The St. Mirren FC 2023/24 thread

[buddie06smfc]

How did we manage to end up bottom of the Championship with a side that contained Naismith, Mackenzie, Mallan, McAllister, Morgan and Shankland?

Alex Rae

[Jeremiah Cole]

Last time I looked there was still a guy on B&W army insisting the director of football and our summer recruitment had been a complete failure.  That was only a week or so ago. Fair play to the guy for sticking to his guns I suppose...

He was still arguing his case earlier today! [emoji23]

[Jeremiah Cole]

It genuinely defies belief. That's you not even including Ryan Hardie, John Sutton, Jack Baird and Kyle Magennis.

Was it all Kyle Hutton’s fault? [emoji1]

The thing is, Jack Ross couldn’t even turn it around with that squad until the window.

[djchapsticks]

1 minute ago, Jeremiah Cole said:

 

As I told you before, such a signing would have been a complete waste of a wage.

We only play with 1 out and out striker. We have plenty of guys who could have played that role in an emergency.

This is a real signing!


 

 

I agree it's much more palatable.

Point being is that I thought we'd go short term on this one. Actually shelling money out and giving him a 2 year deal is a massively positive sign. 

His goal return Vs the actual amount of minutes on the park at both League one and league two level is also encouraging. 

[Jeremiah Cole]

Alex Rae

But he was away after 4 games or something like that. How do you explain things actually getting worse under Jack Ross with those players?

[Trinidad Saint]

But he was away after 4 games or something like that. How do you explain things actually getting worse under Jack Ross with those players?

I believe he was joking (well that’s how I took it)

[djchapsticks]

Just now, Jeremiah Cole said:

 

But he was away after 4 games or something like that. How do you explain things actually getting worse under Jack Ross with those players?
 

 

I always equate it back to the Morton game at Cappielow. It was 3-1 going on 8-1 and at one point, Kyle Hutton physically flapped his arms like a doo. That match was the straw that broke the camel's back and ended several St. Mirren careers . It also started Magennis and McAllisters out of necessity more than anything else. 

Think players heads went down early doors and several never really recovered. Guys like Hardie, Tom Walsh and Shankland were far better players than they were showing themselves to be and have all proven so since. Naismith was also underperforming at that point as he wanted away (same as John McGinn in his final season) and really it was just a perfect shitstrom for a few months. 

[Stevie88]

Seems like a very decent bit of business by the club. Feeling optimistic for the season ahead!!

[GAD]

1 hour ago, Jeremiah Cole said:

 

Was it all Kyle Hutton’s fault?

The thing is, Jack Ross couldn’t even turn it around with that squad until the window.

 

I think the midfield was the issue! Hutton was shite, Mallan was lightweight and it was mostly being held together by a 50% fit Rocco Quinn and David Clarkson! We lost a crazy amount if goals after Quinn went off in each gane because he could only manage 60 mins.

Still, imagine telling somebody now that ditching Hardie and Shankland and replacing them with Rory Loy would help save our season!

 

[buddie06smfc]

1 hour ago, Jeremiah Cole said:

But he was away after 4 games or something like that. How do you explain things actually getting worse under Jack Ross with those players?

 

 

1 hour ago, Trinidad Saint said:

I believe he was joking (well that’s how I took it)

 

Well, yes and no. Any time there is a chance to have a dig at Alex Rae, it should be taken full advantage of. Alex Rae is always vocal about how he only got 6 games that season and now has Stubbs as his moaning partner. He's quick to shift the blame when he was at fault. He built the shitstorm of a squad that summer. He hindered all those players mentioned previously (many of whom have now gone on to better things - including Lewis Morgan who he likes to take credit for but Morgan was nothing special under Alex Rae). Someone mentioned Naismith as underperforming, while it carried on to Jack Ross' tenure, Alex Rae's tactics had the full backs stopping dead at the halfway line. It ruined the full backs and that was a lot of Naismith's game. 

Alex Rae is quick enough to moan about the budget at St Mirren, similar to Alan Stubbs. There's a bit of a theme here. Jack Ross didn't moan about it under Gordon Scott, Jim Goodwin is yet to moan about it - maybe he will in the coming months but with the past few weeks development I don't imagine he would. Ian Murray left Saints in similar circumstances just the season prior and I don't hear him moaning constantly about being sacked nor does he get the grief that Rae does. The man has no redeeming features. 

Should be banned from St Mirren Park, one for the SMiSA votes. 

[christinanade]

11 minutes ago, buddie06smfc said:

 

Well, yes and no. Any time there is a chance to have a dig at Alex Rae, it should be taken full advantage of. Alex Rae is always vocal about how he only got 6 games that season and now has Stubbs as his moaning partner. He's quick to shift the blame when he was at fault. He built the shitstorm of a squad that summer. He hindered all those players mentioned previously (many of whom have now gone on to better things - including Lewis Morgan who he likes to take credit for but Morgan was nothing special under Alex Rae). Someone mentioned Naismith as underperforming, while it carried on to Jack Ross' tenure, Alex Rae's tactics had the full backs stopping dead at the halfway line. It ruined the full backs and that was a lot of Naismith's game. 

Alex Rae is quick enough to moan about the budget at St Mirren, similar to Alan Stubbs. There's a bit of a theme here. Jack Ross didn't moan about it under Gordon Scott, Jim Goodwin is yet to moan about it - maybe he will in the coming months but with the past few weeks development I don't imagine he would. Ian Murray left Saints in similar circumstances just the season prior and I don't hear him moaning constantly about being sacked nor does he get the grief that Rae does. The man has no redeeming features. 

Should be banned from St Mirren Park, one for the SMiSA votes. 

Also allegedly involved in some quite serious bullying of youth team players....the guy is a ned arsehole. I actually came across an old daily express from then with the main article focusing on callum gallagher singing the praises of the supposed "revival" under rae ...

[christinanade]

1 hour ago, djchapsticks said:

I always equate it back to the Morton game at Cappielow. It was 3-1 going on 8-1 and at one point, Kyle Hutton physically flapped his arms like a doo. That match was the straw that broke the camel's back and ended several St. Mirren careers . It also started Magennis and McAllisters out of necessity more than anything else. 

Think players heads went down early doors and several never really recovered. Guys like Hardie, Tom Walsh and Shankland were far better players than they were showing themselves to be and have all proven so since. Naismith was also underperforming at that point as he wanted away (same as John McGinn in his final season) and really it was just a perfect shitstrom for a few months. 

I always thought walsh was decent for us, and still looks decent anytime I see an inverness game. Rumoured attitude problems. Hardie was a definate attitude problem, thought he as billy big baws and put in zero effort. Shankland by his own admition was fat, unfit and lazy during his time with us.

[Gareth_Glasgow]

I think the midfield was the issue! Hutton was shite, Mallan was lightweight and it was mostly being held together by a 50% fit Rocco Quinn and David Clarkson! We lost a crazy amount if goals after Quinn went off in each gane because he could only manage 60 mins.
Still, imagine telling somebody now that ditching Hardie and Shankland and replacing them with Rory Loy would help save our season!
 

I really liked Rocco Quinn, I remember him having a great game as a makeshift striker against Hibs. Shame we didn’t get him fitter and in a less shite team.

[GAD]

6 minutes ago, Gareth_Glasgow said:

I really liked Rocco Quinn, I remember him having a great game as a makeshift striker against Hibs. Shame we didn’t get him fitter and in a less shite team.

Me too, he was a very good player in a bad team, he's one of the few to come out of the pre January team with any credit.

Also, and this will be an unpopular opinion, I think Rae did some good for St Mirren. He comfortably kept us up the season before and made Murray's team better. I think he probably was a little bit unlucky, on paper at least, to get sacked after 6 games the season after. I don't know about the other rumours about bullying and various other stuff, but it does seem to me the main reason he got sacked was basically Gordon Scott just wanted Jack Ross instead, so I can actually understand why he's a bit bitter about the whole thing. Stubbs was a much bigger c**t than Rae IMO.

[Demented Zebra]

Looks like a good signing injury history but that's why we can get these guys they want to put their career back on track. 

[Stu]

The whole Rae appointment was bizarre from the start. It was the fourth time in 18 month we'd changed manager and he hadn't even been rumoured the previous three. Yet, within 24 hours of Murray leaving, Chick Young was on the radio saying Rae would get the job.  Sounds fanciful but I still think he played a large part in that, considering he was Rae's five-a-side pal and knew Gilmour well.

There are some fantastic stories about Rae that will probably only be proven if a player from that time ends up on Tell Him He's Pele. Stuff about training being Rangers v non Rangers and him and Farrell watching the Old Firm game when they should have been preparing the side for that afternoon's game against Queen of the South (where we were woeful). His signing policy was certainly staunch.

I read Farrell's book after he left us and he said something he'd learnt from his repeated sackings from clubs was to play up your successes and emphasise the circumstances you were working under as much as possible. And that's exactly what Rae did.

Still, it paved the way for a half season that is right up there with the Millennium Champions season for me. From going into work with a big smile the morning after Mallan's last minute winner against Queens to celebrating at Easter Road as if we'd just pulled off the most audacious bank heist in history, it was a hell of a ride.

 

[djchapsticks]

I liked Rocco Quinn as well, he was a classy player who could perform well in quite a few roles. Unfortunately he was just a physically broken down guy at a terribly young age. I mentioned when we signed Tansey that it had shades of Quinn about it and hoped it would fare better long term. 

Similar age, style of player, build and both with absolutely horrific injury records. That game against Hibs Quinn absolutely terrorised them and we never seemed to play him in that role again. 

Never see or hear much from the guy since he left us apart from that he retired... hope he's doing well in whatever he's up to.  

[Bobby_F]

When people were talking about signing a new striker so we could have a 'big guy little guy' partnership, don't think we'd have expected to sign someone that allowed Mullen to play the big guy.

[Bobby_F]

9 hours ago, Coventry Saint said:

Nobody is ITK any more 

Only thing missing is a Youtube highlights compilation... he looks like a 5'6" brick shithouse, if such a thing exists. Built like a tiny tank.

 

Desperately hope Junior has a great career with us, but that showreel doesn't fill me with huge amounts of confidence.

I know Scottish football isn't great, but to do well in out top flight, I'd be expecting someone to look better playing against League Two (and lower) opposition.

Maybe just needs better players around him

[Drooper]

10 hours ago, Bobby_F said:

Desperately hope Junior has a great career with us, but that showreel doesn't fill me with huge amounts of confidence.

I know Scottish football isn't great, but to do well in out top flight, I'd be expecting someone to look better playing against League Two (and lower) opposition.

Maybe just needs better players around him

This is a wind-up, right?