Brexit slowly becoming a Farce.

[NotThePars]

A quick Google gives an article from 4 years ago that says the number of students in Scotland exceeded 235,000. Maybe if Salmond engaged in student politics he could’ve had an MSP elected.

[Sherrif John Bunnell]

Lol

[101]

3 minutes ago, Sherrif John Bunnell said:

Lol

"I wasn't going to be a lorry driver but now the sun's says I should I will" 

The whole issue come down to pay, you can clear the driver testing backlog and ease the hours they can work all you like but if it's not well paid for the hours you work then there is no incentive to join the industry.

I think post Brexit people have to realise it's not sustainable to have food at the price people have been buying it for. The entire supply chain depends on low paid skilled labour which is not conducive to solving recruitment issues.

[Suspect Device]

What sort of wage would you expect driving an HGV

Obviously long haul would be a pish work/life balance but it's hardly alone in that respect. plenty jobs mean you're away from home a lot.

[Dawson Park Boy]

This current shortage of drivers and other ancillary workers is a fantastic opportunity to push the wages of these jobs up to more realistic levels.

For far too long we’ve relied on an oversupply of foreign labour to depress wages in those industries.

That time is over due to a combination of Covid, Brexit, delays in granting HGV licences and the closing of the outrageous IR35 loophole.

Were already seeing employers offering ‘golden hellos’ and other financial incentives.

Its going to be changed times and, I think, for the better.

[KingRocketman II]

1 hour ago, Dawson Park Boy said:

This current shortage of drivers and other ancillary workers is a fantastic opportunity to push the wages of these jobs up to more realistic levels.

For far too long we’ve relied on an oversupply of foreign labour to depress wages in those industries.

That time is over due to a combination of Covid, Brexit, delays in granting HGV licences and the closing of the outrageous IR35 loophole.

Were already seeing employers offering ‘golden hellos’ and other financial incentives.

Its going to be changed times and, I think, for the better.

another Brexit bonus!!

[Baxter Parp]

10 hours ago, 101 said:

The whole issue come down to pay

Average wage of an HGV driver is £32,500.  It's not the pay.

https://www.totaljobs.com/salary-checker/average-hgv-drivers-salary#:~:text=The average salary for HGV Drivers jobs is £32%2C500,various UK locations and industries.

[101]

Christmas being at risk is red top nonsense but other than that the thread is decent. Christmas is a day being unable to get Turkey crowns or pigs in blankets does not cancel Christmas.

 

12 hours ago, Baxter Parp said:

Average wage of an HGV driver is £32,500.  It's not the pay.

https://www.totaljobs.com/salary-checker/average-hgv-drivers-salary#:~:text=The average salary for HGV Drivers jobs is £32%2C500,various UK locations and industries.

Sorry, didn't see you had replied. 

For salaried drivers doing the maximum permitted by law that really isn't a great deal of money considering they spend a long time away from home and have frankly abysmal conditions at lorry parks and the like.

Also some companies are hesitant to spend the sums of money required to train new drivers or pay new starts less. 

[Baxter Parp]

8 hours ago, 101 said:

For salaried drivers doing the maximum permitted by law that really isn't a great deal of money considering they spend a long time away from home and have frankly abysmal conditions at lorry parks and the like.

If you saw the government's immigration code description of the duties and skills of an HGV driver, it's too fucking much. If you can find better, then do so but you can stop describing HGV drivers on slave wages. That's bollocks.

[jakedee]

This is just the start of eroding workers rights. Not enough drivers, so let's scrap the regulations that restrict the maximum hours they are allowed to be at the wheel.
Back to the good old days of LGV drivers falling asleep behind the wheel trying to meet deadlines.

[Theroadlesstravelled]

18 hours ago, 101 said:

Christmas being at risk is red top nonsense but other than that the thread is decent. Christmas is a day being unable to get Turkey crowns or pigs in blankets does not cancel Christmas.

 

Sorry, didn't see you had replied. 

For salaried drivers doing the maximum permitted by law that really isn't a great deal of money considering they spend a long time away from home and have frankly abysmal conditions at lorry parks and the like.

Also some companies are hesitant to spend the sums of money required to train new drivers or pay new starts less. 

All set up for Boris to save Christmas again.

[coprolite]

On 26/08/2021 at 16:41, Dawson Park Boy said:

This current shortage of drivers and other ancillary workers is a fantastic opportunity to push the wages of these jobs up to more realistic levels.

For far too long we’ve relied on an oversupply of foreign labour to depress wages in those industries.

That time is over due to a combination of Covid, Brexit, delays in granting HGV licences and the closing of the outrageous IR35 loophole.

Were already seeing employers offering ‘golden hellos’ and other financial incentives.

Its going to be changed times and, I think, for the better.

Wages will only be pushed up if firms can pass on price rises.

Where business customers of hauliers can't pass those rises on themselves they'll fold.

As well as significantly reducing wages for the newly unemployed, this will reduce demand for freight, reducing the price that can be charged and wages paid, probably at a higher level than before but potentially not. 

Also end consumers will have higher prices to pay and a smaller range of goods (as those at the margins of viability drop out of the market.) 

We've already lost the GDP tgat we hot through foreign hauliers spending in the uk. 

All offset by uk truckers having more disposable income of course. 

It seems unlikely that there would be a net welfare gain to the whole economy from increasing transport costs. 

The other options are less road haulage in the UK or some technological solution to increase labour productivity (road trains?). I see no obvious reason why in the long term wage increases would be a bigger part of the solution. 

 

Also interested why you think a bit of anti avoidance legislation is a loophole and how "closing" it will do anything to increase wages. 

[tamthebam]

They used to grow tomatoes in the Clyde Valley. Apparently they were very tasty.

Now we get our tomatoes from Spain because it's cheaper financially and the old greenhouses in the Clyde Valley are in ruins. It would be easier to get Clyde Valley tomatoes to Scottish and North of England supermarkets than Spanish ones.

Anybody in this post Brexit age of HGV driver shortages want to buy up some old Clyde Valley greenhouses? There's an investment opportunity especially given global warming..

 

 

[coprolite]

4 minutes ago, tamthebam said:

They used to grow tomatoes in the Clyde Valley. Apparently they were very tasty.

Now we get our tomatoes from Spain because it's cheaper financially and the old greenhouses in the Clyde Valley are in ruins. It would be easier to get Clyde Valley tomatoes to Scottish and North of England supermarkets than Spanish ones.

Anybody in this post Brexit age of HGV driver shortages want to buy up some old Clyde Valley greenhouses? There's an investment opportunity especially given global warming..

 

 

Interesting you mention global warming. There's been talk about tomato farming being used for carbon capture for a while.

It looks like our dysfunctional in-fighting European chums have managed to get this on the go in between their economy collapsing and being overrun by refugees. 

https://www.farmersjournal.ie/flynns-tomatoes-to-slash-emissions-using-carbon-capture-and-natural-gas-589533

 

[Soapy FFC]

10 minutes ago, tamthebam said:

They used to grow tomatoes in the Clyde Valley. Apparently they were very tasty.

Now we get our tomatoes from Spain because it's cheaper financially and the old greenhouses in the Clyde Valley are in ruins. It would be easier to get Clyde Valley tomatoes to Scottish and North of England supermarkets than Spanish ones.

Anybody in this post Brexit age of HGV driver shortages want to buy up some old Clyde Valley greenhouses? There's an investment opportunity especially given global warming..

 

 

We do still produce foodstuff locally, just look at the raspberries and strawberries etc that are in the supermarkets at this time of the year. I love this time of the year as the local produce is far better and fresher than the imported stuff. However the problem is these are all seasonal and can only be produced here for part of the year. As a society we have moved away from eating seasonally, to demanding all types of food all year round, hence the reliance on imports from Spain and further afield to satisfy that demand. So short of moving the UK a thousand miles further south, we will continue to need imports.

[coprolite]

16 minutes ago, Soapy FFC said:

We do still produce foodstuff locally, just look at the raspberries and strawberries etc that are in the supermarkets at this time of the year. I love this time of the year as the local produce is far better and fresher than the imported stuff. However the problem is these are all seasonal and can only be produced here for part of the year. As a society we have moved away from eating seasonally, to demanding all types of food all year round, hence the reliance on imports from Spain and further afield to satisfy that demand. So short of moving the UK a thousand miles further south, we will continue to need imports.

That's not quite the full picture. It's not that food can only be produced here, it's that it's only been economically viable to produce here.

Anything that increases the cost of foreign produce should make uk production more competitive at the margins. 

Unfortunately for uk production, brexit has increased the costs for Uk producers who can't use cheaper labour now. Haulage affects both. And we still haven't done anything about those disgraceful cheese imports. 

[Soapy FFC]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9936697/MAIL-SUNDAY-COMMENT-Lets-unite-EU-crush-curse-border-bureaucracy.html#

I had to chuckle at the headline.

 

[Paul Kersey]

We need more French fellas in Sheffield.

 

[Jeff Venom]

Imagine still wanting to be tied to this.

[Theroadlesstravelled]

Kate Hoey clearly should be sectioned. 
Much like all Brexiteers who believed Boris’ shite.