New clubs in the East of Scotland

[FairWeatherFan]

Just now, Sidney Lumet said:

I can understand the viewpoint that the SFA might be becoming belligerent over previous late entries but, as was shown in those cases, they don’t seem to be in any position to prevent it.

Those things flew under the radar. 2018 had an interim Chief Exec at the SFA that was just clock watching. 2019 with Kinnoull seemed to be where they got the slapped wrist. As by that point you had Iain Maxwell in place doing all the PWG meetings with the SJFA directing their complaints his way. That's why they added the bolded warning to their advert.

I'm sure the EoSFL would have gladly accepted any application from a West Lothian club if it had come in by the end of business on March 31st. Edinburgh South's application snuck in quite near the deadline to catch people unaware.

The fact is all the Fife clubs applying to the EoSFL announced they were leaving the Juniors in a East Region meeting back in February or very early March. Then it was March 13th(?) all the games were cancelled because of COVID19. So there was another 2 and a half weeks from COVID19 becoming an issue and deciding to apply.

I think at this point it would take a number of East Region clubs applying collectively to break the EoSFL position, as they cannot be seen as poaching clubs.

[Sidney Lumet]

Deadlines were clearly, the clubs have had almost 2 full years to apply. Using covid, or the wosfl application process to criticise the eosfl for rejecting a late application doesn't serve a purpose, particularly when you consider the level of criticism the eosfl received for accepting late applications previously.
Its unfortunate for the applicant club, it could produce a 'they don't want us narrative' (hopefully not though and clubs see it for what it is) but ultimately, putting any application in for anything in life, after the closing date, is likely to return a with a rejection letter. As rubbish as that might be for the applicant club.

I think that, as has been said, a ‘they don’t want us’ narrative will indeed now evolve. A wee bit digging tells me that there might have been a changing of the guard at the club of late (not sure how true that actually is though) and it is that which has precipitated their application. It will be galling for them, if true, if their ambition is stymied for a year.

[Ginaro]

Livingston United were top of the Superleague South when the music stopped, though their 3-1 defeat to Whitburn meant they would have lost out on PPG to other clubs.

Wonder what "very exceptional circumstances" would include - all the ERJFA clubs deciding to apply? Perhaps once those clubs realise they are in a 13 team league after tomorrow's EGM some will regret not applying as well?

[FairWeatherFan]

14 minutes ago, Ginaro said:

Livingston United were top of the Superleague South when the music stopped, though their 3-1 defeat to Whitburn meant they would have lost out on PPG to other clubs.

Wonder what "very exceptional circumstances" would include - all the ERJFA clubs deciding to apply? Perhaps once those clubs realise they are in a 13 team league after tomorrow's EGM some will regret not applying as well?

I'm not sure an individual applicant would get a pass now.

[Guest]

44 minutes ago, Sidney Lumet said:

I think that, as has been said, a ‘they don’t want us’ narrative will indeed now evolve. A wee bit digging tells me that there might have been a changing of the guard at the club of late (not sure how true that actually is though) and it is that which has precipitated their application. It will be galling for them, if true, if their ambition is stymied for a year.

I get it might be galling for the new incumbents, but the eosfl can't be held accountable for any clubs change in circumstances or direction of travel.

The clubs have had an extended period to apply (2 years), applying after a deadline and using it to further a 'they dont want us narrative' is not a reasonable thing to do.

As frustrating as it will be, the eosfl haven't stymied any progress in this instance for me.

[stanley]

I'm sure the EoS would be happy to take in any of the West Lothian juniors but have been told they can't after the deadline.  I certainly don't think it's a case of the EoS not wanting the clubs.  I hope people are able to look at it like that rather than thinking the EoS is purposely rejecting West Lothian clubs.

[Black & Red Socks]

The clubs have had an extended period to apply (2 years), applying after a deadline and using it to further a 'they dont want us narrative' is not a reasonable thing to do.

I don’t see anyone suggesting that the late application was an intentional move to further such a narrative, which is how the wording of the above comes across? Rather, the rejection may be used by others within the staunch West Lothian Junior community to further that very narrative.

[Sidney Lumet]

As frustrating as it will be, the eosfl haven't stymied any progress in this instance for me.

I’m not for a moment suggesting this was the EoSFL’s intention by rejecting any application made by Livingston United, they have applied their rules and deadline absolutely fairly. However, if joining the EoSFL is part of a plan to regenerate and grow the Station Park club then that rejection has indeed stymied (put back if you prefer) their ambition for a year, no matter how you slice and dice it.

[Dev]

Does anyone-else think that it is utterly negative and perverse for, allegedly, anyone at the SFA to suggest that accepting an April 2020 application to join the pyramid for 2020/21 is unacceptable given this Covid-19 crisis?

The SFA is supposed to be in support of the pyramid and of Junior clubs switching to the pyramid? 

Who cares about past battles with the Juniors. Move on!

 

[gaz5]

Does anyone-else think that it is utterly negative and perverse for, allegedly, anyone at the SFA to suggest that accepting an April 2020 application to join the pyramid for 2020/21 is unacceptable given this Covid-19 crisis?
The SFA is supposed to be in support of the pyramid and of Junior clubs switching to the pyramid? 
Who cares about past battles with the Juniors. Move on!
 

TBH Dev, as much as I don't mind either way, I don't see how anyone could claim that Covid has been any hindrance to any application to the EoS.

Whoever the applicant club is has had at least 2 years to do whatever due diligence was required and the lockdown didn't start till the week before the EoS deadline.

The rights and wrongs of the deadline aside, it was missed (reportedly by quite some distance) and that's got nothing to do with the current crisis.

You have to draw a line somewhere and the line has been well publicised for the entire season.

I don't see this as an EoS issue/mis-step in any way, as was said above, if as it's being reported their were no justifiable exceptional circumstances. Covid, if that was used, would be opportunistic in my view.

Would probably fit with the rest of Scottish football if that were the case right enough. [emoji1787]

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Black & Red Socks said:

I don’t see anyone suggesting that the late application was an intentional move to further such a narrative, which is how the wording of the above comes across? Rather, the rejection may be used by others within the staunch West Lothian Junior community to further that very narrative.

Just read my wording back, you are right thats what I meant. English is my first language too  I was meaning others may use it to further their own narrative, not the club who applied.

Edited April 29, 2020 by Guest

[Guest]

54 minutes ago, Sidney Lumet said:

I’m not for a moment suggesting this was the EoSFL’s intention by rejecting any application made by Livingston United, they have applied their rules and deadline absolutely fairly. However, if joining the EoSFL is part of a plan to regenerate and grow the Station Park club then that rejection has indeed stymied (put back if you prefer) their ambition for a year, no matter how you slice and dice it.

I get it, its hard for the club, particularly now they have new incumbents. However they now have an opportunity to use the time and get things in order for an assault on the eos next season, albeit at tier 8.

Edited April 29, 2020 by Guest

[honestman54]

1 hour ago, Sidney Lumet said:

I’m not for a moment suggesting this was the EoSFL’s intention by rejecting any application made by Livingston United, they have applied their rules and deadline absolutely fairly. However, if joining the EoSFL is part of a plan to regenerate and grow the Station Park club then that rejection has indeed stymied (put back if you prefer) their ambition for a year, no matter how you slice and dice it.

Then the club should have applied within the deadline, its not difficult!

[Marten]

Even though it's a shame for Livingston United, I fully understand the decision of the EoS. The SFA were already not happy with previous late applicants being accepted. With the WoS currently being set up plus everything else going on in football, they don't want to get annoy the SFA more.

[sniffer]

I see the sos leagues deadline is 30-04-20 why are the leagues different ?

[teamfinderscot]

I looked at the thread regarding the livi application. I totally agree with deadlines etc, and no favouritism as it’s my old club. But I have since spoken to one of the committee members at the club and he had been in really poor health and also this has been made even harder for the aging committee to have a meeting with the covid situation. I wouldn’t give anyone a hard time for not accepting them as deadlines are deadlines, but after seeing some of the reasons their application was late, I certainly would maybe look to reconsider, I think should one WL team go there’s more chance the rest would follow suit either this season or next etc. Not only to represent the pyramid better, but they were top of super league before the break so I see them as a good addition, and could help push on the quality of the conferences further. I understand that it’s only unless exceptional circumstances that applications are accepted, the secretary receiving specialist treatment down south for his condition is understandable, also I know the rest of the committee are not really active on social media and technology like a lot of other clubs, which is really due to the fact of their age. As sniffer pointed out as I was writing this, I’m surprised the sos has a different deadline as they answer to sfa also. I’m not slating or telling anyone what to do in the association, I just was curious as I am with all football things and many others on here , I just asked a few questions and got some answers.

I loved playing east of Scotland when I did and can fully understand a club wanting to move, with all that’s on offer.

[Che Dail]

13 minutes ago, teamfinderscot said:

I looked at the thread regarding the livi application. I totally agree with deadlines etc, and no favouritism as it’s my old club. But I have since spoken to one of the committee members at the club and he had been in really poor health and also this has been made even harder for the aging committee to have a meeting with the covid situation. I wouldn’t give anyone a hard time for not accepting them as deadlines are deadlines, but after seeing some of the reasons their application was late, I certainly would maybe look to reconsider, I think should one WL team go there’s more chance the rest would follow suit either this season or next etc. Not only to represent the pyramid better, but they were top of super league before the break so I see them as a good addition, and could help push on the quality of the conferences further. I understand that it’s only unless exceptional circumstances that applications are accepted, the secretary receiving specialist treatment down south for his condition is understandable, also I know the rest of the committee are not really active on social media and technology like a lot of other clubs, which is really due to the fact of their age. As sniffer pointed out as I was writing this, I’m surprised the sos has a different deadline as they answer to sfa also. I’m not slating or telling anyone what to do in the association, I just was curious as I am with all football things and many others on here , I just asked a few questions and got some answers.

I loved playing east of Scotland when I did and can fully understand a club wanting to move, with all that’s on offer.

From other posts it sounds like the stumbling block might just be the potential repercussions from the SFA (and SJFA).

Given the application is a month late maybe Livingston need to put the work in and get a letter of support from the SFA and an endorsement from the SJFA before the EoS would be willing to look at the application.

Otherwise, accepting the application now may just lead to conflict with the other bodies.

As a volunteer led organisation managing a significant number of clubs, in the middle of a world pandemic,  the EoS League and Assoc probably don't want (and certainly don't need) the extra hassle.

[FairWeatherFan]

1 hour ago, sniffer said:

I see the sos leagues deadline is 30-04-20 why are the leagues different ?

 

48 minutes ago, teamfinderscot said:

 I’m surprised the sos has a different deadline as they answer to sfa also.

Sorry to hear about the Livingston secretary. Hope they and everyone else are doing well considering the circumstances.

Just on the point about why the SoSFL and EoSFL have different application deadlines, they're just different leagues. Different leagues have different rules. The EoSFL set 31st March as a deadline. The SoSFL have April 30th as a deadline. The Highland League don't technically have a deadline for example. Its just a case of sticking to their league constitution that might cause issues with the SFA.

The EoSFL consititution isn't online.

However this is how the SoSFL phrase it:

 

And the Highland League:

Edited April 29, 2020 by FairWeatherFan

[teamfinderscot]

Sorry to hear about the Livingston secretary. Hope they and everyone else are doing well considering the circumstances.
Just on the point about why the SoSFL and EoSFL have different application deadlines, they're just different leagues. Different leagues have different rules. The EoSFL set 31st March as a deadline. The SoSFL have April 30th as a deadline. The Highland League don't technically have a deadline for example. Its just a case of sticking to their league constitution that might cause issues with the SFA.
The EoSFL consititution isn't online.
However this is how the SoSFL phrase it:

And the Highland League:

Definitely, cheers for clearing that up. It’s understandable why they stick to constitution anyway.

[FairWeatherFan]

5 minutes ago, teamfinderscot said:

Definitely, cheers for clearing that up. It’s understandable why they stick to constitution anyway.

I realise I snipped the wrong section of the SoSFL constitution. My fault multitasking and not proofreading.