June 8th General Election

[jmothecat]

jmo - happy to be likened to self-serving, careerist, back-stabbing witch. 

Out of interest what do you disagree with me on with the above couple of comments?

[mjw]

Someone summed it up well on Twitter.
We live in a country where earning 70k doesn't make you rich but buying a Glastonbury ticket does.

[WhiteRoseKillie]

Who said it was based on the last couple of comments? You've been comparing Corbyn's Party unfavourably to Bliar's "project" for months, and all of a sudden you've realised that it might be time to get with the program. Like Harman, Umunna et al., however, you just can't bring yourself to fully support the current leadership. Like harman, you were parroting the "perceived wisdom" that Corbyn was a liability, whereas in actual fact if the PLP had been united we'd now have a thumping majority in WM. I canvassed on policy, not personality, but there is no doubt in my mind that Jeremy has convinced many previously disengaged voters of what some of us have known for years - and you still say "aye, but..." - even though I know you campaigned probably as hard if not harder than I did, you still believe the NL years to be "real Labour". That simply is not, and never was, the case.

[jmothecat]

Who said it was based on the last couple of comments? You've been comparing Corbyn's Party unfavourably to Bliar's "project" for months, and all of a sudden you've realised that it might be time to get with the program. Like Harman, Umunna et al., however, you just can't bring yourself to fully support the current leadership. Like harman, you were parroting the "perceived wisdom" that Corbyn was a liability, whereas in actual fact if the PLP had been united we'd now have a thumping majority in WM. I canvassed on policy, not personality, but there is no doubt in my mind that Jeremy has convinced many previously disengaged voters of what some of us have known for years - and you still say "aye, but..." - even though I know you campaigned probably as hard if not harder than I did, you still believe the NL years to be "real Labour". That simply is not, and never was, the case.

I don't support Corbyn, he did better than I had expected him to, but I still want him replaced. What's that got to do with my recent comments though? I'm attacking a vacuous attack from some on the right. I also don't believe we would have won the election had moderates done things differently. I still can't see us winning an election under Corbyn. It seems to have been conveniently forgotten that we lost.

[Granny Danger]

5 hours ago, jmothecat said:

 

I don't support Corbyn, he did better than I had expected him to, but I still want him replaced. What's that got to do with my recent comments though? I'm attacking a vacuous attack from some on the right. I also don't believe we would have won the election had moderates done things differently. I still can't see us winning an election under Corbyn. It seems to have been conveniently forgotten that we lost.

 

Why don't you just f**k off and join the Lib Dems?  You have far more in common with them than you do with a party based on socialism.

[jmothecat]

Why don't you just f**k off and join the Lib Dems?  You have far more in common with them than you do with a party based on socialism.

I'm not a liberal, they will never win an election, they needlessly propped up a Tory government which causes unnecessary pain to many people, and I agree with most Labour policies and ideals even if I don't agree with a lot of what the current leader and his faction supports.

[ayrmad]

7 hours ago, WhiteRoseKillie said:

Ah, wee jmo - the Harriet Harman of P&B. 

(FAO jmo - that's not a compliment, btw)

It is if you're a fucking minger.

[BFTD]

@jmothecat - this is just curiosity, I'm not going to slag you about the answer one way or the other. Srsly.

Do you dislike Corbyn because of his policies and/or political philosophy, or because you think he's unelectable? And do you actually like Harriet Harman as a Labour politician?

[Crùbag]

This.

 

[jmothecat]

[mention=20211]jmothecat[/mention] - this is just curiosity, I'm not going to slag you about the answer one way or the other. Srsly.
Do you dislike Corbyn because of his policies and/or political philosophy, or because you think he's unelectable? And do you actually like Harriet Harman as a Labour politician?

Both. I think Labour's policies at the election were quite good (they were fairly mainstream Labour ones rather than Corbynite ones) but I don't like a lot of Corbyn's beliefs. I struggle to see him getting elected, whilst he did better than I expected he would I still think there are a few things that concern me regarding how electable Labour are. I'm feeling a little uneasy by some of our post-election tactics. It seems to be 'let's say things that sound great but may not strictly speaking be great'.

[Bedford White]

On 24/06/2017 at 22:22, jmothecat said:

 

It can't be that much of a surprise that a lot of his support comes from the right-on middle class can it? Look at where Labour's swing was highest, university seats, places with middle class, remain voting, university educated people. The swing was lower in working class, traditional Labour heartlands. Corbyn knows who his supporters are and he's speaking to them effectively.

 

Didn't realise places like Aberavon and Bradford that saw 20% increases in Labour vote were now classed as middle class. A lot of PLP MPs who had given up holding their seats in marginal heartland seats now sit on huge majorities. Likewise others in areas not even Blair could win have elected Labour MPs. Even long given up areas like Cornwall and Devon see Labour in winnable second place at the next GE. The times are changing and those on the right in Progress don't like it as Lord Sainsbury will no longer fund them.

[Ivo den Bieman]

Top trolling by Paul Mason of Progress (the Blairite pressure group / jmo wing of the Labour party, likely to collapse now David Sainsbury has withdrawn his funding)

[Bedford White]

7 minutes ago, Ivo den Bieman said:

Top trolling by Paul Mason of Progress (the Blairite pressure group / jmo wing of the Labour party, likely to collapse now David Sainsbury has withdrawn his funding)

I remember working with Richard Angell (to the left of Mason-not literally) when he was Bedfordshire member of the youth parliament when I was a Youth Service manager. Enough said.

[Ivo den Bieman]

ach well, Progress now reduced to begging for money on twitter. They're washed-up

[jmothecat]

I remember working with Richard Angell (to the left of Mason-not literally) when he was Bedfordshire member of the youth parliament when I was a Youth Service manager. Enough said.

Richard is lovely.

[Bedford White]

8 minutes ago, jmothecat said:

 

Richard is lovely.

 

Aye. I will pass on your regards on Saturday. I'm sure I will see him on the march against austerity and cuts in the smoke.

[jmothecat]

Top trolling by Paul Mason of Progress (the Blairite pressure group / jmo wing of the Labour party, likely to collapse now David Sainsbury has withdrawn his funding)

Jesus Paul Mason is an idiot. Why does he want moderates to leave the party? He's actually calling on loyal Labour members (y'know, the ones who didn't leave when their chosen faction weren't in control) to leave the party simply because we disagree with the specific direction we are going at the moment. Talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face.

[pandarilla]

Jesus Paul Mason is an idiot. Why does he want moderates to leave the party? He's actually calling on loyal Labour members (y'know, the ones who didn't leave when their chosen faction weren't in control) to leave the party simply because we disagree with the specific direction we are going at the moment. Talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face.

Mason was spot on in that clip.

The people in that room have lost their grip on the labour party. They've lost fair and square.

Back him, or get the f**k out.

[Bedford White]

8 minutes ago, jmothecat said:

 

Jesus Paul Mason is an idiot. Why does he want moderates to leave the party? He's actually calling on loyal Labour members (y'know, the ones who didn't leave when their chosen faction weren't in control) to leave the party simply because we disagree with the specific direction we are going at the moment. Talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face.

 

Mason's analysis of the GE strategy was spot on. I was getting emails daily asking me to canvass in Gavin Shuker's seat in Luton South, which is solid Labour and not in Bedford which was a Tory marginal. Thankfully I and many others ignored them and we won it back. Labour HQ never believed the Corbyn surge and it cost us seats we could have won if resources had been redirected.

[jmothecat]

Mason was spot on in that clip.

The people in that room have lost their grip on the labour party. They've lost fair and square.

Back him, or get the f**k out.

Why should we? This idea that just because he is the leader we shouldn't disagree with decisions or the direction we are going in is ludicrous. By that logic Corbyn and the left should have left the party during the New Labour era, but they didn't, they argued their case, did what they thought was right and we fought alongside each other. That's what the moderates are doing now. This idea that we should all just follow what the glorious leader thinks or leave the party isn't helpful to anyone. Progress put a lot of effort into campaigning, them leaving the party to self-indulgently create a moderate Labour Party wouldn't help moderates, wouldn't help Corbyn and wouldn't help the people we are fighting to get elected for. Unlike Paul Mason, Jeremy Corbyn sat on the Labour benches alongside comrades with varying different views, the strength of the Labour Party is that we are a broad church, welcoming of people across the left.