Why no polls?

[ScotSquid]

21 hours ago, Colkitto said:

The elephant in the room of course is we haven't left the EU. Article 50 hasn't been triggered so basically nothing has changed.

We know things are going to change dramatically over the next couple of years. Indyref2 will happen before 2020 and they know it.  

Well no. The 'elephant in the room' is, as I said months ago, the UK leaving the EU is an utter catastrophe for Scottish Independence. 

Scotland needs barrier free trade with rUK given the enormous reliance we have on intra-UK trade. 

Being in the EU with the UK outside is absolutely dreadful. 

That's why there won't be an indyref any time soon. The SNP know this .

[Antlion]

1 minute ago, ScotSquid said:

Well no. The 'elephant in the room' is, as I said months ago, the UK leaving the EU is an utter catastrophe for Scottish Independence. 

Scotland needs barrier free trade with rUK given the enormous reliance we have on intra-UK trade. 

Being in the EU with the UK outside is absolutely dreadful. 

That's why there won't be an indyref any time soon. The SNP know this .

So essentially Brexit is a rerun of England's decision to refuse Scottish trading privileges in the early eighteenth century? It does rather paint less a friendly family of nations than an attempt to blackmail and threaten Scotland into being financially wrecked if it doesn't concede to being absorbed into a unitary state with the rUK. Charming stuff. I do wonder how the RoI will cope being inside the EU outside the UK, though.

[ScotSquid]

21 hours ago, Alan Stubbs said:

83% No in the old codger column

Anyone itching for another vote asap is off their nut. I get the logic about missing the boat with Europe but this generation of old folk aren't shifting for anything, logic doesn't come into it.

On the other side, all this "sold a trick", "end of days for the SNP" type chat from Unionists is equally as optimistic. A very small minority of Fuzzy Afro types will get impatient and mouth off but the vast majority will keep the head. 

Basically the radges on both sides agitating for this to be settled in the next two or three years are going to be frustrated.

Good post as usual.

It's only really the '45' badge kissing types that are going to be butthurt about the delay. Basically the thick leaflet distribution fodder. 

Nicola Sturgeon and the sensible Nats know this is not winnable currently. The can is just being kicked down the road. There will always be an excuse not to have one. Until it's going to win. If that's ever the case.

It's fascinating stuff really. Watching how the narrative will be spun so the gimp Glengarry wearing clown types get brought along with the thinkers so they think delaying it for years is a good idea.

Best hope for Scottish Nationalism is that the UK negotiates a brilliant Brexit deal. Ironically.

Nicola Sturgeon should be Theresa May s biggest cheerleader in the negotiations.

[ayrmad]

1 minute ago, ScotSquid said:

Good post as usual.

It's only really the '45' badge kissing types that are going to be butthurt about the delay. Basically the thick leaflet distribution fodder. 

Nicola Sturgeon and the sensible Nats know this is not winnable currently. The can is just being kicked down the road. There will always be an excuse not to have one. Until it's going to win. If that's ever the case.

It's fascinating stuff really. Watching how the narrative will be spun so the gimp Glengarry wearing clown types get brought along with the thinkers so they think delaying it for years is a good idea.

Best hope for Scottish Nationalism is that the UK negotiates a brilliant Brexit deal. Ironically.

Nicola Sturgeon should be Theresa May s biggest cheerleader in the negotiations.

I'm taking that as a compliment.

[DublinMagyar]

Well no. The 'elephant in the room' is, as I said months ago, the UK leaving the EU is an utter catastrophe for Scottish Independence. 

Scotland needs barrier free trade with rUK given the enormous reliance we have on intra-UK trade. 

Being in the EU with the UK outside is absolutely dreadful. 

That's why there won't be an indyref any time soon. The SNP know this .

Should Ireland leave the EU and then apply to join the U.K.?

[ScotSquid]

10 minutes ago, Antlion said:

So essentially Brexit is a rerun of England's decision to refuse Scottish trading privileges in the early eighteenth century? It does rather paint less a friendly family of nations than an attempt to blackmail and threaten Scotland into being financially wrecked if it doesn't concede to being absorbed into a unitary state with the rUK. Charming stuff. I do wonder how the RoI will cope being inside the EU outside the UK, though.

Err no. That's a bizarre post. No one would be being 'blackmailed' unless the EU want to 'punish' the UK which seemed to get unthinking Nats very excited as a prospect in the summer.

It would be a consequence of Scotland choosing to leave our current tariff free market with the UK in preference of joining the EU, which (should there be a hard Brexit), will have barriers to trade with the UK.

Which EU member post Indy and application to the EU for membership by iScot, will be most adversely affected by a hard Brexit? I can give you a clue if you like. 

 

[John Lambies Doos]

Selfish auld c***s

[doulikefish]

Err no. That's a bizarre post. No one would be being 'blackmailed' unless the EU want to 'punish' the UK which seemed to get unthinking Nats very excited as a prospect in the summer.

It would be a consequence of Scotland choosing to leave our current tariff free market with the UK in preference of joining the EU, which (should there be a hard Brexit), will have barriers to trade with the UK.

Which EU member post Indy and application to the EU for membership by iScot, will be most adversely affected by a hard Brexit? I can give you a clue if you like. 

 

Its ok we will buy up all the northern rock shares and make a killing [emoji6]

[hehawhehaw]

58 minutes ago, Colkitto said:

Weakening? From the actual vote in 2014 to the Yougov poll it's fallen about 0.7%  

So you agree with me. You say tomato I say tomahto. Not sure I like 2 half wits agreeing with me.

[renton]

54 minutes ago, ScotSquid said:

Good post as usual.

It's only really the '45' badge kissing types that are going to be butthurt about the delay. Basically the thick leaflet distribution fodder. 

Nicola Sturgeon and the sensible Nats know this is not winnable currently. The can is just being kicked down the road. There will always be an excuse not to have one. Until it's going to win. If that's ever the case.

It's fascinating stuff really. Watching how the narrative will be spun so the gimp Glengarry wearing clown types get brought along with the thinkers so they think delaying it for years is a good idea.

Best hope for Scottish Nationalism is that the UK negotiates a brilliant Brexit deal. Ironically.

Nicola Sturgeon should be Theresa May s biggest cheerleader in the negotiations.

[renton]

It'll be interesting, in the probable outcome of a hard as f**k Brexit, how they will keep an open border between the two Irish polities, in HB's scenario. Something they'd need to do in order to prevent all hell breaking loose.

[ayrmad]

20 minutes ago, hehawhehaw said:

So you agree with me. You say tomato I say tomahto. Not sure I like 2 half wits agreeing with me.

Of course we don't agree with you, the Yougov figure could quite easily be at the lower end of the margin of error, I know polls have been dropped to the level of Mystic Meg but if you're going to use them at least know what shite you're on about.

[Granny Danger]

22 hours ago, Alan Stubbs said:

83% No in the old codger column

Anyone itching for another vote asap is off their nut. I get the logic about missing the boat with Europe but this generation of old folk aren't shifting for anything, logic doesn't come into it.

On the other side, all this "sold a trick", "end of days for the SNP" type chat from Unionists is equally as optimistic. A very small minority of Fuzzy Afro types will get impatient and mouth off but the vast majority will keep the head. 

Basically the radges on both sides agitating for this to be settled in the next two or three years are going to be frustrated.

Do you have a link to the tables?  I have been on the YouGov site and cannot see any details.

[ayrmad]

Just now, Granny Danger said:

Do you have a link to the tables?  I have been on the YouGov site and cannot see any details.

I think that was the figure for those still living, the mild weather's a bit of a letdown right enough.

[AUFC90]

You have to laugh at the likes of Loondave masking their stench of shitty breeks with the " a referendum will never happen" patter. Yes voters are used to living in the UK, we'll just carry on regardless of a no or yes vote. If it's a no the unionist world will collapse in on itself [emoji23] pleasing.

[kevthedee]

Selfish auld c***s

Sensible auld c***s please

[Antlion]

2 hours ago, ScotSquid said:

Err no. That's a bizarre post. No one would be being 'blackmailed' unless the EU want to 'punish' the UK which seemed to get unthinking Nats very excited as a prospect in the summer.

It would be a consequence of Scotland choosing to leave our current tariff free market with the UK in preference of joining the EU, which (should there be a hard Brexit), will have barriers to trade with the UK.

Which EU member post Indy and application to the EU for membership by iScot, will be most adversely affected by a hard Brexit? I can give you a clue if you like. 

 

In what way would the UK choosing to leave the EU and rejecting its fundamental tenets be the EU "punishing" the UK? It would surely be a consequence of the UK choosing to leave the current tariff-free market with the EU in favour of establishing trade deals with "the rest of the world".

There's a concerted BritNat effort to portray the UK as some kind of trading union. It's not, and was never designed to be. It's a nation state. The EU is the trading block (with some political strings attached).

A Scottish state within the EU's trading relationship with the non-EU UK will be dependent, of course, not on whether the EU "punishes" the UK, but on what market access the UK gets (which will in turn depend on what it's willing to sacrifice - remember, the UK is the separatist here - the UK is the one negotiating access to a trading block with political strings attached, and thus deciding which strings it will let hang and which it needs to snip).

We can't actually know what kind of a relationship Scotland the nation state might have with the UK until we get some sense of what kind of relationship the UK will have with the EU. The UK itself does not seem to know. But if it looks like it wants to hit the self-destruct button, then being tied into the UK may well start to look far more damaging than establishing statehood for Scotland. After all, it won't be a case of the rUK being our "trading partners", but being the driver of our economy (which is, again, what the British Union entails).

[Lex]

Weakening? From the actual vote in 2014 to the Yougov poll it's fallen about 0.7%  

Why do you think it's fallen?

We have a Tory majority government, Brexit, an unelected Tory prime minister and austerity.

Surely this is prime time for a surge in independence support... ? Except it's not surging, it's not even staying the same, it's going backwards.

[Colkitto]

2 hours ago, ScotSquid said:

Well no. The 'elephant in the room' is, as I said months ago, the UK leaving the EU is an utter catastrophe for Scottish Independence. 

Scotland needs barrier free trade with rUK given the enormous reliance we have on intra-UK trade. 

Being in the EU with the UK outside is absolutely dreadful. 

That's why there won't be an indyref any time soon. The SNP know this .

The UK will be desperate for trade deals post Brexit. The EU will play hardball with the UK, but the UK will in the end up have to compromise.

This will lead to some kind of deal with rUK and the EU which an independent Scotland will be part of... 

[Colkitto]

3 minutes ago, Lex said:

 

Why do you think it's fallen?

We have a Tory majority government, Brexit, an unelected Tory prime minister and austerity.

Surely this is prime time for a surge in independence support... ? Except it's not surging, it's not even staying the same, it's going backwards.

 

You base everything on one poll. 

Brexit hasn't happened yet as article 50 hasn't been triggered. 

Tory majority government has only been elected a few months ago. 

Reality will bite, probably round about March next year