welshbairn Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 Just now, Hedgecutter said: Is it not a requirement for EU applicants? A vague commitment to think about it eventually. Sweden have met all the criteria for joining the Euro since 1994, but for recognising the authority of the European Central Bank, and refuse to do so. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sweden_and_the_euro 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btb Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 (edited) VoC - almost certainly what May wanted. On public declarations she'll romp it, but it's a secret ballot! Edited December 12, 2018 by btb 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fullerene Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 1 minute ago, weegienative said: So, the ones who might be convinced to agree with you aren't the thick racists but the rest are? Got it. Oh dear. I am not saying that everyone who votes Leave again is a thick racist. GROUP "A" - Leave voter who is a thick racist GROUP "B" - All other Leave voters Nobody in GROUP "A" is going to change their mind - IMO Some people in GROUP "B" might change their mind. If enough of them do - that would be great. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacksgranda Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 3 hours ago, FlyerTon said: On the radio there that the vote to take place from 6pm tonight. Tory leadership contest to kick off next Monday if she loses. Heard that the result would be known by 8 pm. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weegienative Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 20 minutes ago, Ross. said: On the bolded part. If the governing party decide to ignore the Brexit vote, then you are admitting now that you are happy for that to happen provided they feel it is the best decision for the country. On questions 1 and 3 - I left the UK and moved to Switzerland, which has to allow freedom of movement for access to the single market. To the best of my knowledge, the system the Swiss use could be used by the UK. I had to support myself and was not eligible for any help from the national, state or local governments. I had to renew my permit every 6 months to confirm I was still in the country and still in a position to support myself. If I couldn't support myself, tough luck, you just have to get on with things or go somewhere else. That is the case for anyone from the EU moving to Switzerland. Your second question requires further information. What is the status of the migrants who land in Spain? Why did they land in Spain? where did they come from? Are they political exiles? Economic migrants? EU born? No, because that would also set a precedent that the next general election or refendum can be ignored. If they abdicate responsibility to the people to decide on Brexit, they can't then go back on it. It's really quite simple. On your question about the Swiss example, let's pretend for arguments sake that migrants don't get access to benefits. They take housing, schooling, medical and countless other public funded resources. The second question actually requires no follow up information at all; https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwjQ58fFk5rfAhUDxxoKHUBcAc0QzPwBegQIARAC&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.theguardian.com%2Fworld%2F2016%2Fapr%2F06%2Feu-unveils-plans-reform-asylum-rules-refugee-migrant&psig=AOvVaw3uyD2tG09yPkmrm2EuQM64&ust=1544699324757670 Incidentally, Indyref. Did you vote leave or remain? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weegienative Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 23 minutes ago, Scary Bear said: Labour still have Jez as leader. He is the invisible man and on the rare occasions he does appear the media slaughter him. What would be the point of another GE when the FPTP system will likely see a similar outcome. Another 5 years of the Tories with a more vicious Tory at the helm doesn’t appeal. U.K. politics is terrible and it’s mainly the fault of the people of the U.K. Those damn people, voting for the party they want. How dare they? Why can't they all just vote the way you want them to!? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsimButtHitsASix Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 4 minutes ago, weegienative said: No, because that would also set a precedent that the next general election or refendum can be ignored. No it doesn't. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weegienative Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 19 minutes ago, AsimButtHitsASix said: We don't have unrestricted immigration. There are no third world countries in the EU. Who doesn't respect our values or traditions? Which values and traditions are you explicitly speaking of? How do you define "large scale" as a percentage of population? I mean, the things you said, they are all valid things to be concerned about but they don't exist so I don't know why you're concerned It would be helpful if you read the post I was responding to. It was specifically non eu immigration. https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwjQ58fFk5rfAhUDxxoKHUBcAc0QzPwBegQIARAC&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.theguardian.com%2Fworld%2F2016%2Fapr%2F06%2Feu-unveils-plans-reform-asylum-rules-refugee-migrant&psig=AOvVaw3uyD2tG09yPkmrm2EuQM64&ust=1544699324757670 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsimButtHitsASix Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 It'd be helpful if you answered the questions. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weegienative Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 22 minutes ago, Pull My Strings said: Ah yes, that immigration. Yes, that immigration. Was there a follow up point? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weegienative Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 23 minutes ago, Ross. said: Something that it is currently within the scope of the UK to deal with, Brexit or no Brexit. Wrong. Within the scope to deal with post Brexit yes. Not whilst remaining part of the EU. https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwjQ58fFk5rfAhUDxxoKHUBcAc0QzPwBegQIARAC&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.theguardian.com%2Fworld%2F2016%2Fapr%2F06%2Feu-unveils-plans-reform-asylum-rules-refugee-migrant&psig=AOvVaw3uyD2tG09yPkmrm2EuQM64&ust=1544699324757670 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsimButtHitsASix Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 Just now, weegienative said: Wrong. Within the scope to deal with post Brexit yes. Not whilst remaining part of the EU. https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwjQ58fFk5rfAhUDxxoKHUBcAc0QzPwBegQIARAC&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.theguardian.com%2Fworld%2F2016%2Fapr%2F06%2Feu-unveils-plans-reform-asylum-rules-refugee-migrant&psig=AOvVaw3uyD2tG09yPkmrm2EuQM64&ust=1544699324757670 Quote Britain chooses whether to take part in EU asylum policy The very article you are posting shows that taking part in EU asylum policy is something that the UK doesn't need to enter into. Why you bringing this up? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacksgranda Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, Ross. said: That begun a while back. Folk I deal with on a regular basis have moved from London to Dublin and Frankfurt. CITI and Morgan Stanley. BNP also moved a load of folk to Paris. As I have mentioned a few times on here, I know for a fact that most of the decision makers in this game do not believe Brexit will happen, but they all have no choice but to plan for it happening. Those plans have been made and are being implemented. No matter what happens at this point, damage has been done and will continue to be done. The BNP have moved to Paris? Did Marine Le Pen invite them? Edited December 12, 2018 by Jacksgranda 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross. Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 (edited) 13 minutes ago, weegienative said: On your question about the Swiss example, let's pretend for arguments sake that migrants don't get access to benefits. They take housing, schooling, medical and countless other public funded resources. I had access to none of those things. Medical insurance, along with rent, transport and anything else I required had to be covered by me, or a sponsor. NHS being the only difference, what is to stop the UK from imposing a similar system on economic migrants? Edited December 12, 2018 by Ross. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pull My Strings Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 1 minute ago, weegienative said: Yes, that immigration. Was there a follow up point? Nope, I think you've clarified your position perfectly. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weegienative Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 (edited) 30 minutes ago, Pull My Strings said: I don't think immigration is a problem. I'm actively pro immigration. If you want to stop immigration then, yes, you would need to leave the EU to do that. As I say, it's an honest position if that's your principle motivation. Immigration is key to the economy, certain sectors rely on immigtants (immorally so in my opinion but that's another argument for another day). Unchecked, unskilled immigration is a security risk and offers nothing. Cultures which hold significantly different values to us on far significant things which can't or shouldn't be compromised on, simply can't be allowed to mass migate to an area. For example, there's another thread about lgbt issues being taught in schools. (Personally I'd rather we taught kids at primary school age to be good people rather than introduce adult themes to them but again, that's another issue.) The same people taking the moral high ground in there would be the same people in favour of mass immigration despite immigrants from the middle East being extremely intolerant of lgbt issues, with some coming from cultures which have the death penalty for being gay. Do we want to be importing intolerant cultures? Is that benefiting the country? Edited December 12, 2018 by weegienative 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsimButtHitsASix Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 3 minutes ago, Ross. said: NHS being the only difference, what is to stop the UK from imposing a similar system on economic migrants? Currently the UK Government has the right to claim back any money spent by the NHS on EU Citizens from their country of origin. If I break my leg in Spain, with my EHIC, I can get it sorted for free. The Spanish government sends the bill to the UK Government and they pay it for me. We can do the exact same thing. Why the UK Government doesn't do this, I don't know, but it's our government's choice. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weegienative Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 25 minutes ago, NotThePars said: Traditions being “boiling all our food” and “shipping troublemakers off to Australia” Traditions like being tolerant and accepting of people? Like believing in free speech? Like believing women are equal? Like believing people should have freedom live their life as they see fit, being gay/trans/bi etc. No matter how much you put the blinkers on, these are not views held by the immigrants coming here from Asia and Africa. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross. Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 1 minute ago, AsimButtHitsASix said: Currently the UK Government has the right to claim back any money spent by the NHS on EU Citizens from their country of origin. If I break my leg in Spain, with my EHIC, I can get it sorted for free. The Spanish government sends the bill to the UK Government and they pay it for me. We can do the exact same thing. Why the UK Government doesn't do this, I don't know, but it's our government's choice. Like most of the common complaints and criticisms of the EU. The UK is poorly governed, but instead of fixing things it suits some to pin the blame elsewhere. Fear of "other" is exploited and promoted by too many who make too much from the UK being as badly run as it is. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Blades Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 Can someone please put the racist to sleep? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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