The St. Mirren FC 2023/24 thread

[Buddist Monk]

46 minutes ago, Stu said:

Imagine a potential manager saying the budget would need to be in line with the expectations of the board. That sort of sensible thinking has no place in football.

I tell you what though, while I totally agree with you on that, Neilson's not a daft lad. He would have discussed before the programme went out whether he'd take direct questions on if he was interested. He'd also have known that he had already been tipped by some for the position, and he'd know just about every St Mirren fan would be interested to hear what he says.

I'm not saying it was a setup, "get me on tv/radio so I can interview (by  proxy) for the job", but I'm saying it's a good chance every word he delivered was weighted and given some thought before hand. In many ways it was a clever move for him, go on the radio and state you could only join a club with a decent budget gives him the ability to walk into any possible interview with his ground rules already set - and Scott will have known this.

 

5 hours ago, JamieThomas said:

...it's genuinely concern for fellow fans.

Ah, the age old bond between Hearts fans and St Mirren. You'll forgive me if I don't believe any Hearts fan cares about us. Living in Edinburgh for a while only cemented that opinion.

That said, I hope you enjoy the improvement in Liam Smith. He might have only been playing in the championship, but he made great strides over the season.

Edited May 27, 2018 by Buddist Monk

[Demented Zebra]

4 minutes ago, Buddist Monk said:

I tell you what though, while I totally agree with you on that, Neilson's not a daft lad. He would have discussed before the programme went out whether he'd take direct questions on if he was interested. He'd also have known that he had already been tipped by some for the position, and he'd know just about every St Mirren fan would be interested to hear what he says.

I'm not saying it was a setup, "get me on tv/radio so I can interview (by  proxy) for the job", but I'm saying it's a good chance every word he delivered was weighted and given some thought before hand. In many ways it was a clever move for him, go on the radio and state you could only join a club with a decent budget gives him the ability to walk into any possible interview with his ground rules already set - and Scott will have known this.

You also have the budget excuse when things go tits up something we have heard as an excuse too often. Never the manager failings always the resources. That's why I don't want Robbie.  Do you think you would hear the same from Jim Goodwin ? No chance. 

[djchapsticks]

9 minutes ago, Buddist Monk said:

I tell you what though, while I totally agree with you on that, Neilson's not a daft lad. He would have discussed before the programme went out whether he'd take direct questions on if he was interested. He'd also have known that he had already been tipped by some for the position, and he'd know just about every St Mirren fan would be interested to hear what he says.

I'm not saying it was a setup, "get me on tv/radio so I can interview (by  proxy) for the job", but I'm saying it's a good chance every word he delivered was weighted and given some thought before hand. In many ways it was a clever move for him, go on the radio and state you could only join a club with a decent budget gives him the ability to walk into any possible interview with his ground rules already set - and Scott will have known this.

Yup. Think most supporters see it as a shrewd move on Neilson's part. 

Other than DZ of course. 

[Buddist Monk]

1 minute ago, Demented Zebra said:

You also have the budget excuse when things go tits up something we have heard as an excuse too often. Never the manager failings always the resources. That's why I don't want Robbie.  Do you think you would hear the same from Jim Goodwin ? No chance. 

You seem to be ignoring context here. For Goodwin, and for Ross, Rae, Murray, Craig, Teale, Lennon, etc... this job was a step up either in club or in their role at the club. None of them were publicly talking budgets for that reason. Neilson, for right or wrong, will be considering this as a step down from the Hearts position he held. Now I'm a fan, I don't like using that sort of language but that's the simple facts of things, and until we can offer a 20k ground regularly filled and anonymous donators firing in hundreds of grand, we can't be considered on a par.

I can assure you that every single manager that has taken the job has discussed finances in the interview process, the only difference here is that he was explicitly asked what he would want and saying "I would want a decent budget" is hardly the sort of chat that should dismiss someone for the position.

Is he the man for the job? * Scooby Doo voice * "Uhh-dont-knoww" .. has he in any way blotted his copy book? I really don't think so.

[djchapsticks]

2 minutes ago, Demented Zebra said:

You also have the budget excuse when things go tits up something we have heard as an excuse too often. Never the manager failings always the resources. That's why I don't want Robbie.  Do you think you would hear the same from Jim Goodwin ? No chance. 

If the guy is given a tiny budget and told to get top 6 then they are well within rights to lament lack of resources. Neilson is simply putting it out there in the public domain that this is something he won't entertain. 

You're literally the only person who fails to make the correlation here and why it is a wholly legitimate point for any potential manager to make. 

Goodwin, Hopkin, Lambert, McIntyre etc will 100% all make the same assertion if they are interviewed. Don't kid yourself that any of these guys would set themselves up to look stupid and risk getting punted by accepting a shite budget and aspirations of a top half finish. One condition has to meet the other and I fully expect any potential manager to negotiate this in depth during the interviewing process. 

That Neilson has mentioned it on the radio is certainly not the taboo that you seem intent on making it. 

 

[Demented Zebra]

2 minutes ago, djchapsticks said:

Yup. Think most supporters see it as a shrewd move on Neilson's part. 

Other than DZ of course. 

So you don't think the budget would have been discussed at his interview and the stake needs to be raised for Gordon's expectations for a top six place eventually that is his ultimate aim. As I wrote watch Robbie now disapper. 

[djchapsticks]

2 minutes ago, Demented Zebra said:

So you don't think the budget would have been discussed at his interview and the stake needs to be raised for Gordon's expectations for a top six place eventually that is his ultimate aim. As I wrote watch Robbie now disapper. 

No one has been interviewed yet, FFS. 

Edited May 27, 2018 by djchapsticks

[Demented Zebra]

2 minutes ago, Buddist Monk said:

You seem to be ignoring context here. For Goodwin, and for Ross, Rae, Murray, Craig, Teale, Lennon, etc... this job was a step up either in club or in their role at the club. None of them were publicly talking budgets for that reason. Neilson, for right or wrong, will be considering this as a step down from the Hearts position he held. Now I'm a fan, I don't like using that sort of language but that's the simple facts of things, and until we can offer a 20k ground regularly filled and anonymous donators firing in hundreds of grand, we can't be considered on a par.

I can assure you that every single manager that has taken the job has discussed finances in the interview process, the only difference here is that he was explicitly asked what he would want and saying "I would want a decent budget" is hardly the sort of chat that should dismiss someone for the position.

Is he the man for the job? * Scooby Doo voice * "Uhh-dont-knoww" .. has he in any way blotted his copy book? I really don't think so.

Sorry mate only a few weeks ago he put himself out there even in a coaching role to get back into the game. He is out of work how can you look down on any job ? 

[Buddist Monk]

Just now, djchapsticks said:

He hasn't been interviewed yet, FFS. 

Yeah, I think this is quite key.

There is a world of difference between musing about what you'd like before an interview, even if those musings were designed to be heard by the masses, and attending an interview then coming out later and stating you need a decent budget. The latter would seem as a rebuke to the board, the former simply someone stating their preferred baseline.

[Demented Zebra]

1 minute ago, djchapsticks said:

No one has been interviewed yet, FFS. 

Really you don't think he has had a chat with officias. I suppose he was keeping himself fit at Ralston.  

[djchapsticks]

6 minutes ago, Demented Zebra said:

Really you don't think he has had a chat with officias. I suppose he was keeping himself fit at Ralston.  

Ill say this once more. 

Jack Ross left St. Mirren on Friday afternoon. 

Neither Robbie Neilson, or anyone else has been interviewed yet for the vacant managers position.

It's really that simple. I understand you have history of putting 2 and 2 together and getting fanciful results but that's the case. 

Edited May 27, 2018 by djchapsticks

[glenburn bud]

As previously stated on here by another poster,we should be considering ourselves lucky that someone like Neilsen is actually interested in the job. I can’t see any perspective manager taking on a gig without the promise of having at least some kind of indication of what his budget constraints might be. Taking on a newly promoted team is a risk for any manager to take, Neilsen is boxing clever here and has done nothing wrong in that sportsound interview. 

[Buddist Monk]

13 minutes ago, Demented Zebra said:

Sorry mate only a few weeks ago he put himself out there even in a coaching role to get back into the game. He is out of work how can you look down on any job ? 

I hate to say "read my post and you'll see why", because that sounds a bit arsey, but really... read my post.

Whether we like it or not, Hearts are clearly a bigger club than us. In the Scottish context Neilson last worked at Hearts. By that token looking to bring in Neilson would be seen as a step up for us and a step down for him. As I say, it's not the sort of thing I like writing but I'd say in general it's the consensus most in Scottish football would have.

[Shuggie_Murray7]

JR is some boy 

https://stv.tv/sport/football/1416258-football-talk-rangers-new-goldson-bid-ross-wants-mcginn/

[Buddist Monk]

4 minutes ago, Shuggie_Murray7 said:

JR is some boy 

https://stv.tv/sport/football/1416258-football-talk-rangers-new-goldson-bid-ross-wants-mcginn/

That is fucking shocking "journalism". The "story" simply links to The "Scottish" Sun, which in turn has absolutely nothing other than Jack Ross has a budget at Sunderland. If scrapping the barrel for clickbait was an Olympic sport, then STV and The "Scottish" Sun would win gold in the two man 'boab' sleigh.

 

[Stu]

In fairness, it's no different to the rumour mill/gossip column/whatever articles a lot of websites do on a daily basis. Sky, The Guardian and the BBC instantly come to mind: https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/44270572

You can argue the rights and wrongs of such articles but everyone is at it. Nowhere near as bad as, for example, The Sun having a transfer rumour and then half an hour later it's on every other supposedly professional news organisation with "As reported by The Sun" a third of the way down. Now that is fucking shocking "journalism".

[Demented Zebra]

30 minutes ago, djchapsticks said:

Ill say this once more. 

Jack Ross left St. Mirren on Friday afternoon. 

Neither Robbie Neilson, or anyone else has been interviewed yet for the vacant managers position.

It's really that simple. I understand you have history of putting 2 and 2 together and getting fanciful results but that's the case. 

Have to agree Gordon was caught right out when Jack left on Friday. However we all know a plan had already been put in place. Feel free to keep up the digs because someone differed your opinon. 

[Fony Titz]

What are the expectations, not just with the fans but also the board? What is the budget? Do they both match?

“Will it give someone who comes in an opportunity to really drive the place forward? Or are you going to be scrapping at the bottom of the league again? Robbie Neilson quote. 

 

These are all valid considerations.

[djchapsticks]

2 minutes ago, Demented Zebra said:

Have to agree Gordon was caught right out when Jack left on Friday. However we all know a plan had already been put in place. Feel free to keep up the digs because someone differed your opinon. 

It's not a dig. You offered up insider knowledge of Jim Duffy being a shoo-in for Firhill the other day as well and it came to heehaw. 

[Fony Titz]

Sorry mate only a few weeks ago he put himself out there even in a coaching role to get back into the game. He is out of work how can you look down on any job ? 

He's not looking down on the job!! He is saying that there are loads of things to consider.

You really never know when to stop flogging the dead horse do you?