Oor Nicola Sturgeon thread.

[Jacksgranda]

12 hours ago, Honest Saints Fan said:

I think half the electorate don't even understand what's happening. My political savy grandparents don't. They also hate Alex Salmond with a passion so would be on Nicola's side every time. One is a tory the other a swing voter. 

^^^ Tommy Sheridan found

[JMDP]

I don't think this is the the slam dunk the Tories think it is. If anything, it could galvanise the core vote of the SNP and urge them to get out in May.

Is this really going to change the mind of anyone in serious numbers? Most independence voters still see her as the clearest figurehead to lead the movement and back her - Tories will want her out for the same reason, despite going very quiet when asked about clear cases of parliament being deliberately misled by their own party. 

[GiGi]

Who do we think is the leaker then? Immediately thought it might be that mouthbreather Mitchell but more likely it was Jackie Baillie or Murdo Fraser trying to be clever IMO.

[Baxter Parp]

Boris is not in Holyrood
 

Everything that happens in Scotland is in the context of being part of the UK. Johnson is the single most powerful politician in this country and he's being held to a ludicrously different standard of behaviour to Sturgeon. That's not whataboutery, it's pointing out brass-necked, unmitigated hypocrisy and corruption in the country we live in.

[SANTAN]

7 minutes ago, GiGi said:

Who do we think is the leaker then? Immediately thought it might be that mouthbreather Mitchell but more likely it was Jackie Baillie or Murdo Fraser trying to be clever IMO.

Wightman. 

[ayrmad]

2 minutes ago, Baxter Parp said:

 

 

Everything that happens in Scotland is in the context of being part of the UK. Johnson is the single most powerful politician in this country and he's being held to a ludicrously different standard of behaviour to Sturgeon. That's not whataboutery, it's pointing out brass-necked, unmitigated hypocrisy and corruption in the country we live in.

 

And they get no where near the number of votes up here, maybe we'll give Nicola a similar level of support if she's found to be a liar. 

[Ned Nederlander]

1 hour ago, Stormzy said:

Imagine how much of an invertebrate you need to be to support a politican like your favourite footballer and support a party like your team with blind loyalty. 

I've changed my politics fairly recently (No/Tory -> Yes/SNP) and I'd be happy to change my vote again - I won't be changing it over any of this utter nonsense.

[ayrmad]

The notes have probably been dropped whilst someone was reaching down for a big box of Dunkin Donuts.

[SANTAN]

1 minute ago, Ned Nederlander said:

I've changed my politics fairly recently (No/Tory -> Yes/SNP) and I'd be happy to change my vote again - I won't be changing it over any of this utter nonsense.

That's good to hear. I don't think people have to change their mind over the issue, I understand people who want Independence so much they'll look past this to get it but the idea they can't criticise the wrong doings and the way in which some of the stuff is being blindly brushed aside is pretty alarming to any sensible person. 

[vikingTON]

2 hours ago, Stormzy said:

Yeah I wasn't directing my post at yourself, your idea is certainly more practical than the ostrich approach and the flailing around being done by most. 

I think your strategy is very high risk, I'd imagine they think they can soldier on through the elections but if she were to resign then her starting position is very vulnerable. 

What, specifically, are the risks to this strategy? There is not going to be a party leadership challenge six weeks before an election, which means that both internal factions and the Salmond inquiry can be skewered by a return to power by the will of the electorate. Which is a racing certainty. 

A cynic would suggest that the SG has been stalling and obstructing to get to exactly this scenario all along: I don't credit the current leadership with that degree of calculated strategy. 

[effeffsee_the2nd]

I couldn't give a toss, taking independence out the equation, the SNP have plenty flaws but the rest of the parties are so unbelievably lightweight I wouldn't even look at them,

[SANTAN]

3 minutes ago, virginton said:

What, specifically, are the risks to this strategy? There is not going to be a party leadership challenge six weeks before an election, which means that both internal factions and the Salmond inquiry can be skewered by a return to power by the will of the electorate. Which is a racing certainty. 

A cynic would suggest that the SG has been stalling and obstructing to get to exactly this scenario all along: I don't credit the current leadership with that degree of calculated strategy. 

I dunno, it's certainly an interesting idea. I just think that if she resigned then the MSM and opposition parties would really drive home the negative stories, the position of electing someone who has had to resign is poor optics imo, she probably would get reelected but what if her numbers suffered considerably, she would be permanently tarred with this brush, I think it would be very hard to sell to the electorate the nuance of why she would have resigned in that scenario most people would just presume guilt on her part. 

[Hedgecutter]

34 minutes ago, ayrmad said:

if he comes out with similar then it's off you pop Nicola and thanks for fucking up independence for a very long time. 

You really have to ask questions of people who are willing to turn down the option of having an entire country reformed in a way that will affect the lives of many generations to come, all because they didn't like the past actions of a single woman.

What are they honestly thinking? That Sturgeon suggests that no Scots are ever going to be capable of running their own show properly, and that our Westminster overlords clearly know best???  Folk abroad looking in would probably presume that she must have been some sort of genocidal maniac for one person to affect the outcome.

[sparky88]

20 minutes ago, Baxter Parp said:

 

 

Everything that happens in Scotland is in the context of being part of the UK. Johnson is the single most powerful politician in this country and he's being held to a ludicrously different standard of behaviour to Sturgeon. That's not whataboutery, it's pointing out brass-necked, unmitigated hypocrisy and corruption in the country we live in.

 

No-one needed that £500,000 anyway. 

[GiGi]

2 minutes ago, sparky88 said:

No-one needed that £500,000 anyway. 

Which 500k, the one spunked on the Salmond inquiry or the one paid off to a bullied civil servant?

[heedthebaa]

2 hours ago, kevthedee said:

Don't forget who started this so called witch hunt Mr alec salmond.

Any political party would be quick to put the boot in including the SNP if the shoe was on the other foot so 2 speak.

It’s good opposition imo, MacAskill, Sillars and the good rev Stu hasn’t exactly helped neither 

 

[ayrmad]

9 minutes ago, Hedgecutter said:

You really have to ask questions of people who are willing to turn down the option of having an entire country reformed in a way that will affect the lives of many generations to come, all because they didn't like the past actions of a single woman.

What are they honestly thinking? That Sturgeon suggests that no Scots are ever going to be capable of running their own show properly, and that our Westminster overlords clearly know best???  Folk abroad looking in would probably presume that she must have been some sort of genocidal maniac for one person to affect the outcome.

This election is only about gaining a mandate, not all those voting SNP are actually independence supporters but without them there will be no mandate. 

Personally I think they're quite happy to keep there snouts in the trough. 

[paolo2143]

21 minutes ago, Stormzy said:

I dunno, it's certainly an interesting idea. I just think that if she resigned then the MSM and opposition parties would really drive home the negative stories, the position of electing someone who has had to resign is poor optics imo, she probably would get reelected but what if her numbers suffered considerably, she would be permanently tarred with this brush, I think it would be very hard to sell to the electorate the nuance of why she would have resigned in that scenario most people would just presume guilt on her part. 

100% agree. The only way her resigning would be possibly better choice/optics is if James Hamilton comes back and says she knowingly broke Ministerial code. Even then i think that there is a large % of voters who would back her and it might still be more damaging to resign.

However if Mr Hamilton either finds she did not break the code or only did so unintentionally then much better for her to stay.

The Tory press and opposition will be all over any resignation with wall to wall coverage of that juts confirms her guilt. Also to go into election leaderless would be a terrible look and i think much more damaging that her toughing it out.

Believe it or not leaders can still win elections even when public don't trust them, Boris and Tony Blair being prime examples. 

If she resigns the SNP are in big trouble and so is any chance of Pro Indy majority

[alta-pete]

24 minutes ago, paolo2143 said:

100% agree. The only way her resigning would be possibly better choice/optics is if James Hamilton comes back and says she knowingly broke Ministerial code. Even then i think that there is a large % of voters who would back her and it might still be more damaging to resign.

However if Mr Hamilton either finds she did not break the code or only did so unintentionally then much better for her to stay.

The Tory press and opposition will be all over any resignation with wall to wall coverage of that juts confirms her guilt. Also to go into election leaderless would be a terrible look and i think much more damaging that her toughing it out.

Believe it or not leaders can still win elections even when public don't trust them, Boris and Tony Blair being prime examples. 

If she resigns the SNP are in big trouble and so is any chance of Pro Indy majority

But she would still be the leader of the SNP. It's the FM job she's being pressured to resign and she's about to have that job taken off her in a couple of weeks' time anyway when Parliament is disbanded for the election.

[vikingTON]

She wouldn't be resigning from the party leadership and so they would still have a leader going into the election. Which they will almost certainly win regardless, which then allows them to reinstate Sturgeon to her position with a popular mandate and the opposition case refuted. 

If you think that the opposition are not going to be throwing the exact same mud both during and after the election campaign then you're deluded. This would simply cut away both their arguments from under them.