Polling: 2017 General Election, Council Elections and Independence

[GTG_03]

20 minutes ago, welshbairn said:

I'm always tempted to tell them how much I want to vote for them but it will be difficult to get to the polling station with my sore knee. After the deadline for postal votes naturally. A car space taken up, every little helps! Never done it though..

Do it! My lifetime SNP supporting and voting mate gets a lift from his local Tory branch every election.

He takes great delight in the tories chauffering him around to vote for someone else. 

[Sherrif John Bunnell]

Starmer doing a great job...

 

[speckled tangerine]

Just now, Sherrif John Bunnell said:

Starmer doing a great job...

 

But, but, but......

Just one more push.

[doulikefish]

Another good poll for the good guys

[G51]

Westminster voting intention: LAB: 42% (+5) CON: 37% (-3) LDEM: 8% (-) GRN: 5% (-)

22 - 28 Oct

Taken before Corbyn's suspension yesterday.

Worrying that an enormous 79% of people are pledging to vote for the Tories.

 

[Crùbag]

Indy at 56% according to new poll. SNP and Greens on 60% for Holyrood. Boris Johnson is 'loathed' in Scotland... who knew?

https://www.politico.eu/article/loathing-of-boris-johnson-fueling-surge-in-support-for-scottish-independence-poll/
 

Quote

 

The U.K. government currently says the matter of Scottish independence was “settled” in 2014. When former Prime Minister Theresa May faced calls for a second referendum during her spell in office she deflected, insisting “now is not the time,” a stance which James Johnson, founder of J.L. Partners, said was backed by No. 10’s own polling of Scottish opinion at the time. 

Now, he said, the picture had “dramatically changed” and was “bleak” for unionists. 

“It is hard not to look at these figures and assume the Union is doomed. It is certainly the gravest situation the Unionist cause has found itself in in recent history,” James Johnson said. 

 

 

 

[topcat(The most tip top)]

I'm always tempted to tell them how much I want to vote for them but it will be difficult to get to the polling station with my sore knee. After the deadline for postal votes naturally. A car space taken up, every little helps! Never done it though..

My Granny got the Tories to take her to the polling booth to vote Labour

Partly because of your “one space taken up” logic but mainly because Tories tend to have nicer cars

[John Lambies Doos]

This is why we must have this referendum whilst Johnson is in charge.

[Caledonian1]

7 hours ago, G51 said:

Westminster voting intention: LAB: 42% (+5) CON: 37% (-3) LDEM: 8% (-) GRN: 5% (-)

22 - 28 Oct

Taken before Corbyn's suspension yesterday.

Worrying that an enormous 79% of people are pledging to vote for the Tories.

 

My calculations make that 87%

[git-intae-thum]

5 hours ago, John Lambies Doos said:

This is why we must have this referendum whilst Johnson is in charge.

This is exactly why Johnson is not going to grant any Section 30 powers to hold a fair referendum even if the SNP achieve their umpteenth "mandate" next year.

It  will never be granted when polling and circumstances favour  independence.

If to continue asking for permission is really the current SNP leadership's only strategy, then it's laughably naive and tbh irresponsible given the hopes if the majority of Scots rest with them.

 

 

[DeeTillEhDeh]

This is exactly why Johnson is not going to grant any Section 30 powers to hold a fair referendum even if the SNP achieve their umpteenth "mandate" next year.
It  will never be granted when polling and circumstances favour  independence.
If to continue asking for permission is really the current SNP leadership's only strategy, then it's laughably naive and tbh irresponsible given the hopes if the majority of Scots rest with them.
 
 

Which was the whole point of the Referendum Bill.

If the SNP/Greens do win a majority and Boris says "No" then they need to test the bill through the Courts - even Cherry has said as much.

[John Lambies Doos]

Which was the whole point of the Referendum Bill.

If the SNP/Greens do win a majority and Boris says "No" then they need to test the bill through the Courts - even Cherry has said as much.

Peacefully take to the streets. An absolute affront to democracy

[GordonS]

7 hours ago, git-intae-thum said:

This is exactly why Johnson is not going to grant any Section 30 powers to hold a fair referendum even if the SNP achieve their umpteenth "mandate" next year.

It  will never be granted when polling and circumstances favour  independence.

If to continue asking for permission is really the current SNP leadership's only strategy, then it's laughably naive and tbh irresponsible given the hopes if the majority of Scots rest with them.

 

 

I agree, but the alternatives are exactly what the unionist want the pro-independence side to do - lose their collective shit, get angry, talk about UDI and civil disobedience. The folk that have just moved from No to Yes have supported independence for about 5 minutes, so none of the previous arguments ever persuaded them. Not indyref, not Brexit, not Boris becoming Prime Minister. The decisive factor seems to be that coronavirus has led them to believe that Scotland would handle the big stuff better than England.

They can easily be driven away by what they perceive as extremism. They can be lost as quickly as they arrived.

It's not a coincidence that support for independence in Catalonia has fallen since the Falangists went around cracking skulls. The middle ground are very moderate and fearful, and as much as you might want them to get justifiably angry, it's more likely that they'll think it's not worth the trouble.

I don't know what the best tactic is but I know it's not what the harder-line pro-independence folk want.

[Benjamin_Nevis]

5 hours ago, GordonS said:

I agree, but the alternatives are exactly what the unionist want the pro-independence side to do - lose their collective shit, get angry, talk about UDI and civil disobedience. The folk that have just moved from No to Yes have supported independence for about 5 minutes, so none of the previous arguments ever persuaded them. Not indyref, not Brexit, not Boris becoming Prime Minister. The decisive factor seems to be that coronavirus has led them to believe that Scotland would handle the big stuff better than England.

They can easily be driven away by what they perceive as extremism. They can be lost as quickly as they arrived.

It's not a coincidence that support for independence in Catalonia has fallen since the Falangists went around cracking skulls. The middle ground are very moderate and fearful, and as much as you might want them to get justifiably angry, it's more likely that they'll think it's not worth the trouble.

I don't know what the best tactic is but I know it's not what the harder-line pro-independence folk want.

Spot on. The Yes Da's who want to bin Nicola Sturgeon because independence isn't happening quickly enough are the sorts of fucking idiots who will end up costing us an eventual Yes vote. None of them ever have a solution of course, beyond MARE NEEDS TO BE HAPPENING. 

[Benjamin_Nevis]

personified:
 

Dear god [emoji23]

[NotThePars]

"Scotland is an ancient nation and we are a people with the absolute right of self-determination as defined in Article 1 (ii) of the UN Charter. That right of self-determination in international law is inalienable. It cannot be constrained by the domestic legislation of any subsuming state, as indeed the UK government argued successfully before the International Court of Justice in the case of Kosovo.

Boris Johnson can have no veto over the right of the people of Scotland to choose their own path. The possibility should not be entertained. It is an affront to international law."

You have to give him credit for playing to his credulous base with that opening salvo though. Treating international relations like a Paradox title.

[alta-pete]

Forgive me for leaping in without having read previous posts, but.

Has anybody yet ventured the idea - give NS’ undeniably huge positive approval rating - of launching the (suitably renamed) SNP as a national UK party with her at the head?

That way we don't need independence but we can instead rule across the four nations from Edinburgh. Labour becomes even more of an irrelevance and the Tories start mobilising to gain independence for the Home Counties. 

Just an idea...

[Granny Danger]

1 minute ago, alta-pete said:

Forgive me for leaping in without having read previous posts, but.

Has anybody yet ventured the idea - give NS’ undeniably huge positive approval rating - of launching the (suitably renamed) SNP as a national UK party with her at the head?

That way we don't need independence but we can instead rule across the four nations from Edinburgh. Labour becomes even more of an irrelevance and the Tories start mobilising to gain independence for the Home Counties. 

Just an idea...

^^^^ desperate for a Sevco to play in the EPL.

[LongTimeLurker]

1 hour ago, NotThePars said:

"Scotland is an ancient nation and we are a people with the absolute right of self-determination as defined in Article 1 (ii) of the UN Charter. That right of self-determination in international law is inalienable....

Unfortunately idealistic declarations like that don't mean much in practice. For example, how's that going for the inhabitants of Iraqi Kurdistan, Nagorno Karabakh and Catalonia right now?

Kosovo only became different on that when it suited NATO to cut Serbia down to size after it became too uppity and disruptive for its own good. When Yugoslavia initially started unravelling only the six federal republics were recognised by the international community as having a right to independence within Tito's internal borders and around half of the UN's member states still see it that way and think Kosovo je Srbija.

[BFTD]

1 hour ago, alta-pete said:

Forgive me for leaping in without having read previous posts, but.

Has anybody yet ventured the idea - give NS’ undeniably huge positive approval rating - of launching the (suitably renamed) SNP as a national UK party with her at the head?

That way we don't need independence but we can instead rule across the four nations from Edinburgh. Labour becomes even more of an irrelevance and the Tories start mobilising to gain independence for the Home Counties. 

Just an idea...

It would be tremendous value to briefly pop in to a timeline where the SNP are the UK's biggest party.

The to-do list:

• buy copies of the Express and Mail
• take a swatch at the HYS on pretty much any story
• do a bit of eavesdropping in a random Kentish pub

Spoiler