Shandon Par Posted March 15, 2017 Share Posted March 15, 2017 The landscape has changed and hopefully some of the no voters from last time will look down south and ask themselves if that's really what they want to be associated with. The weakest in society vilified, fear used as a method of control, helping the rich get richer being portrayed as normal and acceptable. We shouldn't just base our vote on a short term financial uncertainty. The older generation need to trust the youngsters a bit more. Was Apple. Microsoft, or closer to home Rockstar North or BrewDog set up by old guys sitting at home being afraid of the future? No, it was young folk believing in themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnydun Posted March 15, 2017 Share Posted March 15, 2017 They say that this vote causes divisions, I would strongly disagree and say it causes people that have a disliking for one another to come together for the same outcome that they want. For instance it brings together both sets of Dundee teams fans, the Arabs did not let the side down and voted Yes and followed in their better looking, more successful rivals, the Dees. I tip my hat. It also brings together Rangers fans and (most, not all) Aberdonians both being massive shite bags, arm in arm and voting No. Who would of seen that love-in coming? So lets celebrate how this vote brings folks usually divided, together! Thank you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crùbag Posted March 15, 2017 Share Posted March 15, 2017 The whole GERS argument again after poor Kevin Hague's meltdown on Twitter yesterday. http://wingsoverscotland.com/gers-by-economists/ Quote hardcore ultra-Loyalist idiot festival Scotland In Union, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanMc99 Posted March 15, 2017 Share Posted March 15, 2017 1 hour ago, Shandon Par said: The landscape has changed and hopefully some of the no voters from last time will look down south and ask themselves if that's really what they want to be associated with. The weakest in society vilified, fear used as a method of control, helping the rich get richer being portrayed as normal and acceptable. We shouldn't just base our vote on a short term financial uncertainty. The older generation need to trust the youngsters a bit more. Was Apple. Microsoft, or closer to home Rockstar North or BrewDog set up by old guys sitting at home being afraid of the future? No, it was young folk believing in themselves. "BUT WE UR EH PEEPUL" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shandon Par Posted March 15, 2017 Share Posted March 15, 2017 4 minutes ago, DanMc99 said: "BUT WE UR EH PEEPUL" Shut up and eat yer soup ya auld b*****d. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fueradejuego Posted March 15, 2017 Share Posted March 15, 2017 I voted Yes in 2014 probably more with my heart than my head as the economic case simply didn't stack up back then and there were too many unanswered questions. I'm not sure how I'd vote this time around. The key for me will be the Yes campaign producing a comprehensive and robust financial appraisal (as far as can be reasonably expected) that stands up to close scrutiny. I'm not interested in people saying we will be okay or others claiming that we are stronger together etc. That's just all rhetoric and nonsense. I'll vote on the basis of who presents the strongest economic case. Unfortunately that means I'll likely need to do most of the research myself as neither side will present an impartial analysis and that will leave me making a slightly better informed guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanMc99 Posted March 15, 2017 Share Posted March 15, 2017 Just now, Shandon Par said: Shut up and eat yer soup ya auld b*****d. what kind of soup we talking? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanMc99 Posted March 15, 2017 Share Posted March 15, 2017 Just now, fueradejuego said: I voted Yes in 2014 probably more with my heart than my head as the economic case simply didn't stack up back then and there were too many unanswered questions. I'm not sure how I'd vote this time around. The key for me will be the Yes campaign producing a comprehensive and robust financial appraisal (as far as can be reasonably expected) that stands up to close scrutiny. I'm not interested in people saying we will be okay or others claiming that we are stronger together etc. That's just all rhetoric and nonsense. I'll vote on the basis of who presents the strongest economic case. Unfortunately that means I'll likely need to do most of the research myself as neither side will present an impartial analysis and that will leave me making a slightly better informed guess. i've got a rhetorection Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotThePars Posted March 15, 2017 Share Posted March 15, 2017 2 hours ago, Wee Willie said: Guid point. Voting SNP is a means tae an end. Independence - then vote for whoever. Easy peasy. Nah. I'm happy for the coalition to be broad. That guy on here tabling support for independence at the Lib Dem conference sets the cat amongst the pigeons and hopefully the same happens with Labour meaning they can't portray themselves as united against independence. Already people are attacking Corbyn for being lukewarm at best about opposing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shandon Par Posted March 15, 2017 Share Posted March 15, 2017 4 minutes ago, DanMc99 said: what kind of soup we talking? Cock-a-Leekie. Will blend it if you like? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanMc99 Posted March 15, 2017 Share Posted March 15, 2017 Just now, Shandon Par said: Cock-a-Leekie. Will blend it if you like? freaky-Deaky-Cock-a-Leekie , no give me some oxtail Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wee Willie Posted March 15, 2017 Share Posted March 15, 2017 9 minutes ago, NotThePars said: Nah. I'm happy for the coalition to be broad. That guy on here tabling support for independence at the Lib Dem conference sets the cat amongst the pigeons and hopefully the same happens with Labour meaning they can't portray themselves as united against independence. Already people are attacking Corbyn for being lukewarm at best about opposing it. So would I be IF other parties were pro indy. As things stand, only SNP and Greens fit the bill. Ergo vote SNP (or Green) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Booker-T Posted March 15, 2017 Share Posted March 15, 2017 12 hours ago, The_Kincardine said: This is P&B at its finest...casual sectarianism blended with ignorance with an admixture of poor grammar. how is that sectarian? being a *** is a state of mind Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fide Posted March 15, 2017 Author Share Posted March 15, 2017 1 minute ago, Booker-T said: how is that sectarian? being a *** is a state of mind Which is ironic, as most ***s are an absolute state. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DA Baracus Posted March 15, 2017 Share Posted March 15, 2017 1 hour ago, fueradejuego said: I voted Yes in 2014 probably more with my heart than my head as the economic case simply didn't stack up back then and there were too many unanswered questions. I'm not sure how I'd vote this time around. The key for me will be the Yes campaign producing a comprehensive and robust financial appraisal (as far as can be reasonably expected) that stands up to close scrutiny. I'm not interested in people saying we will be okay or others claiming that we are stronger together etc. That's just all rhetoric and nonsense. I'll vote on the basis of who presents the strongest economic case. Unfortunately that means I'll likely need to do most of the research myself as neither side will present an impartial analysis and that will leave me making a slightly better informed guess. That will be true of all issues, not just the economic one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shandon Par Posted March 15, 2017 Share Posted March 15, 2017 1 hour ago, fueradejuego said: I voted Yes in 2014 probably more with my heart than my head as the economic case simply didn't stack up back then and there were too many unanswered questions. I'm not sure how I'd vote this time around. The key for me will be the Yes campaign producing a comprehensive and robust financial appraisal (as far as can be reasonably expected) that stands up to close scrutiny. I'm not interested in people saying we will be okay or others claiming that we are stronger together etc. That's just all rhetoric and nonsense. I'll vote on the basis of who presents the strongest economic case. Unfortunately that means I'll likely need to do most of the research myself as neither side will present an impartial analysis and that will leave me making a slightly better informed guess. I'd suggest you widen your research to look at smaller, comparable countries globally and ignore what folk trying to win your vote say. How do other countries do it? How could we get on? The No case is simple. Look at how things are. If you're happy with your lot then just vote No. Who on the no side forecast Brexit and it's impact? You can't map out every eventuality. I'd say to look at it in terms of how would we be best equipped to handle our finances and our affairs in general. "Too many unanswered questions" is the biggest bit of rhetoric going! Where do you draw the line? Why do we look at a short term economic picture as the be all and end all? The chance to be an independent country is a far more expansive issue than a narrow right-wing press agenda of terrifying folk about currency, borders, jobs etc. Look at the spin on Brexit. It's barely questioned that May and her crew will do what they can to negotiate a deal yet Scotland isn't extended the same courtesy. I'd be quite comfortable with the thought of Sturgeon being in charge of negotiating us through a tricky process of exiting the UK, what to do about currency, how to handle Europe. We can't expect answers to questions we don't yet know but we can put our faith, Yes or No, in what looks like the best option overall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fueradejuego Posted March 15, 2017 Share Posted March 15, 2017 31 minutes ago, Shandon Par said: I'd suggest you widen your research to look at smaller, comparable countries globally and ignore what folk trying to win your vote say. How do other countries do it? How could we get on? The No case is simple. Look at how things are. If you're happy with your lot then just vote No. Who on the no side forecast Brexit and it's impact? You can't map out every eventuality. I'd say to look at it in terms of how would we be best equipped to handle our finances and our affairs in general. "Too many unanswered questions" is the biggest bit of rhetoric going! Where do you draw the line? Why do we look at a short term economic picture as the be all and end all? The chance to be an independent country is a far more expansive issue than a narrow right-wing press agenda of terrifying folk about currency, borders, jobs etc. Look at the spin on Brexit. It's barely questioned that May and her crew will do what they can to negotiate a deal yet Scotland isn't extended the same courtesy. I'd be quite comfortable with the thought of Sturgeon being in charge of negotiating us through a tricky process of exiting the UK, what to do about currency, how to handle Europe. We can't expect answers to questions we don't yet know but we can put our faith, Yes or No, in what looks like the best option overall. I'll be ignoring what most people say in the issue because the majority will be either entrenched Yes or No voters who you can't reason with. That was the biggest problem with the 2014 vote. Vast numbers of people bouncing around in their own echo chambers. If I could make one suggestion to people it would be to read considered viewpoints from the "other side" as such. It is a more expansive issue but the economic issues are the most important ones for me. I don't expect to hear all the answers but I'd like to hear one side put all of the options on the table and detail the pro's and con's of both. The Yes campaign could really do this if Andrew Wilson's research is as thorough and meticulous as suggested. It may paint a bleak picture but it would be a worst case scenario countered against what potentially could be achieved. Similar idea to what Sir Tom Hunter helped produce last time out. I suspect a moderate, sense of balance will be missing from this campaign though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeeTillEhDeh Posted March 15, 2017 Share Posted March 15, 2017 I voted No in 2014 and I voted Leave in 2016. This means 2 things: 1) I'm a c**t 2) Obviously there's no reason why I still wouldn't vote No 3) You're a Tory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Booker-T Posted March 15, 2017 Share Posted March 15, 2017 1 minute ago, DeeTillEhDeh said: 3) You're a Tory. same as option 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeeTillEhDeh Posted March 15, 2017 Share Posted March 15, 2017 I find it interesting that there are a few folk on here claiming that they voted NO last time and will vote YES this time. I know there is a long way to go but I think any result will be very tight, but the 5% swing we need is more than achievable given the potential changes in key demographics since last time. Snapshot of my own family. Me - Spoilt ballot last time/ Yes this time Wife - No/Yes Son - Did note vote/ Yes Daughter 1 - Yes/Yes Daughter 2 - Yes/Yes Daughter 3 - Did not vote/Yes Gran - No/RIP Grandad - No/RIP Mother-in-law - No/RIP Mum - No/No Stepdad - No/No Dad - No/ undecided Stepmum No/undecided Brother - Yes/Yes Sister-in-law Yes/Yes Sister - Yes/Yes Last time was: Spoilt - 1 Yes - 5 No - 8 Did not vote - 2 Undecided - 0 Provisional votes for Indyref2: Spoilt - 0 Yes - 9 No - 2 Will not vote - 3 deceased Undecided - 2 The only votes for No were from the only two who voted for Brexit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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