RedRob72 Posted November 14, 2016 Share Posted November 14, 2016 For fux sake I'm not suggesting it's the whole Scottish support and never have, as I said earlier we've done some cracking trips down the years, There are clearly some within the TA that let the side down, that's all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
williemillersmoustache Posted November 14, 2016 Share Posted November 14, 2016 12 minutes ago, RedRob72 said: I condemned one set of 'fans' and asked Litchtie, to do the same which he did, two completely separate incidents however, I don't see what your problem or point is? You wanted Lichite to condemn "likewise" a couple of folk who bared their arse in a fountain to 1000's participating in disorder, vandalism and violence including assault on police officers. You have had a terrible mare this morning attempting to draw lines of equivalence between your horrendous support and the 'a bit cringey' but otherwise world respected and well-behaved tartan army. A proper intrweb holocaust you've had today and it's amusing how you're still thrashing about. Pray continue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRob72 Posted November 14, 2016 Share Posted November 14, 2016 You wanted Lichite to condemn "likewise" a couple of folk who bared their arse in a fountain to 1000's participating in disorder, vandalism and violence including assault on police officers. You have had a terrible mare this morning attempting to draw lines of equivalence between your horrendous support and the 'a bit cringey' but otherwise world respected and well-behaved tartan army. A proper intrweb holocaust you've had today and it's amusing how you're still thrashing about. Pray continue. You'll slate our support week in week, even on a completely unrelated subject, yet another reason why the Rangers contingent amongst the Scottish support is dwindling. A section of the Scottish support let themselves down on Friday just simply say yes they did!? I'll readily criticise fans within our own support at Ibrox or away when it's merited. This is not the subject at hand here. Your denial and diversion will continue though, I it's Ok, I understand ,that's the way it works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
williemillersmoustache Posted November 14, 2016 Share Posted November 14, 2016 6 minutes ago, RedRob72 said: You'll slate our support week in week, even on a completely unrelated subject, yet another reason why the Rangers contingent amongst the Scottish support is dwindling. A section of the Scottish support let themselves down on Friday just simply say yes they did!? I'll readily criticise fans within our own support at Ibrox or away when it's merited. This is not the subject at hand here. Your denial and diversion will continue though, I it's Ok, I understand ,that's the way it works. Come on, you can do better than that, try again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRob72 Posted November 14, 2016 Share Posted November 14, 2016 Come on, you can do better than that, try again. Will have to be later Willie, Train's just pulled in![emoji6] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
williemillersmoustache Posted November 14, 2016 Share Posted November 14, 2016 Just now, RedRob72 said: Will have to be later Willie, Train's just pulled in! How conweenient. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverWolfe Posted November 14, 2016 Share Posted November 14, 2016 14 hours ago, 54_and_counting said: yup, if you really want details then the early murray era it was money from tickets and merchandise etc, as monkey says above we were taking over 40k to games back then, so murray had the money back then, later into the 9iar era when wages in england started going up and we had to pay more to entice players, he banked on CL revenue plus he sold a chunk of the club for around 60mill if memory serves me right but again it doesnt fit into your "souness caused it all" theory so you'll dismiss it Had to jump in here as this is another example of Rangers fans being blind to what Murray was up to from day 1. Between 1988 and 1998, Rangers made a profit 3 times and accumulated losses in the region of £20m during that time. They had net current and deferred liabilities in the region of £40m around 1996. They were in big trouble and in 1997 Murray sold off some shares and raised capital of about £40m which only aided to mask the deep lying problems. After that it was back to business as usual until they went bust in 2012. Murray never used a penny of his own money, Rangers did not make enough money from gate receipts and merchandise to cover the huge spending that was going on, they were given bank loans and massive overdrafts because the Banking industry had absolutely no care for liquidity risk. The minute the crash happened in 2007/08, there was no coming back for Rangers. 20 years of mis-management was never going to recover and when the ship had taken on too much water Murray abandoned it and let someone else take the flak. How Rangers fans don't solely blame this guy is beyond me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheScarf Posted November 14, 2016 Share Posted November 14, 2016 Yep, David Murray is the sole reason Rangers died. Not Souness, not Whyte, not anybody else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
williemillersmoustache Posted November 14, 2016 Share Posted November 14, 2016 6 minutes ago, TheScarf said: Yep, David Murray is the sole reason Rangers died. Not Souness, not Whyte, not anybody else. And their supine, gullible and "nowhere to be found when the chips are down" fans. Don't forget them and their complete disappearance when it mattered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The OP Posted November 14, 2016 Share Posted November 14, 2016 Scotland fans and Rangers fans are totally different. Rangers fans sing 'Jimmy Savile - he's one of your own' which is disgusting behaviour whereas Scotland fans sing 'Jimmy Savile - he's one of your own' which is cracking banter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICTChris Posted November 14, 2016 Share Posted November 14, 2016 4 minutes ago, williemillersmoustache said: And their supine, gullible and "nowhere to be found when the chips are down" fans. Don't forget them and their complete disappearance when it mattered. Exclusive photo of the Rangers fans getting together to save their club Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JakeSAFC Posted November 14, 2016 Share Posted November 14, 2016 You'll slate our support week in week, even on a completely unrelated subject, yet another reason why the Rangers contingent amongst the Scottish support is dwindling. Probably not a bad thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1320Lichtie Posted November 14, 2016 Share Posted November 14, 2016 It's not just dwindling. Some of The Rangers support were also supporting the English and hoping their hooligans battered us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
54_and_counting Posted November 14, 2016 Share Posted November 14, 2016 36 minutes ago, Tartantony said: Had to jump in here as this is another example of Rangers fans being blind to what Murray was up to from day 1. Between 1988 and 1998, Rangers made a profit 3 times and accumulated losses in the region of £20m during that time. They had net current and deferred liabilities in the region of £40m around 1996. They were in big trouble and in 1997 Murray sold off some shares and raised capital of about £40m which only aided to mask the deep lying problems. After that it was back to business as usual until they went bust in 2012. Murray never used a penny of his own money, Rangers did not make enough money from gate receipts and merchandise to cover the huge spending that was going on, they were given bank loans and massive overdrafts because the Banking industry had absolutely no care for liquidity risk. The minute the crash happened in 2007/08, there was no coming back for Rangers. 20 years of mis-management was never going to recover and when the ship had taken on too much water Murray abandoned it and let someone else take the flak. How Rangers fans don't solely blame this guy is beyond me. i reached the part of 1996 then chucked it given the point was about souness spending big money, then you proceed to talk about the crash in 2007/08 which again bears nothing to the talk about souness and him detrimenting scottish football also you act like no football club has ever lived off debt, you dont expect a club to spunk 50 odd million on their stadium alone without using a share issue or bank loans, given what team you support surely you should know that with the co-op loan still on the books and the share issues fergus mccann did murray made a complete c**t of it, you wont find me with a good word to say about him, but with regards to souness we were nowhere near as reckless and detrimental to the Scottish game under him as say both Advocaat and MoN were to it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverWolfe Posted November 14, 2016 Share Posted November 14, 2016 8 minutes ago, 54_and_counting said: i reached the part of 1996 then chucked it given the point was about souness spending big money, then you proceed to talk about the crash in 2007/08 which again bears nothing to the talk about souness and him detrimenting scottish football also you act like no football club has ever lived off debt, you dont expect a club to spunk 50 odd million on their stadium alone without using a share issue or bank loans, given what team you support surely you should know that with the co-op loan still on the books and the share issues fergus mccann did murray made a complete c**t of it, you wont find me with a good word to say about him, but with regards to souness we were nowhere near as reckless and detrimental to the Scottish game under him as say both Advocaat and MoN were to it In what way was the Martin O'Neill era reckless and detrimental to Scottish football? Rangers were reckless from the minute Murray walked in the door right up until the doors were shut and even continue to be reckless today. Yes the Co-op loan is still on the books, however Celtic have a net cash surplus and are able to service that debt with no risk to the Club. The shareholders who purchased those shares will have made a fairly large profit on their shares. The difference between Celtic and Rangers was that we took on debt that we could afford to pay back and actively worked towards reducing that debt whereas Rangers literally lived off the debt with no intention of ever paying it back. The two situations are not even close to comparable. There is a big difference between living off debt and using debt within means to enhance the club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bennett Posted November 14, 2016 Share Posted November 14, 2016 When did this turn into the big let's stick it to sevco thread? (Bralt mk2) Ffs Scotland play pish and the last four pages (as far as I read back) are all about how everything is sevcos fault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malcolm Malcolm Posted November 14, 2016 Share Posted November 14, 2016 17 minutes ago, 54_and_counting said: i reached the part of 1996 then chucked it given the point was about souness spending big money, then you proceed to talk about the crash in 2007/08 which again bears nothing to the talk about souness and him detrimenting scottish football also you act like no football club has ever lived off debt, you dont expect a club to spunk 50 odd million on their stadium alone without using a share issue or bank loans, given what team you support surely you should know that with the co-op loan still on the books and the share issues fergus mccann did murray made a complete c**t of it, you wont find me with a good word to say about him, but with regards to souness we were nowhere near as reckless and detrimental to the Scottish game under him as say both Advocaat and MoN were to it Detriment isn't a verb. It was Souness who suggested that his Thatcherite chum Murray buy Rangers. I did link you to (and copy the the relevant section from) the RANGERS WEBSITE. Souness also has this to say about Murray http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/graeme-souness-biggest-ibrox-regret-7772945 “In my time at Rangers, and looking at the facts, Murray is easily the most successful chairman ever. So he must have got a hell of lot of things right.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby Skidmarks Posted November 14, 2016 Share Posted November 14, 2016 the last four pages (as far as I read back) are all about how everything is sevcos fault. You obviously didn't read them, or is it your instinct to constantly lie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JakeSAFC Posted November 14, 2016 Share Posted November 14, 2016 It's not just dwindling. Some of The Rangers support were also supporting the English and hoping their hooligans battered us. Lets be honest, some of The Rangers support were probably in with the English fans. Minters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bennett Posted November 14, 2016 Share Posted November 14, 2016 2 minutes ago, JakeSAFC said: Lets be honest, some of The Rangers support were probably in with the English fans. Minters. 3 minutes ago, Bobby Skidmarks said: You obviously didn't read them, or is it your instinct to constantly lie. Sorry Rab, no sticking it to sevco here. 2 + 2 = 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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