Hillonearth Posted February 28, 2017 Share Posted February 28, 2017 32 minutes ago, JakeSAFC said: We beat them on penalties. A win is a win. Yeahh...try getting the bookies to pay out on it though. I think the reason you're so strident on this subject is that deep down you know one year it's eventually going to be your team going out the Scottish out to Junior opposition. I think there's six or seven SPFL clubs now that have had to do the walk of shame - some bigger and better clubs than the Binos too... Sure, the SPFL sides will continue to win the majority of ties - it would be a shock it they didn't - but every year there's a good chance of there being another side joining the ever-less-exclusive "papped out by a Junior team" club. We look forward to welcoming you to it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JakeSAFC Posted February 28, 2017 Share Posted February 28, 2017 We wont get papped out by any junior side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hillonearth Posted February 28, 2017 Share Posted February 28, 2017 14 minutes ago, JakeSAFC said: We wont get papped out by any junior side. Brave words. Maybe not this year, maybe not next, but your team has come close on one occasion already to joining the club - like I said, the SPFL sides will continue to win the majority of games, but any supporter of a club below Championship level must know defeat to a junior team is eventually going to happen given long enough. Denial isn't just a river in Egypt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JakeSAFC Posted February 28, 2017 Share Posted February 28, 2017 Brave words. Maybe not this year, maybe not next, but your team has come close on one occasion already to joining the club - like I said, the SPFL sides will continue to win the majority of games, but any supporter of a club below Championship level must know defeat to a junior team is eventually going to happen given long enough. Denial isn't just a river in Egypt. Wont happen m8. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bankies Alive Posted February 28, 2017 Share Posted February 28, 2017 Dumbarton are miles better than you and they got knocked out by Bonnyrigg so stop talking shite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shannon Posted February 28, 2017 Share Posted February 28, 2017 Wont happen m8. You beat Hurlford 13-12 on penalties and scored in 116th minute to take it to penalties but confident you would never get beat by a Junior team. That Hurlford team that season did not win the league or Junior Cup so weren't the best Junior team you could have faced either! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8MileBU Posted February 28, 2017 Share Posted February 28, 2017 They wouldn't though, they wouldn't at all. They would. Talk sense man. Then when we beat Hurlford and pumped Linlithgow with arguably the 2 worst sides the Albion have ever had. The Linlithgow Rose side you beat are the worst side they've had in decades. Beating them was barely an achievement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shannon Posted February 28, 2017 Share Posted February 28, 2017 The highlights of Hurlfords two games v Stirling Albion are still online and clearly show Albion were very very lucky to get through the tie with Hurlford missing some great chances in first game at Blair Park to put tie to bed before Stirling scored with ten men and ten minutes to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JakeSAFC Posted February 28, 2017 Share Posted February 28, 2017 The Linlithgow Rose side you beat are the worst side they've had in decades. Beating them was barely an achievement. And its one of our worst sides we have ever had, we never left 2nd gear and pumped them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talbot Bing Posted February 28, 2017 Share Posted February 28, 2017 This clown so posting? Jeezo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HibeeJibee Posted February 28, 2017 Share Posted February 28, 2017 I haven't gone back far enough to read what I presume will be the usual "starters for 10" of wild exaggeration of Junior crowds and wild under-exaggeration of SPFL crowds. It's not in any real doubt that in recent seasons only Pollok have averaged more than a few SPFL clubs and only a couple of other Junior clubs averaged more than East Stirlingshire - but they have been relegated and replaced by Edinburgh City, who've been getting substantially larger crowds (between 1/3 to 1/2 larger). Hilarious bit in the middle of the thread about quality. Auchinleck Talbot win the West Juniors every season, and the Junior Cup every other season. They were put out of the Scottish by Edinburgh City; needed a replay to get past BSC Glasgow; and were put out by Cumbernauld Colts. Ah but Gartcairns played CC and BSCG in pre-season and results were close (what actually were the results?), so they cannot be very good! Remember too that the Scottish Cup only pits the champion juniors (and Linlithgow) against the whole spectrum of the Senior leagues. Going by head-to-head results and progress in the competition it seems indisputable that the quality level, at the top end, is similar. So they are the facts. Obviously anyone can pick-out a peak crowd in the Juniors and a dire one in SPFL but those aren't averages; obviously anyone can pick-out friendly results but they cannot be much of a guide, and certainly not compared to competitive ones. It's similar to those who say Junior Superleagues, or indeed HL or LL, are as good or better quality than SPFL. Clearly not so when you take a round, not exceptional, assessment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bankies Alive Posted February 28, 2017 Share Posted February 28, 2017 To say that a shite SPFL 2 team couldn't ever be knocked out of a cup by a Junior team is laughable though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KilsythCoyle Posted February 28, 2017 Share Posted February 28, 2017 Forfar, Elgin City, Dumbarton in recent years?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HibeeJibee Posted February 28, 2017 Share Posted February 28, 2017 Since being admitted in 2007 the Junior clubs have played a total of 42 ties against Scottish League opposition and won 6 of them. So it can happen - but it usually doesn't. EDIT: Interestingly 4 of those 6 wins have been delivered by East Region clubs. Only 1 by West Region, same total as North Region. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hillonearth Posted February 28, 2017 Share Posted February 28, 2017 17 minutes ago, HibeeJibee said: Since being admitted in 2007 the Junior clubs have played a total of 42 ties against Scottish League opposition and won 6 of them. So it can happen - but it usually doesn't. Pretty much the point I was making earlier - the SPFL sides will naturally continue to win the majority of ties. It's interesting however that after a period of maybe four years where no Junior team beat an SPFL side, the last three seasons have seen it become an annual occurrence, with Elgin, Forfar and Dumbarton going down to Junior opposition in successive years. Whether the Junior big guns are now becoming more comfortable with playing in the competition or the SPFL standard's deteriorating I don't know. What I do know is if you blindly insist that it'll never happen to the bottom-half-of-SPFL-2 team that you support, you're setting yourself up for a truly hilarious fall when it does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmontheloknow Posted February 28, 2017 Share Posted February 28, 2017 Pollok had a great team the year we took Montrose to a replay. That was arguably Montrose's best squad in decades. They've slipped since, but so have Pollok. The following season (2008/9) was the start of a rot that only really was vanquished last year. At this level a bit of extra cash can make all the difference and maybe that's why teams come and go a bit more. It makes predicting who'll do what a lottery as with no promotion for the big teams, successful sides can dismantle quite quickly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parsforlife Posted February 28, 2017 Share Posted February 28, 2017 People seem to forget alot of guys playing in the juniors are ex senior players. Either slowing down their career or playing juniors fits better with their work. It's mostly because they are fundamentally not good enough tbf. Of course junior teams can sometimes beat lower league sides. That's just the nature of cup football, same as lower league teams sometimes knock out premiership sides. Also as the original point, a small amount of junior teams get larger crowds than some spfl sides. Again that's no different than what happens at league level. Only difference is junior sides seem unwilling to test themselves at that level on regular basis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 28, 2017 Share Posted February 28, 2017 6 hours ago, HibeeJibee said: I haven't gone back far enough to read what I presume will be the usual "starters for 10" of wild exaggeration of Junior crowds and wild under-exaggeration of SPFL crowds. It's not in any real doubt that in recent seasons only Pollok have averaged more than a few SPFL clubs and only a couple of other Junior clubs averaged more than East Stirlingshire - but they have been relegated and replaced by Edinburgh City, who've been getting substantially larger crowds (between 1/3 to 1/2 larger). Hilarious bit in the middle of the thread about quality. Auchinleck Talbot win the West Juniors every season, and the Junior Cup every other season. They were put out of the Scottish by Edinburgh City; needed a replay to get past BSC Glasgow; and were put out by Cumbernauld Colts. Ah but Gartcairns played CC and BSCG in pre-season and results were close (what actually were the results?), so they cannot be very good! Remember too that the Scottish Cup only pits the champion juniors (and Linlithgow) against the whole spectrum of the Senior leagues. Going by head-to-head results and progress in the competition it seems indisputable that the quality level, at the top end, is similar. So they are the facts. Obviously anyone can pick-out a peak crowd in the Juniors and a dire one in SPFL but those aren't averages; obviously anyone can pick-out friendly results but they cannot be much of a guide, and certainly not compared to competitive ones. It's similar to those who say Junior Superleagues, or indeed HL or LL, are as good or better quality than SPFL. Clearly not so when you take a round, not exceptional, assessment. Funny how statistics can always be swayed. Talbot have never been beaten by a Highland League team in the big cup, given out a few skelpings on the way. Beat a much fancied Buckie Thistle 5-0. They also leathered Threave 8-0. Hearts, Stirling and Stranraer could count themselves very fortunate to go through and significant that all these ties were drawn away for Talbot. As for the Lowland League? Well not so impressive I grant you for Talbot, but no one ever quotes the replay result against BSC, wonder why? Colts was a total disaster and Talbot completely underestimated them. As for Edinburgh, think they have proved themselves, although the Talbot tie was criminal as they put everyone behind the ball playing Ten men. The other thing that sways the statistics comparing Junior v league teams, how many league teams are in the competition compared to Junior? Of course it's going to end up in the favour of the big clubs who have 90% more clubs in the tournament. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talbot Bing Posted February 28, 2017 Share Posted February 28, 2017 Funny how statistics can always be swayed. Talbot have never been beaten by a Highland League team in the big cup, given out a few skelpings on the way. Beat a much fancied Buckie Thistle 5-0. They also leathered Threave 8-0. Hearts, Stirling and Stranraer could count themselves very fortunate to go through and significant that all these ties were drawn away for Talbot. As for the Lowland League? Well not so impressive I grant you for Talbot, but no one ever quotes the replay result against BSC, wonder why? Colts was a total disaster and Talbot completely underestimated them. As for Edinburgh, think they have proved themselves, although the Talbot tie was criminal as they put everyone behind the ball playing Ten men. The other thing that sways the statistics comparing Junior v league teams, how many league teams are in the competition compared to Junior? Of course it's going to end up in the favour of the big clubs who have 90% more clubs in the tournament. I might be wrong here but am sure you'll know IsaThe game v Edinburgh am sure at least 5 of our main team players had been banished to the benches as a punishment for them playing in a charity match without permission. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ex-german exile Posted February 28, 2017 Share Posted February 28, 2017 Since being admitted in 2007 the Junior clubs have played a total of 42 ties against Scottish League opposition and won 6 of them. So it can happen - but it usually doesn't. EDIT: Interestingly 4 of those 6 wins have been delivered by East Region clubs. Only 1 by West Region, same total as North Region. Interesting stat. Do you have the tally for only those junior clubs that qualified as league or cup champions?i.e.: not lower league girvan or any of the other affiliates.And how does that compare with League 2 results against championship or premier opposition? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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