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Dunfermline Don

Expats right to vote to be extended

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Only, I never mentioned paying tax as a requirement for voting.  Residency is an entirely different matter and should be the basis for the franchise.

Your examples are of people that have chosen to go and live abroad.  If one of the consequence of this was that you lose the vote in UK elections do you think it would dissuade these people from taking up the opportunities abroad?  Would it have stopped you?  It's rather like saying that if you go to work in Thailand on a short-term contract then the NHS should pay any medical needs that you encounter. 


I'll concede that you never mentioned tax as an entitlement to vote & mistakenly (it seems), thought you were backing up others with this argument.
I'll be completely honest, if being dis-enfranchised was stated as a consequence of taking up my current position, I'd have thought long & hard about it.
I've no idea what Thailand and medical cover have to do with this issue? But for the sake of your need to bring this up, if I was a UK resident and went to work short term in Thailand and whilst there, I developed or was diagnosed with a debilitating illness, then I would return home and fully expect the NHS to treat my condition within the budgetary constraints they suffer from, and I see nothing wrong with this.

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11 minutes ago, DI Bruce Robertson said:


I'll concede that you never mentioned tax as an entitlement to vote & mistakenly (it seems), thought you were backing up others with this argument.
I'll be completely honest, if being dis-enfranchised was stated as a consequence of taking up my current position, I'd have thought long & hard about it.
I've no idea what Thailand and medical cover have to do with this issue? But for the sake of your need to bring this up, if I was a UK resident and went to work short term in Thailand and whilst there, I developed or was diagnosed with a debilitating illness, then I would return home and fully expect the NHS to treat my condition within the budgetary constraints they suffer from, and I see nothing wrong with this.

I am not sure that the ability to vote would be a consideration for many when accepting foreign jobs although I accept that for you this might not be the case.  The reason that I brought up the NHS is that when you take up a posting abroad there are many things that have to be considered and adding the loss of voting rights to the loss of healthcare etc. would just be another consideration for the pros and cons.

Edited by strichener

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I am not sure that the ability to vote would be a consideration for many when accepting foreign jobs although I accept that for you this might not be the case.  The reason that I brought up the NHS is that when you take up a posting abroad there are many things that have to be considered and adding the loss of voting rights to the loss of healthcare etc. would just be another consideration for the pros and cons.


Ok, but the rules have changed recently regarding use of NHS as a citizen working abroad, so were never a consideration for me, alongside voting rights.
I'm not entirely certain what point you are trying to make?
My point is & was, that sometimes it's difficult to make a distinction between who does & who does not deserve representation- you appear to have widened this.....

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14 minutes ago, DI Bruce Robertson said:


Ok, but the rules have changed recently regarding use of NHS as a citizen working abroad, so were never a consideration for me, alongside voting rights.
I'm not entirely certain what point you are trying to make?
My point is & was, that sometimes it's difficult to make a distinction between who does & who does not deserve representation- you appear to have widened this.....

I don't think I widened it and I don't think the distinction is that difficult - base the franchise on residency and then people who leave the country (for whatever reason) will know that doing so also precludes them from voting until they return (assuming that they do).

Just read that there were 19,245 registered oversees voters out of a possible 4.7-5.5m in 2014.  Even taking the lower number (0.004%) and the subsequent increase to 113,000 for the 2015 General Election gives an idea of the importance that the average ex-pat values their vote.

Edited by strichener
Voter Numbers

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57 minutes ago, Gordon EF said:

Completely. I'm not sure how serious folk are being about it though.

I was half joking, but I don't see why tax exiles like Richard Branson or Phillip Green should get a vote.

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I don't think I widened it and I don't think the distinction is that difficult - base the franchise on residency and then people who leave the country (for whatever reason) will know that doing so also precludes them from voting until they return (assuming that they do).

Just read that there were 19,245 registered oversees voters out of a possible 4.7-5.5m in 2014.  Even taking the lower number (0.004%) and the subsequent increase to 113,000 for the 2015 General Election gives an idea of the importance that the average ex-pat values their vote.


That doesn't take into account the individual, their circumstances or indeed the interest in politics, all those are leaving aside those who ( in their mind ) have emigrated permanently.
I get it, you think permanent and total residency are the key to voting rights. I disagree to a certain extent....

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I think that's a fairly simplistic view, and your implied wankery is noted.
How about students on foreign exchange programmes? How about people on short term overseas contracts- 3 months or less?
I still have an interest on how the UK is run and whilst I believe that people living there should have a say in ALL elections, I think whether or not I have a say cannot be decided on something as arbitrary as whether I pay tax or not.
Going by this method, anyone unfortunate enough to find themselves between jobs would be intelligible to vote.


Not really - the unemployed pay tax too.

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Pedantry in it's finest form. As a non-resident, I fairly often buy goods from the UK which I suspect are subject to VAT.


Depends if your VAT registered where you are (not that it matters). It wasn't particularly meant in relation to the topic. I just get irritated when people use 'tax' to simply mean income tax.

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I'm far more at ease with a Pole who has chosen to stay here having a vote than I am with someone who has turned their back on Scotland having a vote.

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I spent a few hundred quid in Slovakia and Hungary during the week.

I demand a vote in both countries.

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27 minutes ago, Hammer Jag said:

I spent a few hundred quid in Slovakia and Hungary during the week.

I demand a vote in both countries.

Pauper.

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SNP doesn't care about expat vote. I was out of UK for under 2 years but couldn't vote in Scotland's referendum despite the fact I still have a house in Scotland and had lived there for 42 years. At least I could vote in EU referendum as U.K. Government still valued my vote. 

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31 minutes ago, Airdrieonian said:

SNP doesn't care about expat vote. I was out of UK for under 2 years but couldn't vote in Scotland's referendum despite the fact I still have a house in Scotland and had lived there for 42 years. At least I could vote in EU referendum as U.K. Government still valued my vote. 

I think ex is the important part, if it meant so much to you I'm sure you could have moved back.

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7 minutes ago, ayrmad said:

I think ex is the important part, if it meant so much to you I'm sure you could have moved back

Yeah, just give up my job and family's future to get a vote which I should be entitled to anyway.

Typical nazis

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Yeah, just give up my job and family's future to get a vote which I should be entitled to anyway.

Typical nazis


Raging

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Yeah, just give up my job and family's future to get a vote which I should be entitled to anyway.

Typical nazis

Nah, that's just normal society. We welcome people from all countries and all walks of life and immigrants who choose to live and work here should have more rights than British born people who choose not to. The real Nazis are the British government who denied EU nationals the right to vote on the basis that they were conflicted even after witnessing an inclusive referendum 2 years previous that allowed English people and EU nationals staying in Scotland the right to vote on Scotland's future.

You have chosen to not be a part of Scotland's future, you shouldn't have a right to influence it from half way around the world. Immigrants who live here, are FAR more important than expats who don't. Just my opinion.

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Yeah, just give up my job and family's future to get a vote which I should be entitled to anyway.

Typical nazis


13 posts in and the mask is slipping.

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