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Polling: 2017 General Election, Council Elections and Independence

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George Robertson: "Devolution will kill independence stone dead".

Twenty odd years of devolution later: Of folk who became adults at the time of devolution or later, about 80% support independence.

Oh George...

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Edited by Gordon EF

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George Robertson: "Devolution will kill independence stone dead".
Twenty odd years of devolution later: Of folk who became adults at the time of devolution or later, about 80% support independence.
Oh George...
4IOt.gif&key=3561db26895f481dad12ab7e1891f51e76b42df86afbfdcb593cf70e89b15929
Oh George

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1 hour ago, BFTD said:

Slightly creased at the idea of someone who talks about gender-benders and being forced to suck cock being put off independence by people on the internet using harsh language  :lol:

I certainly am put off the SNP with the GRA.

I appreciate the SNP are separate from the independence movement but this science defying stuff is not to my liking at all.

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10 hours ago, Dawson Park Boy said:

I certainly am put off the SNP with the GRA.

I appreciate the SNP are separate from the independence movement but this science defying stuff is not to my liking at all.

There is absolutely nothing about the amendments to the GRA that defies science.

Who is it you think is diagnosing gender dysphoria right now? Homeopathists? 

Edited by Gordon EF

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32 minutes ago, Dawson Park Boy said:

I certainly am put off the SNP with the GRA.

I appreciate the SNP are separate from the independence movement but this science defying stuff is not to my liking at all.

Are you seriously suggesting that if the SNP did a u-turn on the GRA that you would consider supporting independence?

I find that hard to believe.

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15 minutes ago, lichtgilphead said:

Are you seriously suggesting that if the SNP did a u-turn on the GRA that you would consider supporting independence?

I find that hard to believe.

I'm sure he has a well documented pro-SNP voting record before he ever heard of the GRA.

Unionists, it's OK to criticise the SNP or independence without pretending that you're giving serious consideration to voting for them if only it wasn't for absolutely everything about them. I'm never going to vote Tory and I'm never going to vote for the union. It's OK to admit that. You won't be taken any less seriously because nobody takes the charade seriously to begin with.

Edited by Gordon EF

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The vast majority of Yoons are weird they try to deny their stupidly blinkered staunchness by kidding on they can't support Indy on minor stuff and try to conflate it. I don't trust them on the Trans debate or why do I have to pay for baby boxes when my weans are all up or that Salmond I just don't trust him, he has an auld wife or that wee nippy she's just too nippy. I don't mind folk who admit they are happy with the status quo because they are doing well but that fleg55 lot can gtf.

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I have never voted SNP in my life and, realistically, am not likely to.

However, I’m not so set in my ways that I can’t look at the independence issue as a possibility. 
One of my sons is an independence supporter, doesn’t like the SNP, too lefty,but votes for them.

I find I’m getting tired of all this constant warring over independence and would love to see Holyrood filled with politicians from parties representing a variety of political perspectives as you find in most countries. We’re very like Northern Ireland where everything is seen through the prism of unionism or republicanism.

Surely there must be a constitutional solution which satisfies unionists and nationalists alike without causing a massive upheaval.

Perhaps some kind of federalism could be the answer along US lines?

Ill return to this theme later as I have an online bridge match coming up.

All ideas welcomed.

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12 hours ago, Glen Sannox said:

Vaccines, furlough and currency and are massively important though, and you can rest assured the SNP will not have the answers to these impending questions. I think you might be underestimating “the broad shoulders of the UK” card, that will be relentlessly played.

I'll answer on the currency, it's already been explained a couple of weeks ago but anyway;

The Scottish Government established the Scottish National Investment Bank in November 2020 with funds of £2 Billion, small I know but it will grow.

The reason for this is that it is an absolute requisite, among others, and as per the Copenhagen Criteria to have a functioning and resilient market economy a which by necessity require a National Bank.

So that Scottish Bank on breaking away from the uk would be legally capable of producing it's own currency, whether that would be the Scottish Pound, as the Irish did with the Punt, or the Dollar who knows.

Btw the application for rejoining the EU, Article 49, also includes the Copenhagen Criteria.

So on currency the SNP are ahead of that argument.

I didn't want to mention it but countries with similar populations to Scotland such as Ireland, Denmark and Norway all have similar beneficial schemes as the uk furlough, or did you honestly think that their governments would let their citizens starve? So if they can mange a type of furlough Scotland could, just as westminster has done an Independent Scotland would be more than capable of borrowing money against our vast natural resources. 

 

  • Economic: a functioning and resilient market economy

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16 hours ago, Gordon EF said:

That demographic breakdown is absolutely brutal for the future of the UK.

Yes is absolutely cruising it in the working age population.

I really don't mean this in a disrespectful or offensive way but statistically, you could see something like 20-25% of folk who'd vote No today being dead in 10/15 years time. Even if we don't win a referendum in the next few years, I just don't see how the union can survive those kind of demographic issues.

I think the younger generation aren't absolutely obsessed with WW2 and the 'Rule Britannia, Blitz Spirit' shite that the boomer, no-voting,'if we go indy ah'll lose my penshin' demographic are.

I personally know folk in their 60's who voted no in 2014 due to the fear of them losing their pension.  Utter madness.

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Is there anywhere that tracks support for independence by age groups across a long period of time?

I've read some folk on here saying it doesn't matter that the vast majority of people under 40 support independence as they'll switch to unionism as they age and I'm sure some will, but when I was a lot younger I don't really remember there being such high support for independence among my peers. The SNP were viewed as fringe weirdos and I remember teasing guys at school who were pro independence. Is there any data to look at that?

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21 minutes ago, Dawson Park Boy said:

I have never voted SNP in my life and, realistically, am not likely to.

However, I’m not so set in my ways that I can’t look at the independence issue as a possibility. 
One of my sons is an independence supporter, doesn’t like the SNP, too lefty,but votes for them.

I find I’m getting tired of all this constant warring over independence and would love to see Holyrood filled with politicians from parties representing a variety of political perspectives as you find in most countries. We’re very like Northern Ireland where everything is seen through the prism of unionism or republicanism.

Surely there must be a constitutional solution which satisfies unionists and nationalists alike without causing a massive upheaval.

Perhaps some kind of federalism could be the answer along US lines?

Ill return to this theme later as I have an online bridge match coming up.

All ideas welcomed.

We'd all stop arguing about independence after independence.

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4 minutes ago, TheScarf said:

I think the younger generation aren't absolutely obsessed with WW2 and the 'Rule Britannia, Blitz Spirit' shite that the boomer, no-voting,'if we go indy ah'll lose my penshin' demographic are.

I personally know folk in their 60's who voted no in 2014 due to the fear of them losing their pension.  Utter madness.

Boomers and older were also all reared on this working-class cringe stuff. Your betters have plummy accents and went to private schools. Aspire to that or accept your place. I'm certain that plays a part.

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12 hours ago, lichtgilphead said:

Are you seriously suggesting that if the SNP did a u-turn on the GRA that you would consider supporting independence?

I find that hard to believe.

I think what he's saying is that he hates trans people even more than he hates independence. 

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4 minutes ago, GordonS said:

I think what he's saying is that he hates trans people even more than he hates independence. 

I think what he's saying is that he a bigoted transphobic arsehole who should have been binned off here long ago

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29 minutes ago, Day of the Lords said:

I think what he's saying is that he a bigoted transphobic arsehole who should have been binned off here long ago

I’m just saying that I don’t believe in self identification.

 Nothing wrong in changing sex if you have had drugs and operations and your birth certificate has been amended.

However, I don’t think blokes can just decide to be women.

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3 minutes ago, Dawson Park Boy said:

I’m just saying that I don’t believe in self identification.

 Nothing wrong in changing sex if you have had drugs and operations and your birth certificate has been amended.

However, I don’t think blokes can just decide to be women.

You think "gender benders" is acceptable. Off you pop boomer. 

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I have never voted SNP in my life and, realistically, am not likely to.
However, I’m not so set in my ways that I can’t look at the independence issue as a possibility. 
One of my sons is an independence supporter, doesn’t like the SNP, too lefty,but votes for them.
I find I’m getting tired of all this constant warring over independence and would love to see Holyrood filled with politicians from parties representing a variety of political perspectives as you find in most countries. We’re very like Northern Ireland where everything is seen through the prism of unionism or republicanism.
Surely there must be a constitutional solution which satisfies unionists and nationalists alike without causing a massive upheaval.
Perhaps some kind of federalism could be the answer along US lines?
Ill return to this theme later as I have an online bridge match coming up.
All ideas welcomed.

Ah the F word! The only way federalism would work in the U.K. would be to split England up into regions and I don’t think that there is much of an appetite for that down south.
I would happily have taken Devo Max back in 2014 if it had been an option but now feel only independence will resolve the constitutional issue.

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