave it to Main to boost his confidence. Fraser on Twitter was claiming the goal and trolling Main for trying to say he got a touch which he didn't.

[Arch Stanton]

27 minutes ago, Ric said:

Yeah, the BBC are wrong there. From memory all Main did was stand in the way of Lewis while the ball floated above both of them into the goal. Can't remember who it was that crossed it in, but they should have been credited.

Marcus Fraser .

Main also scored v Dunfermline. 

[Ric]

1 minute ago, Arch Stanton said:

Marcus Fraser .

Main also scored v Dunfermline. 

Yeah, and Stenny, but both were in the cup.

[Coventry Saint]

1 hour ago, GAD said:

I think we might stick with the 3-5-2 next season tbh. Tanser signing the new deal seems to suggest that to me, and Fraser looks so much better in the back three. I think we will be desperate to get in a Tanser type for the right hand side, and maybe another backup for the left. Means we will have Tanser, Fraser, Shaughnessy, Kiltie and Erhahon in the spots they look most comfortable (providing they all stay) and play a front two , which seems to suit all the strikers at the club.

I don't think we will sign a striker, I think Robinson will go with Brophy, Main and Greive with Offord and Jamieson backing them up. Mind you, I think Robinson's style is to have a big squad with plenty of competition for places and options. We are kind of used to Goodwin having one first pick and a couple of "utility" players filling in. I think we are going back to the Jack Ross days of hundreds of players in every position.

Good shout about the strikers, I'd temporarily forgotten those lads. I'd be happy running with them as the options. Brophy is injury prone, and there's an outside chance we could be losing Greive to the World Cup, so we'll need plenty cover.

The 3-5-2 is fine if we can make it work, which means Kiltie playing, and a proper RWB. They're hard to find, as we have discovered. 3-5-2 would be great news for some of those players you've mentioned, but not so much for Jay Henderson.

I think the main thing in manager's mind will be building some flexibility into the squad. 

[djchapsticks]

Regarding the Main situation and Ric's comments.

I made mention on Saturday to my mates that I recall Michael Higdon being roundly and soundly derided in his first season with us. He scored something like 3 in 34 games and was being mentioned to GTF ASAP. His following season he scored over 15 goals for us and by the time he moved onto Motherwell, we were desperate to see him stay.

It was a similar situation with Billy Mehmet. He was a joke figure. The season we won the 1st division, it was a running joke that he scored the winner against Dundee to secure the title, given it was like the 34th game of the season and his first goal. He went onto become a very pivotal player in our early SPL years.

Josh Magennis as well. A figure of fun at Aberdeen and utterly garbage in his loan spell with us and Scottish football roundly laughed at Kilmarnock giving him a three year deal - he's also gone on to carve out a very, very good career for himself.

I'm not saying Main is going to be the same but I think there are could be a slightly comparable situation that Main will prove to be worth much more than he's shown so far. He's never, ever going to be prolific. He doesn't have to be either...if we can put him out there to be a disruptive influence to an opposition back line, winning flick ons with his back to goal, coming deep and linking up for other players and generally being a big physical headache for defenders whilst chipping in with 6 or 7 goals a season, then that'll do for me.

[Ric]

4 minutes ago, djchapsticks said:

I'm not saying Main is going to be the same but I think there are could be a slightly comparable situation that Main will prove to be worth much more than he's shown so far. He's never, ever going to be prolific.

I think you've hit the nail on the head, twice, there. He could prove to be worth much more than he's shown so far, and he's never going to be prolific. However, to me, gambling on the redemption of a player who isn't going to score you goals is how I view that.

 

[djchapsticks]

2 minutes ago, Ric said:

I think you've hit the nail on the head, twice, there. He could prove to be worth much more than he's shown so far, and he's never going to be prolific. However, to me, gambling on the redemption of a player who isn't going to score you goals is how I view that.

 

Understandable, Main comes across as honest as they come though.

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/in-your-area/renfrewshire/curtis-main-promises-st-mirren-26910323

He's in the PDE (apologies for linking to Record) today lamenting how rough this season has been for him on a personal level and that he's not been performing to level that he's happy with. It's a pretty honest self-assessment and respect to him for saying it when he could have said nothing and no-one would have uttered a word about it.