Brexit slowly becoming a Farce.

[Guest Jedi]

5 minutes ago, The Skelpit Lug said:

Does anybody know if Progress Scotland, the polling company that Angus Robertson heads, has released any poll findings? Would be brilliant if they find a surge in indy support in light of the way leaving EU has been handled. It's highlighting all that's wrong with Westminster. Hopefully lots more folk are seeing a better option lies ahead for Scotland.

Sure hope so.

[Guest Bob Mahelp]

3 minutes ago, The Skelpit Lug said:

Does anybody know if Progress Scotland, the polling company that Angus Robertson heads, has released any poll findings? Would be brilliant if they find a surge in indy support in light of the way leaving EU has been handled. It's highlighting all that's wrong with Westminster. Hopefully lots more folk are seeing a better option lies ahead for Scotland.

Nope. The Yes and No support in Scotland remains hardened and ingrained, and within tiny margins has not moved in 5 years.

It's been proven that there's no correlation between Leave/Remain and Yes/No.....we need to get away from believing that Westminster chaos and/or a hardline Tory government will somehow increase support for independence.

[Billy Rubin]

12 minutes ago, Bob Mahelp said:

Nope. The Yes and No support in Scotland remains hardened and ingrained, and within tiny margins has not moved in 5 years.

It's been proven that there's no correlation between Leave/Remain and Yes/No.....we need to get away from believing that Westminster chaos and/or a hardline Tory government will somehow increase support for independence.

There's unquestionably been movement, most have went No to Yes,  smaller numbers Yes to No.    I would expect a vote pretty much on 50/50 if it was held this year.   

[LongTimeLurker]

Sounds like a paranoid delusion, but May's willingness to hand over NI gift wrapped to Dublin through the back stop has to raise a nagging fear at the back of their minds as to whether Scotland is expendable as well if that's the price needed for the Little Englanders to get their Brexit.

[welshbairn]

7 minutes ago, LongTimeLurker said:

Sounds like a paranoid delusion

Sure does. And the bit about the backstop handing over NI to Dublin, if it ever happened, which it wouldn't.

Edited March 18, 2019 by welshbairn

[Tibbermoresaint]

31 minutes ago, Donathan said:

Seeing some talk amongst low level Tory supporters that May could bring back the sea border and offer Scotland the same “special status” as NI in order to try and do a deal with the SNP. Surely not.

Can't see the DUP, ERG and Scottish Conservatives going for that, never mind whole swathes of little Englanders.

22 minutes ago, Bob Mahelp said:

Nope. The Yes and No support in Scotland remains hardened and ingrained, and within tiny margins has not moved in 5 years.

It's been proven that there's no correlation between Leave/Remain and Yes/No.....we need to get away from believing that Westminster chaos and/or a hardline Tory government will somehow increase support for independence.

Brexit hasn't happened.

[cyderspaceman]

On 17/03/2019 at 07:14, MixuFixit said:

Why would they give us 5bil for zero votes

Because Scotland costs the ENGLISH an absolute fortune,  don'tcha know?

They quitter types would love to get rid of Scotland.  SNP should put up candidates in these areas.

It would steal votes from the likes of UKIP if nothing else.

[Dunning1874]

1 minute ago, LongTimeLurker said:

Sounds like a paranoid delusion, but May's willingness to hand over NI gift wrapped to Dublin through the back stop has to raise a nagging fear at the back of their minds as to whether Scotland is expendable as well if that's the price needed for the Little Englanders to get their Brexit.

No matter how many times you repeat it, this will continue to be nonsense.

The entire point of the UK’s negotiating position on the backstop applying to the whole UK rather than solely NI was to prevent NI being treated differently, and the DUP’s continued insistence that this is a problem in spite of the backstop applying to the UK as a whole is proof that they, along with the ERG, are simply scrambling for any excuse to vote against any kind of deal.

They know a deal isn’t possible without a backstop, they know the backstop as it stands will not create any further divisions between NI & GB, they know that this is the hardest Brexit possible with a deal. They’re voting against in spite of that knowledge because they want no deal and would love a hard border.

[ICTJohnboy]

5 minutes ago, LongTimeLurker said:

Sounds like a paranoid delusion, but May's willingness to hand over NI gift wrapped to Dublin through the back stop has to raise a nagging fear at the back of their minds as to whether Scotland is expendable as well if that's the price needed for the Little Englanders to get their Brexit.

 

Naah....No danger.

Unfortunately May, like her predecessor Cameron, love Scotland so much they think it is, and should remain part of England.  "We're all one country", they're fond of saying.

Even the Queen loves Scotland. I believe she's even got a wee but and ben somewhere near Ballater. 

[cyderspaceman]

42 minutes ago, sophia said:

Just remember people like you and 2014.

Granny has given enough mia culpa tongs given a pass.

What have you learned?

'tongs'            Ya Bass!

 

I love/hate auto correct.

[LongTimeLurker]

8 minutes ago, welshbairn said:

Sure does. And the bit about the backstop handing over NI to Dublin, if it ever happened, which it wouldn't

In the absence of an EEA type soft Brexit there is no way to avoid a hard border between NI and the RoI unless there are custom checks at the Irish Sea and NI stays in the EU's customs union. Suggestions to the contrary are lies and propaganda. 

[welshbairn]

1 minute ago, LongTimeLurker said:

In the absence of an EEA type soft Brexit there is no way to avoid a hard border between NI and the RoI unless there are custom checks at the Irish Sea and NI stays in the EU's customs union. Suggestions to the contrary are lies and propaganda. 

Checks between NI and Britain already exist, and if they were made stricter it still wouldn't put NI under Dublin rule.

[Donathan]

In the absence of an EEA type soft Brexit there is no way to avoid a hard border between NI and the RoI unless there are custom checks at the Irish Sea and NI stays in the EU's customs union. Suggestions to the contrary are lies and propaganda. 

I’m sure this was exactly the plan prior to the 2017 snap election when the Maybot lost her majority and suddenly the DUP became relevant. It may still get another airing if we somehow end up with a GE and a Conservative majority, or there’s the less likely scenario I mentioned where the Tories bin the DUP and try to get Ian Blackford on side, Tory/SNP is easily enough to get a deal through, with a sea border being introduced and Scotland also getting special status (and we’ll chuck in permanent section 30 powers for Holyrood as a brucie bonus)

[LongTimeLurker]

The back stop kicking in would lead inexorably to a united Ireland and most of the Brexiters see it as a price worth paying, which is why some Scottish Tories may or may not be getting paranoid as to what might be agreed with the SNP, if it helps get Brexit through. 

[GordonS]

19 minutes ago, LongTimeLurker said:

Sounds like a paranoid delusion, but May's willingness to hand over NI gift wrapped to Dublin through the back stop 

You're right, that is a paranoid delusion.

2 hours ago, Donathan said:

But they’ll certainly try to push for a second referendum which is the ideal outcome IMO

There's literally no evidence for this.

46 minutes ago, Donathan said:

Seeing some talk amongst low level Tory supporters that May could bring back the sea border and offer Scotland the same “special status” as NI in order to try and do a deal with the SNP. Surely not.

Where do you get you information? Facebook?

38 minutes ago, Bob Mahelp said:

It's been proven that there's no correlation between Leave/Remain and Yes/No.....we need to get away from believing that Westminster chaos and/or a hardline Tory government will somehow increase support for independence.

That's not what I've seen from polls - this one is typical:

Remain 66% (Yes 72%, No 60%)

Leave 34% (Yes 28%, No 40%)

https://www.drg.global/wp-content/uploads/Tables-for-publication-060319.pdf

[welshbairn]

8 minutes ago, LongTimeLurker said:

The back stop kicking in would lead inexorably to a united Ireland

Because everyone would like it so much that everyone would demand and win a border poll?

Edited March 18, 2019 by welshbairn

[cyderspaceman]

2 hours ago, D'Jaffo said:

This exactly

I struggle to see the EU granting any extension at the moment however the idea of a 2 year extension thereby allowing for the next General Election seems to be touted about so I’d be interested to see what happens there.

I also don’t think a second ref would do anything. I’m not against it but I still think the majority would vote leave again despite anything other than a No Deal being pretty much impossible.

I really don't.

I think too many people, especially those young people too interested in their 'pop music', reality tv  and shagging, didn't comprehend what this meant and did not vote.  I voted but didn't think for one second that leave would win.

I do know leave voters who have changed their minds. And some who haven't. I don't know any remainers who have changed their minds.

I remember being young. It was mostly good.  

[John Lambies Doos]

Says the NO voter

And a Scottish hater. His performance on the rugby thread on Saturday was servile cringe at its worst.

[LongTimeLurker]

1 minute ago, welshbairn said:

Because everyone would like it so much that everyone would demand a border poll?

Do you really need to be spoon fed? If NI is no longer in the same customs space as Great Britain, Dublin starts to become more important than Westminster in people's lives and RoI politicians effectively represent NI in determining macroeconomic policy. 

[welshbairn]

8 minutes ago, LongTimeLurker said:

Do you really need to be spoon fed? If NI is no longer in the same customs space as Great Britain, Dublin starts to become more important than Westminster in people's lives and RoI politicians effectively represent NI in determining macroeconomic policy. 

The rules that affect people's lives in the UK from the EU in a significant way are miniscule compared to the laws determined in Westminster. The same would apply to NI in a slighter closer relationship with the EU than Britain. NI might get slightly less powerful toasters, but May has promised to abide by the same rules, so they wouldn't.

Edited March 18, 2019 by welshbairn