Polling: 2017 General Election, Council Elections and Independence

[Nigel]

It's frightening how many arseholes might vote Tory. 

Especially folk that don't have a fucking halfpenny to rub together!!

The Tories are the party which best represent the social and cultural beliefs of the traditional working classes. 

Labour and the SNP spout liberal, university indoctrinated, woke bollocks.

 

I know it is hard for you to comprehend, but considerations other than "what personally benefits my financial sutuation" are of equal Importance to vast swathes of people.

 

 

 

[John Lambies Doos]

The Tories are the party which best represent the social and cultural beliefs of the traditional working classes. Labour and the SNP spout liberal, university indoctrinated, woke bollocks.
 
I know it is hard for you to comprehend, but considerations other than "what personally benefits my financial sutuation" are of equal Importance to vast swathes of people.
 
 
 

Spoken like a true Nigel

[D Angelo Barksdale]

Ah yes, the traditional working class beliefs of fox hunting, noncing and selling off public industries.

[Paco]

Labour and Liberals lending their votes, plus the absence of the Brexit Party won’t be helping.

Think that’s unfair. Easy to forget 38% of Scotland voted for Brexit, and the Tories in many instances are the only pro-Brexit party here.

[D Angelo Barksdale]

1 hour ago, MixuFixit said:

You strike me as the kind of man who would use words like globalism to convey a very specific meaning.

An absolute certainty he's used the term Cultural Marxism.

[Granny Danger]

28 minutes ago, Henderson to deliver ..... said:

Ah yes, the traditional working class beliefs of fox hunting, noncing and selling off public industries.

I know you’re being flippant.

Sadly many “working class people” buy into the myth that they the “upper classes” are better at running things.

They are the sort of folk who are annoyed if their neighbour has a slightly better car but don’t mind hedge fund managers having a collection of vintage Lamborghinis.

[NotThePars]

All the polling is saying is that it's time for the Lib Dems to think of the country for once and stand aside for the Labour Party.

[tbsouth]

I find it incredible that Swinson is still 2/9 on to retain her seat....meanwhile anyone looking for a decent bet, turnout over 70.01% is currently 11/4

[Elixir]

It can be dressed up however you want, but if little changes up here from 2017 then the SNP will know fine well that these numbers are not good regarding another referendum. Support for independence may have increased, but it is not enough to be confident of victory, and rushing into another vote could be an utter disaster. If this Brexit shit show won't make people want it, what will? The fallout and massive Tory majority? Waiting 10-20 years and hoping that once the boomers die out there is a fundamental shift? Or will people simply continue to get comfortable?

Maybe battered wife syndrome and rabid British nationalism simply supersedes most people's desire for a relationship with other European countries. The SNP are going to win again, but for me the numbers just aren't good enough, especially when you consider what has happened in the last three and a half years and the platform they are standing on. Any pro-independence/EU Labour, Liberal or Green voters need to wake up to the choice we face in Scotland as the rest of the UK is a total lost cause that is way too far gone.

Edited November 24, 2019 by Elixir

[pandarilla]

It can be dressed up however you want, but if little changes up here from 2017 then the SNP will know fine well that these numbers are not good regarding another referendum. Support for independence may have increased, but it is not enough to be confident of victory, and rushing into another vote could be an utter disaster. If this Brexit shit show and all the fallout won't make people want it, what ever will? The fallout and massive Tory majority? Waiting 10-20 years and hoping that once the boomers die out there is a fundamental shift?
Maybe battered wife syndrome and rabid British nationalism simply supersedes most people's desire for a relationship with other European countries. The SNP are going to win again, but for me the numbers just aren't good enough, especially when you consider what has happened in the last three and a half years and the platform they are standing on. Any pro-independence Labour, Liberals or Greens need to wake up.

I agree with your point about tactics, as this isn't an easy play for sturgeon.

We have to start being less critical about no voters and their intention though. The Tory guy got slaughtered a few posts back but he kind of has a point (although I wouldn't agree with Tory values being working class).

Most people are decent people, and aren't voting for selfish reasons. A lot of folk but into the old media narratives, not because of the big bad media but because it's difficult to open your brain up to very new ideas and thinking. The Labour manifesto is very radical and people are generally resistant to massive change. The same applies to independence.

[ICTChris]

Result in the last GE
SNP - 36.9%
Con - 28.6%
Lab - 27.1%
LD - 6.8%

Poll
SNP - 40%
Con - 28%
Lab - 20%
LD - 11%

I think the 2010 GE saw every seat in Scotland stay the same. What are the odds on the same thing happening again?

[Colkitto]

52 minutes ago, Elixir said:

It can be dressed up however you want, but if little changes up here from 2017 then the SNP will know fine well that these numbers are not good regarding another referendum. Support for independence may have increased, but it is not enough to be confident of victory, and rushing into another vote could be an utter disaster. If this Brexit shit show won't make people want it, what will? The fallout and massive Tory majority? Waiting 10-20 years and hoping that once the boomers die out there is a fundamental shift? Or will people simply continue to get comfortable?

Maybe battered wife syndrome and rabid British nationalism simply supersedes most people's desire for a relationship with other European countries. The SNP are going to win again, but for me the numbers just aren't good enough, especially when you consider what has happened in the last three and a half years and the platform they are standing on. Any pro-independence/EU Labour, Liberal or Green voters need to wake up to the choice we face in Scotland as the rest of the UK is a total lost cause that is way too far gone.

Yes is polling at 49% in that poll. 

We may as Yes supporters want it to be higher, but to say the numbers are not good regarding another referendum is just ludicrous.   

[BFTD]

1 hour ago, tbsouth said:

I find it incredible that Swinson is still 2/9 on to retain her seat....meanwhile anyone looking for a decent bet, turnout over 70.01% is currently 11/4

Turnout could be interesting for this one. The Brexit mob are obviously heavily invested in getting out to vote, but there must be a lot of non-Tory voters seeing these polls and thinking it's a done deal, especially the youngsters.

It's a terrible way to think, but unfortunately it still seems that a decent slice of folk don't turn up if they think their team's about to take a hiding.

[pandarilla]

I

Yes is polling at 49% in that poll. 
We may as Yes supporters want it to be higher, but to say the numbers are not good regarding another referendum is just ludicrous.   

It needs to be repeatedly polling at 52-55 I'd say.

As annoying as it is we do have to respect the result and ensure that a clear change has occurred before going again.

Anything else is a massive gamble. I'd still support independence whatever the strategy but I think the process does matter to a large chunk of the electorate.

[trainspotter]

1 hour ago, NotThePars said:

All the polling is saying is that it's time for the Lib Dems to think of the country for once and stand aside for the Labour Party.

Swinson’s enthusiasm for alliances is restricted to constituencies where the Lib Dems are the beneficiaries (e.g Pembrokeshire)

[BFTD]

1 minute ago, pandarilla said:

It needs to be repeatedly polling at 52-55 I'd say.

As annoying as it is we do have to respect the result and ensure that a clear change has occurred before going again.

Anything else is a massive gamble. I'd still support independence whatever the strategy but I think the process does matter to a large chunk of the electorate.

Anyone thinking about pulling the trigger on another independence referendum should have Quebec at the forefront of their minds.

The more important issue is establishing the right of the Scottish parliament to decide on future referenda. That's a position that's very difficult to argue against, unless the argument is "but there's a chance that they might win". If there's never another majority in favour of an independence referendum, it'll be something we've decided, rather than having it imposed on us.

[ICTJohnboy]

So the whole Tory election strategy will be based on delivering Brexit by January 31.

I know that won't cut much ice in Scotland but unfortunately I get the distinct impression it will get him over the line in Englandshire.

[BFTD]

6 minutes ago, ICTJohnboy said:

So the whole Tory election strategy will be based on delivering Brexit by January 31.

It'll be nice to put that "I know what I voted for" stuff to bed.

To be replaced by years of "this isn't what I voted for!" from practically everyone involved.

[BFTD]

Could someone explain what "the social and cultural beliefs of the traditional working classes" are, please?

Mixu's been hinting at it, but I've a feeling I know why Nigel wasn't keen to go into details about what he thinks they are.

[ICTJohnboy]

BJ promising to be carbon neutral by 2050 and Corbyn neutral by Christmas!

 

 

Edited November 24, 2019 by ICTJohnboy